September 2, 1859 - an event in history, that could happen again.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

For me it will likely be a "VERY" long walk home.

By a very long walk I means months if not close to a year. The whole time never knowing if my family is alive or dead.
1) I will not be in a good mood.
2) I doubt I "WILL SUFFER FOOLS" well.
3) I would have little idea were to find
my family or were( If ) they are
buried.

Imagine driving thru California or somewhere in the south west, and then having to Walk not only back to Canada but avoiding trouble along the way.

There are a lot of small minded Radical people out there. With the breakdown of civilization as we know it, every little group that can control a piece of ground will be it's own Thiefdom.

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When TSHF the preparations made and available would vary so much! In an hours drive you can have 2 days walking or almost of day on a bicycle **Note... If you have 10 minutes or less then it is just throw stuff like phones, chargers etc. in a Faraday box and start filling water containers, in winter turn up the heat and call people to set plans. Then unplug and turn off the house a few minutes before.
https://todayshomeowner.com/how-to-p...-solar-storms/
If you have time to go grocery shopping, get gas, propane, wood and other preparations you could also get some chicken screen and put some blankets on a car and protect them from touching, you can wrap your fridge etc. (* See above for details, fried electronics is just junk) and buy things like sleeping bags, restock medications, survival items etc. and to up your odds help the neighbour, gather family, head out of town....


** Note: Even a backpack on a bike can carry alot and cover good distance also there are options like https://www.aosom.ca/item/aosom-cycl...B4-0008-3.html

When prepping for medical supplies most don't take into account the different antibiotics that would be life saving in grid scenario, where do you go to Penicillin when it is not produced/delivered or manufactured anymore (or that production has stopped).

It is not like you can go into doctors office and say, can I have a years worth of Amoxicillin..they just wont give it to you, so how do deal with infections, that will rise as a result of sanitary conditions.

The US Market has figured this out by bypassing the human consumption factor and have started producing FISH antibiotics for sale in bottles of 100 pills for the 10 most common "cillins" These are made by the same factories (like Smith - Glaxon), have the same pill codes, same colors and identifying marks. The only exception is one bottle is marked "not for human consumption", and it is 10X cheaper on the private market.

Yes you can order from the states to Canada for these items - no duty or restrictions.

DHS did a 10 yr study of the 100 most common drugs and gauged the effectiveness along the 10 years - study released in 2018. The standard for meeting the criteria was 95% effective strength after expiry date. Most if all medications lasted 4 yrs before they lost 5% effective strength (which not a factor) many of the cillins lasted 6+ years, most least effective was over the counter pills Tylenol and Ibuprofen <24months past expiry dates.

Food for thought.

The question is, Mark......how much toilet paper have you got stockpiled ??

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Originally Posted by line052

When prepping for medical supplies most don't take into account the different antibiotics that would be life saving in grid scenario, where do you go to Penicillin when it is not produced/delivered or manufactured anymore (or that production has stopped).

It is not like you can go into doctors office and say, can I have a years worth of Amoxicillin..they just wont give it to you, so how do deal with infections, that will rise as a result of sanitary conditions.

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Go to a few different travel clinics and and tell them you travelling to Africa, Asia or S. America. They will give you a script for Cipro which also has a reasonably long shelf life and is broad spectrum. I have enough Cipro from different trips to treat 6 or 7 acute bacterial infections.

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Originally Posted by line052

I am a prepper. If you don't understand what that is, or how the Carrington Event of 1859 would affect the North America (NA) today, then you should understand a grid down scenario.

What are the chances of Event 1% of 1% chance, however, if it does happen, virtually overnight NA would be in the 1800's. The impacts to a grid down scenario are well documented by Department of Home Land Security and the report issued in 2008 details the impacts on critical infrastructure, electrical grids, 3 day delivery supply chain. It started the prepper movement.

One only needs to look at how events are unfolding in anticipation of Hurricane Dorion and the stripping of shelves in Florida . Many do not understand the impacts of a grid down NA wide electrical outage, nor do they understand that it will 12-18 months before it will fixed. 31 major electrical Substations across NA will be out and the parts required to repair just these stations alone require 12 months to built in Southern Asia, let alone trying to ship those across the ocean, and transport across land for rebuilding.

If you think the government of USA or Canada will be setting up aid stations - think again, both armies don't have EMP hardened vehicles or planes to aid the civilian populations.

Further - if you read into the DHS scenario's the is a timeline to civil breakdown:

- 1-3 days - intial realization - no more food delivery
.....most only have 3-5 days of food on hand
- 1 week - food riots - civil breakdown - with no police or fire service - 85% of all vehicles will no longer function properly, if this event occurs during rush hour - all road systems will be clogged in cities
- 1 week hospital and back up power (if still works) will run out of fuel
- 3-7 all water and sewer functions cease - hi rise building start to empty as conditions become unliveable
- 2 weeks - peoples medications will run out, those dependant of medical devices will die - jails will release inmates - community militias will form - local regulators will form to protect communities
- 2 weeks - cities will empty and move to rural areas in search of food, water, shelter and safety from the mobs.
- 4 weeks - first deaths start to occur with dysentery, starvation, water and hygiene issues - the weak and children will start die off first
- 3-6 months 30% of population in NA will be dead
- 6-12 - 90% of NA population will be dead

One should not panic or see only doom and gloom, should one prepare for 1% of 1% chance - I don't know, however if don't, you be part of looters and mobs - if you do - you will be the target of the mobs. There is no easy solution, however - if you live in a city - your risk potential goes up exponentially . Even if you shelter in place with a years worth of food and water, it is only matter of time before your discovered and the mob comes for your resources.

Your best bet - is move to the country - learn to grow as much as you can - learn to become self sufficient as possible - seed save - learn about solar, water and wind power, animal husbandry, garden, preserving. Or get lots of guns and ammo - but odds are you wont last long that way.

Anyways my two cents.

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this is awesome. makes me want to purchase land even more than i already do now LOL.

i always ask what people would do if this happens. their first answer is almost always " go to bass pro and take some weapons" good luck with that one LOL.

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Originally Posted by Bowjob

this is awesome. makes me want to purchase land even more than i already do now LOL.

i always ask what people would do if this happens. their first answer is almost always " go to bass pro and take some weapons" good luck with that one LOL.

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Yep.... I am sure the police, military etc. will just allow that .... NOT! Food, gear, tents etc. those you MAY get handed out to you but knives, bows, firearms, bear spray etc. not happening! The police and military care about themselves and their families too and politicians will move a mountain to protect their tailends so there will be a vault welded shut or gear destroyed or relocated for public safety ... So NOPE, not happening!

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Originally Posted by mosquito

The police and military care about themselves and their families too and politicians will move a mountain to protect their tailends so there will be a vault welded shut or gear destroyed or relocated for public safety ... So NOPE, not happening!

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In a true SHTF scenario, the police won't be a factor for very long. They'll be doing what most others will be, looking after their own families. And the ones who were to remain on duty, most likely wouldn't be able to control the masses? The military here in Canada would be a non issue. Not enough of them and too few resources. As Line 052 has posted, things would get ugly real fast.

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Originally Posted by Bushmoose

In a true SHTF scenario, the police won't be a factor for very long. They'll be doing what most others will be, looking after their own families. And the ones who were to remain on duty, most likely wouldn't be able to control the masses? The military here in Canada would be a non issue. Not enough of them and too few resources. As Line 052 has posted, things would get ugly real fast.

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Very fast, but in the first couple days there will be some resemblance of hope and working together, it only takes a handful to secure/hide/destroy the big targets like BassPro and if that fails the fight over what is there won't be pretty too. The group that secures that lump of firearms, knives, gear etc. if they work together would be like a small feudal army. The small shops would be the ones to seek out and help but they would also quickly be small armies onto themselves and where they went would be intimidating to all but the suicidal and super desperate. Forming a group and moving somewhere where you could get water, fish/food and fuel as a group would make a big target but the intimidation factor should keep it mostly safe. Once you got there a defence a few solar motion lights at night around the perimeter of any camp.. a few people fishing, a bicycle generator... the old stone soup story essentially may work quite well. If that group wanted to relocate too imagine 10 or 20 adults armed pushing wheel barrows or small trailers of gear heading up to Simcoe or Midland, a bit if intimidation. In the stores, alot of gear would get left at the start BUT for firearms what they couldn't carry would get busted real fast I bet, take out firing pin or bolt and leave the rest in the rack or simply take one round, shove something down the barrel, walk away pull string boom/broken firearm. In a fight you are actually better off with a hockey stick or baseball bat than using a Ruger 22 with no firing pin.... other than the intimidation. People in the past moved huge loads by hand and a backpack can carry a fair bit but imagine what a yoke with two adults could carry using a canoe and canoe carrier wheel sets or small boats/trailers and taking turns ... a group would also be less likely to fight another group and more likely to cooperate if they feel confident ... it is the drug dealers, gangs etc. who will run really wild likely.... anyway, there are lots of scenarios and levels of cooperation, many will come together, there will be those trying to rebuild the grid while others run completely mad dog rabid... ugly alright. Skills, equipment, the weather, severity of the event (One hemisphere or world wide..).... lots of movie and book material ONLY hopefully.

350 Costco rolls

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Originally Posted by 73hunter

The question is, Mark......how much toilet paper have you got stockpiled ??

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The group mentality is the best option, and to have within your group special skills, medical, mechanical, homesteaders, electrical, police and military. Secondary bug out locations for group gathering or a homesteader who accepts people into this clan, for defence, labour and security is ideal. However, you need to plan for that group and resources needed to support them long term.

Even a shelter in place plan (city) will eventually be compromised within cities, it is proven once resources are found and initial contact is made, during that contact and your refusal to allow people to check your home out is the first time you will be exposed. Further starvation and desperation will bring those identified resources/targets back into view, your first defence of that location will only make taking it more important. You will be eventually burned out or overrun, it is inevitable.

So there really is no right solution, the mobs will eventually make it out to the country to repeat that process with those still able and capable.