New bait rules

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Originally Posted by werner.reiche

Upstream of all this, what problem was the MNR trying to solve with these changes?

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introduction of more invasive species and a worthy goal in my opinion, just not well thought out considering the confusing scenarios mentioned here

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Originally Posted by FishHog

introduction of more invasive species and a worthy goal in my opinion, just not well thought out considering the confusing scenarios mentioned here

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That's where I am lost on this. Buying bait is more likely to introduce invasive species than catching minnows in a lake and using them for bait.
If this is the problem, the attempt at solving it will make it worse. Not very well thought through.

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Originally Posted by werner.reiche

That's where I am lost on this. Buying bait is more likely to introduce invasive species than catching minnows in a lake and using them for bait.
If this is the problem, the attempt at solving it will make it worse. Not very well thought through.

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The biologists come up with their concept to deal with the threat and pass the can of worms (excuse the pun) to their legal department to write it up and make it happen. I wonder if the enforcement division was ever consulted?

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Originally Posted by werner.reiche

That's where I am lost on this. Buying bait is more likely to introduce invasive species than catching minnows in a lake and using them for bait.
If this is the problem, the attempt at solving it will make it worse. Not very well thought through.

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The commercial bait industry is quite regulated. They can only resell certain types of bait and can only transport it in certain areas. Way easier to control a few bait suppliers than individual anglers.

Although I agree, you should be able to catch and use bait in the same body of water.

I bet after a year of trying to enforce this Ontario just goes the way of Quebec. No minnows...live or dead. I hope not but that makes it enforceable.

Back in 2014 the revenue was:

"1200 commercial bait fishing licences are issued annually, with $17 million in direct sales of live bait."

http://www.ontarioriversalliance.ca/...tario-economy/

Is it being replaced by the artificial bait industry? I would like to believe that live bait is a lot more environmentally friendly than pieces of silicone plastic and rubber laying at the bottom of our lakes and rivers. I wonder if Quebec ever considered that negative aspect of the legislation.

I sent a list of scenarios to MNR Enforcement for feedback on how they will get enforced (including the question if you can use an other angler's home caught bait when you fish with them in a bmz that isn't your primary residence). I'll post it as soon as I hear back. I heard back from enforcement regarding commercial bait from Lake Simcoe (southern BMZ) being sold by stores in the central BMZ. I thought this would be a blatant offence with it crossing zones, but apparently this is legal if the Simcoe emeralds have been VHS tested. I wonder how that works? Is it the resposibility of the store owner to verify that it's "certified" VHS tested bait before it enters a new bmz ? Does the commercial harvester have to arrange to get it tested before they can sell to different BMZs? Here's a good one for a laugh. I paid $10 for bait and now I've gone and lost my wallet that had the receipt in it. I now have a cooler of nice healthy shiners downstairs that I cannot use because I have no receipt. This pisses me off more than the $150 it's going to cost me to replace all my lost ID! Another corker - the bait I bought contained one large adult hornyhead chub, a species that is absent from many of the Zone 15 lakes I fish. This mandatory commercial bait is just going to accelerate "bait bucket intros" of new species into lake ecosytems, thereby degrading the existing fishery (Werner's previous comment is dead-on).

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Originally Posted by Fenelon

I sent a list of scenarios to MNR Enforcement for feedback on how they will get enforced (including the question if you can use an other angler's home caught bait when you fish with them in a bmz that isn't your primary residence). I'll post it as soon as I hear back. I heard back from enforcement regarding commercial bait from Lake Simcoe (southern BMZ) being sold by stores in the central BMZ. I thought this would be a blatant offence with it crossing zones, but apparently this is legal if the Simcoe emeralds have been VHS tested. I wonder how that works? Is it the resposibility of the store owner to verify that it's "certified" VHS tested bait before it enters a new bmz ? Does the commercial harvester have to arrange to get it tested before they can sell to different BMZs? Here's a good one for a laugh. I paid $10 for bait and now I've gone and lost my wallet that had the receipt in it. I now have a cooler of nice healthy shiners downstairs that I cannot use because I have no receipt. This pisses me off more than the $150 it's going to cost me to replace all my lost ID! Another corker - the bait I bought contained one large adult hornyhead chub, a species that is absent from many of the Zone 15 lakes I fish. This mandatory commercial bait is just going to accelerate "bait bucket intros" of new species into lake ecosytems, thereby degrading the existing fishery (Werner's previous comment is dead-on).

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I’m sure you are aware that we cannot dump bait bucket contents into a water body. I’m sure they are counting on compliance to eliminate that issue.

Fenelon, in theory one could use the minnows in their own BMZ saying they trapped them. Albeit that circumvents the fact they were bought elsewhere and the purpose of the rules in the first place.
Another scenario is catching minnows in say FMZ 16 for use on Georgian bay. You cannot drive overland with the minnows up to the French through Central BMZ but you could boat with them up there as all Zones are adjacent to Georgian. Supposedly though you wouldn’t be able to take them out of the boat once you get there. That’s an an extreme example but could play out for those fishing Georgian near border of two BMZ.

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Originally Posted by Fenelon

I sent a list of scenarios to MNR Enforcement for feedback on how they will get enforced (including the question if you can use an other angler's home caught bait when you fish with them in a bmz that isn't your primary residence). I'll post it as soon as I hear back. I heard back from enforcement regarding commercial bait from Lake Simcoe (southern BMZ) being sold by stores in the central BMZ. I thought this would be a blatant offence with it crossing zones, but apparently this is legal if the Simcoe emeralds have been VHS tested. I wonder how that works? Is it the resposibility of the store owner to verify that it's "certified" VHS tested bait before it enters a new bmz ? Does the commercial harvester have to arrange to get it tested before they can sell to different BMZs? Here's a good one for a laugh. I paid $10 for bait and now I've gone and lost my wallet that had the receipt in it. I now have a cooler of nice healthy shiners downstairs that I cannot use because I have no receipt. This pisses me off more than the $150 it's going to cost me to replace all my lost ID! Another corker - the bait I bought contained one large adult hornyhead chub, a species that is absent from many of the Zone 15 lakes I fish. This mandatory commercial bait is just going to accelerate "bait bucket intros" of new species into lake ecosytems, thereby degrading the existing fishery (Werner's previous comment is dead-on).

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Hi,
@ Fenelon - I was wondering if you heard anything back from MNR Enforcement, interested to know especially your question in the brackets " if you can use an other angler's home caught bait when you fish with them in a bmz that isn't your primary residence"
@all fellow members of he board -Did any of you get questioned by MNR regarding the source of your livebait ?
Thank you