Shortening Up a Big Running Bird dog

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Originally Posted by terrym

If my dog is within whistle range and not responding to it "and not working a bird" I have no issue giving him a tap. He knows damn well what the whistle means. I would never tap him if he is out of sight though. He is quite predictable when he catches scent so I'm comfortable making the distinction. His pace changes and his head drops before he locks up on point. He wears the collar every time he leaves the house but very rarely needs a correction anymore. As for range I have no problem with him "Zamboning" a field. It's what I pay him to do. In tight woodcock & grouse cover he is never out of beeper range so if he goes on point I hear him. In open fields he seems to limit himself to 200 yds before checking in and I like that pace.

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Excellent post.


( I'm 70 next year Waftrudnir and started training bird dogs in 1997 .
Eventually used the book "Point! " by Horace Lyttle in 2000. Would use it again to day.)

Thank you kindly everyone! That is very considerate of you.
Yes, an e-collar can be used to reinforce the well known commands that are disregarded, be they recall under testy situations such as being lured by a playful coyote in season, or a total disregard for directional requests. When, how, and where are something you must be very sure about.

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Originally Posted by terrym

Do you guys not need to have your flushing dogs always within gun range?

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My lab is used for upland as much as she's used for waterfowl.

When out doing training, I started out using a check cord, and would employ it with the words "Hunt Close"....she would then understand that I wanted her no further than about 20M out front. Typically she now works in the 20-30M range, but at a quick whistle, she stops, and looks to me...if I say close...she then closes the gap a bit....this helps when she starts getting "birdy".

Bluebulldog, that sounds practical because I find there's nothing better than a flusher on ditch parrots. Verbals are not something I use a lot of especially when grouse hunting as these twitchy birds will make a hasty exit before your dog gets 1/2 a chance.
Flushers are my favourite pheasant dogs when trained correctly. Even my flushers are handled VERY quietly. Some pheasants put their escape in overdrive when they hear you coming which by-the-way, your dog can detect. This makes the dog increase his/her pace and range which makes you caution the dog verbally, etc. etc. I'm sure you understand.
This is a good example of where I might use an e-collar on a flusher that starts to unravel because I don't want to increase the pheasant's odds by speaking. That's just me and how I hunt. I don't like bells, or beepers that go every 10 or so seconds. I don't like verbally handling my dog unless it is a last resort and I never use a whistle. In fact, with my many years of hunting, I have accumulated an unpalatable inner response - makes my hair go up on my neck. If you are using your whistle, your dog is making a mistake.
How many times do you want to condone this mistake?
Answer: Every time you blow the whistle.
In time, you find yourself blowing the whistle rather frequently. Hence, the hair standing up on my neck. :)

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Originally Posted by Ugo

Bluebulldog, that sounds practical because I find there's nothing better than a flusher on ditch parrots. Verbals are not something I use a lot of especially when grouse hunting as these twitchy birds will make a hasty exit before your dog gets 1/2 a chance.
Flushers are my favourite pheasant dogs when trained correctly. Even my flushers are handled VERY quietly. Some pheasants put their escape in overdrive when they hear you coming which by-the-way, your dog can detect. This makes the dog increase his/her pace and range which makes you caution the dog verbally, etc. etc. I'm sure you understand.
This is a good example of where I might use an e-collar on a flusher that starts to unravel because I don't want to increase the pheasant's odds by speaking. That's just me and how I hunt. I don't like bells, or beepers that go every 10 or so seconds. I don't like verbally handling my dog unless it is a last resort and I never use a whistle. In fact, with my many years of hunting, I have accumulated an unpalatable inner response - makes my hair go up on my neck. If you are using your whistle, your dog is making a mistake.
How many times do you want to condone this mistake?
Answer: Every time you blow the whistle.
In time, you find yourself blowing the whistle rather frequently. Hence, the hair standing up on my neck. :)

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Actually Ugo...I don't whistle with her, I use a sharp hiss through my teeth, and hand signals when out in the field. One sharp hiss, and two for her to close the gap, but it's much harder to describe...LOL. Come out hunting with us...You'll see what I mean.

It was primarily check cord and verbals when starting out....but she hunts well now, I really don't need to say much at all. If she hears my boots stop moving, she usually stops, and looks at me for instruction.

NOTHING....in this world beats hunting over a good dog.

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Originally Posted by Bluebulldog

NOTHING....in this world beats hunting over a good dog.

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Can't wait for summer to be over so we can get back to it.

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Originally Posted by Ugo

Bluebulldog, that sounds practical because I find there's nothing better than a flusher on ditch parrots. Verbals are not something I use a lot of especially when grouse hunting as these twitchy birds will make a hasty exit before your dog gets 1/2 a chance.
Flushers are my favourite pheasant dogs when trained correctly. Even my flushers are handled VERY quietly. Some pheasants put their escape in overdrive when they hear you coming which by-the-way, your dog can detect. This makes the dog increase his/her pace and range which makes you caution the dog verbally, etc. etc. I'm sure you understand.
This is a good example of where I might use an e-collar on a flusher that starts to unravel because I don't want to increase the pheasant's odds by speaking. That's just me and how I hunt. I don't like bells, or beepers that go every 10 or so seconds. I don't like verbally handling my dog unless it is a last resort and I never use a whistle. In fact, with my many years of hunting, I have accumulated an unpalatable inner response - makes my hair go up on my neck. If you are using your whistle, your dog is making a mistake.
How many times do you want to condone this mistake?
Answer: Every time you blow the whistle.
In time, you find yourself blowing the whistle rather frequently. Hence, the hair standing up on my neck. :)

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Like hearing the way others hunt. For me its a totally opposite way. Love listening to the bell on my dog its tempo tells me exactly what they are doing especially when I intermittently loose sight of them in the woodcock bush. Like the contact I have with them as I don't feel their making a mistake just working the way I want at that time. Either way I guess if your dog is responding to your commands and working the way you like then too you got a well trained partner.

What I like is to hunt my dog with a bell and my ecollar has a beeper. I set the collar to beep only on point so unless he's on a bird then no irritating beeping sound. We went through a few bells as he's tough on them but Tim Tufts was selling good ones a couple years ago and unless I lose it my guess it will last as long as the dog will. I actually like the sound of the bell while he hunts.

I like hearing the whistle of the wind, the sound of the leaves rustling, song birds chirping, crows, frogs, a river rushing on it's merry way.
Whistles, beepers, and hacking poison's the experience for me. Again, just my take aside from the increased productivity it provides on wild birds. Silence is truly golden!
That said, if you are enjoying yourself, don't change a thing!

I hunt my dog especially on grouse with the collar on beeper mode only. I think it makes a difference With not spooking birds off in the distance. With woodcock I don't think it matters.