Buying a new moose gun

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Originally Posted by Woodsman

I don't know how anyone can recommend a 30-30 as a good moose caliber out to 150.
IMO at 150 the 30-30 is marginal even on deer.
The 25-06 is a far superior round than the 30-30 and even then I wouldn't recommend it as an ideal moose round.
I take my 25-06 as a back up but use my 30-06 as a primary moose round.
The 30 -30 is far behind the 25-06 in retained energy.

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Marginal on deer? You have got to be kidding me, I guess they built up a pile of armor over the years.

The 30-30 kills tons of deer every single year and a pile of moose too, put a good bullet in front of the powder and you have a cartridge that is proven, not just talked about but proven to kill a lot of animals every single year.

Hornady 160 FTX, >1600 ft lbs of energy at 100 yards and >1300 ft lbs of energy at 200 yards.

303 British, probably shot more moose in Canada then any other cartridge, Hornady 150gr SP, >1900ft lbs at 100 yards and >1600 ft lbs at 200 yards.

308 WIn, Hornady 150gr, 2100 ft lbs at 100 yards, 1700 ft lbs at 200 yards.

I guess that makes the 303 Brit and 308 Win borderline for deer as well at 150 yards.

[QUOTE=Woodsman;1024248]I don't know how anyone can recommend a 30-30 as a good moose caliber out to 150.
IMO at 150 the 30-30 is marginal even on deer.
The 25-06 is a far superior round than the 30-30 and even then I wouldn't recommend it as an ideal moose round.
I take my 25-06 as a back up but use my 30-06 as a primary moose round.
The 30 -30 is far behind the 25-06 in retained energy.[/QUOTE]


I know of 3 hunters, that use only 30/30's for all their hunting, they get their moose, bear and deer, but as I said they are hunters.
I have no idea where yo got your information from regarding the 30/30 "marginal on deer " , but wake up to facts, it has been published by many writers in the know, that there have been more deer killed by 30/30's than any other caliber, it has been around for ages.
There is absolutely no deer or moose that will live when a 30 cal. bullet is placed through the lung heart area "vitals ".

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.ph...t_detail&p=222

Buffalo Bore has a 190 grain .30-30 round which depending on your muzzle velocity (easy enough to find out on a chronograph) will enable you to have enough energy to kill a moose within 150 yards.

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Originally Posted by Dythbringer

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.ph...t_detail&p=222

Buffalo Bore has a 190 grain .30-30 round which depending on your muzzle velocity (easy enough to find out on a chronograph) will enable you to have enough energy to kill a moose within 150 yards.

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Can you buy that stuff here? Insane price tag on it though, and not really needed when you look at all the moose killed with 150 and 170gr FP :).

That FTX stuff is just awesome though, I have a Win 94 and my wife has a bolt 30-30, she wanted something she could use for deer and moose in the event we go for moose at some point in time, that stuff shoots lights out and with the extra energy held will do great things on a moose no doubt.

Look at the retained energy levels for a 30-30 and yes at 150 yards it's marginal for deer.
Has it taken many deer? Yes. But I've seen it also injure many. Fox on moose it's not even a close match at 150 yards. That was your suggestion for a moose round at 150 yards.

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Originally Posted by jaycee

I know of 3 hunters, that use only 30/30's for all their hunting, they get their moose, bear and deer, but as I said they are hunters.
I have no idea where yo got your information from regarding the 30/30 "marginal on deer " , but wake up to facts, it has been published by many writers in the know, that there have been more deer killed by 30/30's than any other caliber, it has been around for ages.
There is absolutely no deer or moose that will live when a 30 cal. bullet is placed through the lung heart area "vitals ".

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So jaycee are you saying that you would recommend the 30-30 as an ideal round for a purchase intended for moose at 150 yards or even deer at that range? That was the OP's question.
The 30-30 has has taken many deer but isn't a good choice if 150 yards is your target range. It's lack of retained energy and non-flat trajectory make it better suited to closer range.

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Originally Posted by Woodsman

Look at the retained energy levels for a 30-30 and yes at 150 yards it's marginal for deer.
Has it taken many deer? Yes. But I've seen it also injure many. Fox on moose it's not even a close match at 150 yards. That was your suggestion for a moose round at 150 yards.

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1500 ft lbs is marginal for deer?

The FTX bullet has removed a lot of the loses from the poor BC of the 30-30 round, it is very deadly and a lot better now that the pointed bullet is in use.

Within 150 yards he can use pretty much any non-magnum 30 cal and kill a moose, a 300 Win Mag, 300 WSM, 338 Mag, they are all well overkill at 150 yards, they are designed for long range. At 500 yards fine but at 150 yards a 30-30 with the right ammo is deadly on moose, so is the 308 Win, 30-06, 303 Brit, 7.62x54R, 30-40 Krag, etc.

I have seen a bunch of deer injured with a 308, 30-06 and 270, they must be marginal on deer.

Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement, a 50 BMG to the back ham is not a kill shot, it is not the guns fault.

Just so I have shown my work here is the link to the Hornady ammo.

3in high at 100 yards, dead on at 200 yards, 12in low at 300 yards

Energy

Muzzle = 2046, 100 yards = 1643, 200 yards=1304, 300 yards=1025

http://www.hornady.com/store/30-30-W...EVERevolution/

Based on all the numbers of minimum for deer, 1000ft lbs, you are looking at a maximum range just over 300 yards for deer. 1500 ft lbs is considered the minimum for moose which would put it right around the 150 yard mark as a moose cartridge.

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Originally Posted by Woodsman

So jaycee are you saying that you would recommend the 30-30 as an ideal round for a purchase intended for moose at 150 yards or even deer at that range? That was the OP's question.
The 30-30 has has taken many deer but isn't a good choice if 150 yards is your target range. It's lack of retained energy and non-flat trajectory make it better suited to closer range.

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This is what the OP asked ;

Here's what I'm using it for:
shots out to 150 yards
each day is about a 7mile hike up a mountain and back
rain, snow, sleet, cold doesn't matter we hunt sun up to sun down

Out to 150 yards, I would and have used one successfully.
There are hunters that use . 222 cal. for deer, where legal, and they kill them dead, but that cal. is definitely not for moose.
Hunters, use whatever they have and are familiar with, yet again shooters always think they need something bigger as they are unsure of their ability.

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Originally Posted by Fox

Can you buy that stuff here? Insane price tag on it though, and not really needed when you look at all the moose killed with 150 and 170gr FP :).

That FTX stuff is just awesome though, I have a Win 94 and my wife has a bolt 30-30, she wanted something she could use for deer and moose in the event we go for moose at some point in time, that stuff shoots lights out and with the extra energy held will do great things on a moose no doubt.

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To be honest, I don't know if you can buy it here in Canada. I just did a bit of a search and found that there is a company which packed a heavier round in 30-30 than 170 grain. I am sure something could be worked out though.

I will be honest, I wouldn't feel comfortable with using a 30-30 for moose but that doesn't mean I think a 30-30 isn't capable of killing a moose. Using a round which has more energy at longer ranges lets you have better options in the field. Is energy the be all and end all of moose killing? No. Bowhunters don't get the KE which gun hunters get (they are more worried about momentum, which is important for penetration, anyways).

The reading I have done indicates the momentum required to kill a moose is around 25 slug feet/second for vital shots from bowhunting forums which I have read. At 150 yards, a 170 grain 30-30 bullet has 1755 fps which gives a momentum of 43 slug feet/second which should be enough to penetrate a moose and kill it if you go for lung shots.

Swedish hunters successfully use a 6.5x55 Mauser for their round of choice and a 156 grain traveling at 2203 fps has a momentum of 49 slug feet/second. They are successful with moose, despite having a much smaller diameter bullet.

Dyth

I saw Buffalo Bore ammo online at Wolverine or wholesale sports I cant remember and I cant check those sites from work as we get blocked because of " Weapons" LOL. It was one of the sponsors on gunnutz for sure. Was thinking of trying some in my 45-70 but haven't ordered any yet.