US v/s Them... (us?)

DGeary' What you posted is correct as far as I know - yes the west gave eastern Europe over to the communist - something that was a terrible thing to do - it wasn't only the U.S. decision to do that - I think Stalin fooled the west in believing that those would be given freedom to determine their own future

As far as the A Bomb is concerned - yes other countries were involved but in the end the US was the only country that actually had the bomb

When you look back in history the US made a lot of mistakes - it's intentions were mostly good but politicians screwed things up very badly - and when you look at what is going on now it is even worse - one thing to remember is that the US is made up of people with a lot of different options as being shown in our current election process - our next election will in my opinion pretty much determine what kind of country we will be going forward

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cantcatchacold

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...724f042131.jpg

---

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fox

Watch some documentaries that were not produced by Americans and see how things differ.

Here is one on the Spitfire, one of the easiest to build and best defense aircraft of the war, it did not have the range to reach Germany but it did not have to. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDzZnCkbxgs

Here is one on the Canadian Navy, the third largest navy in the world at the end of the world with 90000 personnel. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOHQHF34ORQ

If you want to talk about the reason for the failure of the German war effort you can look East, the eastern front was a major contributor to the downfall of the German army. If Hitler kept his pact with Stalin the outcome of the war would have been much different.

---

Fox is correct, Germany failed to take the island of Crete multiple times, that's when the US came in and the war was won. Hitler Stated he Cretans were the reason his plan failed.

Joe, please don't get your back up as this is not meant personally. For starters I love the US and if I was god, I'd create my Utopia by blending the best parts of both our countries.

Re "history"
It should be evident, that the worlds view is very different from US's view. You know what they say about the history books being written by the victors. 70 years later, thats a lot of people growing up with a very insular, distorted and in some ways thanks to Hollywood Myopic view point. If you want a recent example this see Argo (which distorted the facts grossly)...In 40-60 years, people (Americans) will "believe" that's what it was really like...and what happened.

The Luftwaffe with few exceptions had the best planes and airforce. Period. The Spitfire as Fox rightly pointed out is also up there. As with the Japanese zero...........So many more examples. By the time the US entered the fray the RAF and Luftwaffe had been pummelling each other....

Ultimately as Fox mentioned, the Eastern Front was perhaps the biggest reason...........We'll never know.
The Battle of the Bulge is often viewed as another huge turning point.

The world's view
http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk...-of-the-bulge/

The USs view
G GS Pattons critial manouvering
Clarks brilliant

Gee if the rest of the world didn't know any better one might think it was only the US army bleeding. And simple fact of the matter is, is was doomed to failure no matter what.......But oh know, Patton, the 101st, blah blah blah

Oorah
http://www.history.com/topics/world-...e-of-the-bulge

And on and on and on
:)

As we here in TO say (referring to a football team)
Aaaarrrrrgo!...Not not Ben Aflecks award winning piece of typical Hollywood revisionism
:)

Fox,

Telling JoePa anything else other than what he thinks is right is like bashing your head against the wall. At some point, all you end up with is a massive headache. Anything JoePa has posted in relation to "how the US saved the world" is said to us because he wears rose-coloured glasses.

JoePa,

Aid is freely given. What the US did for Britain should never, ever be called aid. It was war profiteering. As well, you weren't always playing the friend to Britain either. Multiple US companies helped Germany both prior to and during the war. Stop trying to rewrite history to make the US into some kind of super country which did everything right. It reeks of an inferiority complex which no one in the world has time to deal with.

Dyth

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dythbringer

Fox,

Telling JoePa anything else other than what he thinks is right is like bashing your head against the wall. At some point, all you end up with is a massive headache. Anything JoePa has posted in relation to "how the US saved the world" is said to us because he wears rose-coloured glasses.

Dyth

---

I guess I am just trying to pass along a little British Commonwealth history.

I love history, every conversation with my late grandfather involved history and every elective I took in school was history. The problem is that history is written by the victors, to get a proper view all sides need to be view and the reality is that war on all sides is a horrible thing, there are never winners or losers, there are the guys who lost and the guys who lost less.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fox

I guess I am just trying to pass along a little British Commonwealth history.

I love history, every conversation with my late grandfather involved history and every elective I took in school was history. The problem is that history is written by the victors, to get a proper view all sides need to be view and the reality is that war on all sides is a horrible thing, there are never winners or losers, there are the guys who lost and the guys who lost less.

---

Nothing wrong with trying to pass along a bit of history or learning about it from other sources. Problem is the person you are speaking to doesn't want to learn because they think they have the answers.

I am a lot like you. I love our history as a nation. I have had the opportunity to visit Juno beach/Vimy memorial (and graveyards of either side). And yes, I also volunteer information in a quest to help others get education but there are some people who despite your best efforts to help, won't listen.

I would argue that there were winners in war. Looking at WW2, businesses flourished because of the war. People lost.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dythbringer

I would argue that there were winners in war. Looking at WW2, businesses flourished because of the war. People lost.

---

Corporations won, ya, you are right there.

I told my wife if I were to travel to Europe it would be to tour the battle fields, she can go to Paris, I will go to Dunkirk.

We are actually going to North Carolina for a wedding in July, Gettysburg happens to be exactly half way, guess where we are spend en evening walking around and reading, yep, I will be learning about US military history from the source :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JoePa

Ya sure - but when the time comes that your country needs to be protected you'll be glad that the Americans are around to save your - you basically depend on us now for protection otherwise you would have to spend billions to provide that same protection by yourself - there isn't a country on this earth that has spend more treasure and blood helping other countries when they were in trouble - maybe your too young to even know about this fact - I suggest you take some time away from your video games and study up on history

---

It looks like I started this in another thread and missed all the fun. You seem like a lot of the Americans I have meet on Caribbean islands. Lots of opinions on world history and the great things you country has done. Problem is most are exaggerated or completely false. Not by the fault of there own but its what they were taught and it makes them feel good inside. I am not going to reply to any points you make specifically as it seems like that has been done well for me. " [COLOR=#333333]I suggest you take some time away from your video games" this was my favourite line from this post. Considering it comes from a guy with many times the posts and Im sure hours spent on a site about the outdoors in another country. Wont your internet friends in Pennsylvania play with you any more? Cant understand why?

Fox you will likely get more truth at Gettysburg (been there), than about any world wars , because there it was Americans shooting Americans, pretty hard to whitewash that. ps. If you have time, visit Luray caverns well worth the side trip.