Some chatter on new gun bill

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August 8th, 2018, 08:37 AM
js4fn

https://nfa.ca/wp-content/uploads/20...om-Police2.pdf

RCMP ACCESS TO INFORMATION RESPONSE
428 FIREARMS LOST BY AND STOLEN FROM THE POLICE AND OTHER PUBLIC AGENCIES
RCMP ATI RESPONSE DATED: SEPTEMBER 14, 2011 RCMP FILE #: GA-3951-3-04075/11 RECEIVED SEPTEMBER 21, 2011
WORDING OF ORIGINAL ATI REQUEST SUBMITTED TO RCMP (July 10, 2011):
Please provide the most recent copies of existing reports that show the total number and types of firearms (prohibited, restricted, non-restricted) that were:
(1) lost by, missing and stolen from the RCMP;
(2) lost by, missing and stolen from other police forces;
(3) lost by, missing and stolen from other public service agencies; and (4) lost by, missing and stolen from the military.
FIREARMS LOST BY AND STOLEN FROM THE RCMP = 32
Shotgun = 9 Rifle = 4 Handgun = 18 Other = 1
FIREARMS LOST BY AND STOLEN STOLEN FROM OTHER POLICE SERVICES = 316
CN Police – Handgun = Information blacked out RNC – Handgun = Information blacked out OPP – Rifle = Information blacked out
OPP – Rifle = Information blacked out
OPP – Handgun = Information blacked out
Surete du Quebec – Handgun = Information blacked out Aboriginal Police – Rifle = 11
Aboriginal Police – Shotgun = 2
Aboriginal Police – Handgun = 3
Municipal – Shotgun = 3
Municipal – Handgun = 267
DENNIS R. YOUNG’S COMMENT: By subtracting the number of guns reported above as stolen (286) from the total (316) means that thirty(30) firearms were stolen from the OPP, Surete du Quebec, RNC and the CN Police.
RCMP EXPLAINS BLACKED OUT INFORMATION: Please note that some of the information has been exempted under Paragraphs 13(1)(c) and (d) of the Access to Information Act. Section 13(1) reads: Subject to subsection (2), the head of a government institution shall refuse to disclose any record requested under this Act that contains information that was obtained in confidence from (c) the government of a province or an institution thereof; or (d) a municipal or regional government established by or pursuant to an Act of the legislature of a province or and institution of such a government.

FIREARMS LOST BY AND STOLEN FROM OTHER PUBLIC SERVICE AGENCIES = 80
Shotgun = 22 Handgun = 41 Rifle = 17
FIREARMS LOST BY AND STOLEN FROM THE MILITARY = NOT AVAILABLE
RCMP EXPLANATION: Please note that in response to your question 4), the Canadian Firearms Program does not track military firearms as they are exempt from the regulations.
RCMP CLARIFICATION OF THE NUMBER OF GUNS STOLEN FROM POLICE: Please also note that these numbers are all firearms that have been recorded in the CFRS as lost, missing or stolen at one point in time. This means, these numbers include firearms that may no longer be lost or stolen.
August 8th, 2018, 09:12 AM
LoR

1) police don’t trace long guns
2) you have a crystal ball that allows you to categorically state they are domestic?

What’s your source?
**********

Be that as it may, which is neither here nor there.

Gun crime is something of a loose criteria. A person could be forgiven for assuming that the types of gun crimes the overwhelming majority of tax payers are concerned about are

Violent crimes in conjunction with firearms.

And the fact you can’t dance around that has nothing to do with gun cultures. Is that the majority of those are committed by

Hand guns......
which further......

which was was the point.

So of the 28% anyone can conclusively say came from A or B. And of the 14% that are known, to be from domestic sources......

And the vast majority of tax payers far more worried about armed robberies, murders, blood on the streets, and not guns found in the woods ( counted as gun crime)

......etc

Gord, if your inclined check the MTPS shooting map. It’s interesting. Some might spin that into a race debate, other like myself a debate about socioeconomic factors instead
August 8th, 2018, 09:35 AM
welsh

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoR

What’s your source?

Publicly available police reports.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoR

And for the “record” I was talking with G

This is an open forum. If you want to have a private conversation, take it to PM.

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August 8th, 2018, 09:49 AM
LoR

………………….
August 8th, 2018, 09:53 AM
LoR

G, check the map. Some have trouble with this and that.

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/cont...prise-you.html
August 8th, 2018, 09:58 AM
welsh

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoR

...yet you know the are exclusively domestic...

*Almost* exclusively, I said. While you're whinging about being quoted accurately.

Nobody in the real world disputes that. I'm not going to argue the point, any more than I'd debate the Flat Earth Society.

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August 8th, 2018, 10:07 AM
fishermccann

JB you are right about the many factors that cause someone to shoot a gun at another human being. I just don't think it is more prevalent in any particular race. It is circumstance, environment not heredity. Most members of gangs in Canada were born here, it is not an immigration problem, they are Canadian kids. Many people use the immigration argument to say,....... it's not us, it's them.
August 8th, 2018, 10:12 AM
Gilroy

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishermccann

What, are no gangs made up of those born and bred here? :scream: When they are born here, (many 3rd, 4th generations), immigration discussions are redundant. If they are Canadian , they are 'us' , therefore we cannot blame it on 'others'.... Fix the root problems, no one (race), is born 'bad'.:sad:

Agree 100% no more excuses about being disadvantaged as 1st generation,they are into 3 and 4th so essentially Canadians.Maybe we cut to much slack for them which older generations did not get Italians,Portuguese,and way back to Irish ,Scots.
August 8th, 2018, 10:25 AM
Gilroy

Quote:

Originally Posted by welsh

*Almost* exclusively, I said. While you're whinging about being quoted accurately.

Nobody in the real world disputes that. I'm not going to argue the point, any more than I'd debate the Flat Earth Society.

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Welsh,

I think you are very well read on this gun subject and you have your opinions based on your experience BUT have you ever been in an Ontario Housing Complex,lets say Jane and Finch area,Jamestown Cres,St Jamestown,Mosspark.Regent Park.

LoR, Fishermccann, and myself and probably a few others on here have actually spent years in these projects,we know the criminal mentality and the hardships that decent people face who have to live in these area,s.I really think a walking tour of Dundas Street and Sherbourne Street area would do you a World of good to widen the scope of your experience.Down there is the REAL WORLD the question is , have you ever been down in the real world?
August 8th, 2018, 10:34 AM
welsh

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilroy

I think you are very well read on this gun subject and you have your opinions based on your experience BUT have you ever been in an Ontario Housing Complex,lets say Jane and Finch area,Jamestown Cres,St Jamestown,Mosspark.Regent Park.

Care to explain how that relates to the point I made, which was concerned entirely with how police record statistics re tracing of crime guns?

Are the people in said housing complexes involved in the tracing activity? Or are they involved only in compiling the statistics? To what extent does the criminal mentality of gangbangers influence this?

Seriously. Do explain. I'll wait.

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