Savage 303 ammo

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Originally Posted by Gerald

Would it not be simpler to make them out of 30-30?

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Easier but dangerous. The .30-30 has a thinner rim, so you could never achieve proper headspace. That is why people use .30-40 Krag more than any other. followed by .303 British. Both require a lot of case work to get the rim correct.

The last .303 Savage ammo was made about 5 years ago by Hornady. 150-grain only. It shot poorly in my .303.

I usually load lever cartridges about six times and then discard. If your rifle will allow you to just neck size, you can load a lot of times.

Additionally, there is no evidence that the RIFLES were evr .311' bore, just that the ammo was loaded with .311' bullets. Apparently the Savage gurus of the time thought the tighter fit would help accuracy. This came to me from the website master at Savage99.com

Thanks for the info KC. I had not considered the rim thickness.

Checking with Cartridges Of The World, the 30-30 and the 303 savage both have the same rim thickness, that being .063 so it would seem that would not make for a head space problem.

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Originally Posted by Gerald

Checking with Cartridges Of The World, the 30-30 and the 303 savage both have the same rim thickness, that being .063 so it would seem that would not make for a head space problem.

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I can no longer trust my memory!

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Originally Posted by Kilo Charlie

Additionally, there is no evidence that the RIFLES were evr .311' bore, just that the ammo was loaded with .311' bullets. Apparently the Savage gurus of the time thought the tighter fit would help accuracy. This came to me from the website master at Savage99.com

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Hi Kilo Charlie, My information on the .303 Savage originally having a .311 bore came from a forum posting back in 2002. The reference used to confirm this was the case - Legendary Sporting Rifles, by Sam Fadala in the chapter on the Savage 99.

I'm not sure I would want to run a .311 bullet down a .308 bore, it's not recommended, at least for jacketed bullet. They suggest that you not exceed the bore diameter by more than .001, with cast bullet you can get away with .004 over bore diameter. The other thing would be chamber throat tolerance, I have a 30-30 that has real trouble accepting a bullet much over .308 in diameter. Having said all this the Germans in WW II converted their older .318 Mauser to shoot the newer .323 spitzer bullet by enlarging the throat of the chamber. The spitzer slug had a short bearing wall, so had little affect on chamber pressures. However it's not recommended if you have one these old guns that you try the same trick with modern hunting slugs with longer bearing walls. So I definitely would attempt to push a .311 diameter 190 grain jacket hunting slug down a .308 bore, you might end up with a bit more pressure than you bargain for.

You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut

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Originally Posted by Kilo Charlie

Additionally, there is no evidence that the RIFLES were evr .311' bore, just that the ammo was loaded with .311' bullets. Apparently the Savage gurus of the time thought the tighter fit would help accuracy. This came to me from the website master at Savage99.com

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I agree here, never heard of one being .311, but you can push a lead buckshot through the bore to slug it and see what your bore actually is, might be slightly larger than original, might be much larger. Lead cast and sized to fit would work. I would not shoot anything cast larger unless you know exactly what you have, a tighter fit in the bore can spike the pressure very fast and turn your gun into a bomb.

Found this on 24 Hour Campfire; why you cant use .30-30 to make .303 Savage. I was close but no cigar, LOL!

1) The 30-30 brass is narrower at the base, which means it's going to expand by .02" when you fire it risking case failure.
2) The 30-30 brass is .02" longer, meaning that if it even chambers it very likely will be up against the rifling and could crimp the bullet in raising pressures.

Even if resized, the .02" difference at the base would keep me from EVER using 30-30 brass in a 303 Savage rifle. It's just not worth the chance of serious case failures.

30-30:

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...winchester.jpg


303 Savage:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...303_Savage.gif

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Originally Posted by Kilo Charlie

Found this on 24 Hour Campfire; why you cant use .30-30 to make .303 Savage. I was close but no cigar, LOL!

1) wheThe 30-30 brass is narrower at the base, which means it's going to expand by .02"n you fire it risking case failure.
2) The 30-30 brass is .02" longer, meaning that if it even chambers it very likely will be up against the rifling and could crimp the bullet in raising pressures.

Even if resized, the .02" difference at the base would keep me from EVER using 30-30 brass in a 303 Savage rifle. It's just not worth the chance of serious case failures.

30-30:

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c2...winchester.jpg


303 Savage:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...303_Savage.gif

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.442 minus .422 is . 20 thou. not .02 thou. , a very dangerous and significant difference in the dia. of the base.

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Originally Posted by jaycee

.442 minus .422 is . 20 thou. not .02 thou. , a very dangerous and significant difference in the dia. of the base.

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Anneal the whole case and try blowing it out ( I use about 5 grains of Unique topped with a bit of Kleenex, fill the remainder of the case with cream of wheat and seal the case mouth with a wax plug, the case should fire form to the .303 Savage chamber. If that doesn't fully form it to the bottom of the shoulders. Then loaded it with a light charge (5 grains of Unique) and use a pellet of buckshot to create some back pressure, that should complete the full expansion of the shoulders. If I were doing I would probably use a light cast bullet instead of a buckshot. Always check the bore to ensure its clear after each firing. I've used the method to expand 7.62 x 54 R brass to the size of 43 Mauser chamber, so I know there is a lot of stretch to the brass.

You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut