What's wrong with our Moose herd?

It does not matter what the MNRF does If you have unlimited harvesting of cows bulls and calfs year round.
How much lower can they drop the tags example Unit 30 from 170 adult tags to 20 this year.
The MNRF hands are tied by liberal judges who allowed this to happen. If judges allows open access year round hunting, hunting at night, no harvest reporting the end result is a declining herd.
Look at every accessible caribou herd everyone is in jeopardy right now.

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Originally Posted by gibb

It does not matter what the MNRF does If you have unlimited harvesting of cows bulls and calfs year round.
How much lower can they drop the tags example Unit 30 from 170 adult tags to 20 this year.
The MNRF hands are tied by liberal judges who allowed this to happen. If judges allows open access year round hunting, hunting at night, no harvest reporting the end result is a declining herd.
Look at every accessible caribou herd everyone is in jeopardy right now.

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Bingo this is the reason why the moose herd is screwed. Anyone who honestly can not tell me this is the not the number 1 reason is dreaming.

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Originally Posted by x_xeon_x

I think it's a combination of a lot of things working against the moose as to why their populations are so low. Unregulated harvest, "regulated" harvest of cows, "regulated" harvest of calves , predation, habitat loss, habitat quality, disease etc.

If the OMNRF would step up and cut quotas for a few years, stop handing out cow and calf tags altogether and actually allow the herd to grow I don't think the problem would be as bad as it is now.

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NO , --- I don't blame it all on the unregulated harvest (by Natives) BUT it definitely is a contributing factor . --- Years ago , some native acquaintances had coaxed me to "come along" during the OFF-SEASON . They told me not to worry about it because no-one would check-up on us . --- I declined (for several reasons) ; besides , I'm not native . --- After-ward they boasted about their success . --- These people were not POOR and definitely didn't need the meat in order to survive . --- I NEVER hunted with them . --- IMO , HUNTERS and GAME-HOGS are two distinctly different species .

Unfortunately and very sadly, I think this is only the tip of the iceberg and its going to get a lot worse. As licensed hunting is one of the few things MNRF can manipulate, expect for more pressure be applied to this.

I can forsee a day in not so distant future that the MNRF will be forced to close down the regulated/licenced hunt for large parts of the province as has happened in Manitoba, and in Minnesota already. This means that only those that can participate in the unregulated/un-licenced hunt will be able to hunt moose in the future. There is no way around this happening.

We cannot really blame the MNRF for mismanaging the resource as how can they possibly manage a wildlife resource if the rules only apply to part of the population. We also cannot blame the unregulated hunters who have and want to protect their hard won treaty rights.

The whole thing is a real mess. I think everyone needs to sit at the table and agree to live by rules that apply to all, for the sake of the wildlife populations - really hope this happens.

Bingo you are starting to get it. With the Powley court decision harvest rights were extended to the Metis hunters. Kind like wolves in sheep clothing deal. Until this is resolved the herd across Canada is in doomed.
When you factor in all the other issues stressing the herd the future is bleak.
No resource can withstand the pressure being applied, unrestricted harvesting with all the modern tools at hand equal the downfall of the moose herd.

OMNRF bungling,inability to regulate and police First Nations,bunny huggers,tree huggers and gun control? Pretty soon,all those hunting shows we see on TV will be mere examples of how it USED to be.:sad:

why would the MNRF change anything as long as we are willing to send them our money they will continue to use their flawed management model that has not worked as they thought or we would have those huge moose populations they predicted 30 yrs ago

I find it kinda ironic that there is another thread dealing with a licensed moose hunter being fined $180 for not completing a mandatory hunter survey, with the MNR saying the info submitted is needed to manage the herd. Yet they, (MNR), have absolutely no idea how many moose are seen and harvested by first nations hunters. Is it just me, or is there something wrong with this picture?

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Originally Posted by delmer

Yet they, (MNR), have absolutely no idea how many moose are seen and harvested by first nations hunters. Is it just me, or is there something wrong with this picture?

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Didn't we have a Native fella on here once explain how this worked, seems to me he said that the bands work with the MNR to establish quotas;

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The sustainable harvest number for adult moose is provided by the Ministry of Natural Resources (MNR). However, Pikwàkanagàn manages their own harvest with agreements to work in conjunction with MNR to allocate the total harvest numbers. This includes participating in aerial park surveys to gather information to assist in our sustainable system of harvest.

http://www.algonquinsofpikwakanagan....moose_deer.php

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Didn't we have a Native fella on here once explain how this worked, seems to me he said that the bands work with the MNR to establish quotas;

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That band hunts within Algonquin Park (which is off limits to everyone else), and the area adjacent to it. I'm curious to know what goes on in the area of the province north of North Bay. Saying that they will "work in conjunction with the MNR" doesn't lead me to believe they use a system similar to the reporting survey others use.