Bull/cow or calf?

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Originally Posted by MarkD

Well, I think you should be aware that hunting calves is more conservationally justified than hunting any adults, including bulls.
Your position seems to be more emotional rather than rational, and more suitable for those from the veggie and animal rights side.
I think if we choose to hunt then we should take a strictly conservation approach. If someone is too emotional and feels very bad killing animals (either male or female) then hunting is not an option here.
To be honest with you it is never easy for me to kill these magnificent creatures, either it to be a moose, deer, bear or ducks. But this is food for me and the family. I once told my wife: I know that I’m killing those I love. But we were born to eat meat and I made my choice and put emotions aside. After that only ethics and conservation matter.

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I think they should close the moose hunt entirely and allow the numbers to get back, but a limited bull season would at least help out the outfitters in northern Ontario.

You want to keep killing the cows and calves you will not have moose to hunt down the road, it is pretty cut and dry.

Sorry to say it but you are listed as living in Mississauga, you are not going hunting so you can eat, you are going hunting so you can kill something and then eat it.

Why not start hunting black bears, you will help out the moose population and fill your freezer with delicious meat, plus the bear population has been rising.

You can also spend a bunch of time to fill your freezer with Canada geese, if filling the freezer with wild game is key, they are cheap to shoot and easy to find in SW Ontario.

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Originally Posted by Fox

Sorry to say it but you are listed as living in Mississauga, you are not going hunting so you can eat, you are going hunting so you can kill something and then eat it.

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Well now, that’s funny right there....

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Originally Posted by dilly

Well now, that’s funny right there....

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There is a difference between sustenance hunting and hunting for sport, the vast majority hunt for sport, the meat is a bonus.

Closing the Moose Hunting for say 2 years might help it grow very quickly.

I don't think two year closure would accomplish what's needed. Based on breeding biology, you're not going to see a new breeder cohort of maternal cows for 5-6 years. Mnr somehow needs to get a handle on the native harvest as well. It's only a guess at present with no requirements for reporting. I wonder what percent of the native harvest is comprised of cows and calves?

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Originally Posted by Fenelon

I don't think two year closure would accomplish what's needed. Based on breeding biology, you're not going to see a new breeder cohort of maternal cows for 5-6 years. Mnr somehow needs to get a handle on the native harvest as well. It's only a guess at present with no requirements for reporting. I wonder what percent of the native harvest is comprised of cows and calves?

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All that we know is that there will be less cows/calves shot if the general hunting population does not hunt them.

1 year is not going to do it but killing off a chunk of the next generation of animals every year was the dumbest thing that they could have done and they did it for a long time.

Fox, Fenelon

I thought it is well known and I don’t need to repeat that it is at least supposed that about 50% of calf is going to not survive the first winter. As such, if we are allowed to remove some animals from the population it is better to remove calf than adults and at the same time to allow people to hunt and collect the money from licensing which are spent back for conservation.
Again, this strategy is well known and I expected everyone here is aware of it.
Then, if we would choose to only hunt bulls it obviously will be a disaster for the population because (do I need it to repeat as well?) for breeding there is a need for both: male and female.

Now with regards to closing all moose hunting for years in the hope of increasing population… It is also well known that the poor moose population in Ontario is not due to hunting pressure. There are some known and probably unknown reasons for that. In comparison, in Sweden and Russia the moose population right now is enormous . And it’s not declining despite very liberate hunting licensing (and poaching in Russia).
Anyway if MNR chooses not to close moose hunting season then I don’t have any ethical issues to hunt it.

Now about ethics. You say if I live in Mississauga, not up North, then I’m supposed to go to the store and buy their grossy meat and be happy. If it is your choice - I’m glad that you are happy with it. But I personally see it differently. I see it as buying meat in the store much more unethical than ethical hunting. Moose cow in the bush are not any better (ethically thinking) than beef cow in the pen. And emotionally I feel more sadness for the cattle in the stall than for freely living moose. They are all gonna die. The ethical matter is not how they die but how they live.
You think that hunting is sport and enjoyment and meat is just a bonus? I see it differently. I hunt for food and if I don’t need the meat I leave those in the wild in their peaceful world. I do not enjoy killing animals. Yes, I do enjoy hunting, but killing is the saddest part of it. It is necessity, not enjoyment.
Anyway, I didn’t want this topic to go here and I’m done with it. I appreciate everybody’s opinion but I keep mine.
Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Fenelon

I don't think two year closure would accomplish what's needed. Based on breeding biology, you're not going to see a new breeder cohort of maternal cows for 5-6 years. Mnr somehow needs to get a handle on the native harvest as well. It's only a guess at present with no requirements for reporting. I wonder what percent of the native harvest is comprised of cows and calves?

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Depends on how many additional moose they have to shoot before they get one to drop near the road so they don't have too much work to get it out.

Maybe we should look at what other provinces do, seems Quebec is quite successful at managing it's Moose Population and I think NB (Not sure don't follow as much there now)

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Originally Posted by greatwhite

Maybe we should look at what other provinces do, seems Quebec is quite successful at managing it's Moose Population and I think NB (Not sure don't follow as much there now)

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Ok, still have to come back...
If you are an OFAH member you should know that there are a lot of efforts made by OFAH, MNR and other parties to understand and manage the moose population in Ontario. So far seems like there is no solution or comprehensive understanding of the problem.
Most likely there are a number of factors, including brain worm and aboriginal hunting. Nothing could be done with it as for today’s policies.