Tresspassers

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Originally Posted by Gilroy

If I understand you in relation to the house and garden you feel you were the sole occupier.But when you ventured into the surrounding properties to hunt you lost this status, what exactly were you when you hunted?

In relation to the OFAH permission slips a landowner is inviting you onto his/her land to hunt.If they are not occupiers by definition what status are they?

How does a hunter with a written permission enjoy the land if he/she cannot tell a trespasser to get out.

Is it your contention that the hunter with permission has to get the landowner down and warn off the trespasser.

What if the landowner is a Corporation,a large Stadium and Shopping Mall, do you think the police and security companies need a physical owner in court.

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Trespass to Property Act

1. (1) In this Act,
“occupier” includes,
(a) a person who is in physical possession of premises, or
(b) a person who has responsibility for and control over the condition of premises or the activities there carried on, or control over persons allowed to enter the premises,
even if there is more than one occupier of the same premises; (“occupant”)
“premises” means lands and structures, or either of them,
2. (1) Every person who is not acting under a right or authority conferred by law and who,
(a) without the express permission of the occupier, the proof of which rests on the defendant,
(i) enters on premises when entry is prohibited under this Act, or
(ii) engages in an activity on premises when the activity is prohibited under this Act; or
(b) does not leave the premises immediately after he or she is directed to do so by the occupier of the premises or a person authorized by the occupier,
is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not more than $10,000. R.S.O. 1990, c. T.21, s. 2 (1); 2016, c. 8, Sched. 6, s. 1.

As you can read even a "person authorized by the occupant" can direct a person to leave the premises.Otherwise the authorization slips would be useless.Hence a person authorized by the occupant becomes their agent.

Simple analogy for you my pension plan OMERS owns Square One shopping mall.Shops rent the space,they become "occupiers".
The shops hire security guards to prevent crimes,they become agent of the occupiers under the TPA.
The courts accept these security guards are acting on behalf of the occupiers.Owners are out of the picture,occupiers are in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gilroy

If I understand you in relation to the house and garden you feel you were the sole occupier.But when you ventured into the surrounding properties to hunt you lost this status, what exactly were you when you hunted?

In relation to the OFAH permission slips a landowner is inviting you onto his/her land to hunt.If they are not occupiers by definition what status are they?

How does a hunter with a written permission enjoy the land if he/she cannot tell a trespasser to get out.

Is it your contention that the hunter with permission has to get the landowner down and warn off the trespasser.

What if the landowner is a Corporation,a large Stadium and Shopping Mall, do you think the police and security companies need a physical owner in court.

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" if they are not occupiers by definition what are they "
Guests ??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by stragglelake

" if they are not occupiers by definition what are they "
Guests ??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Yes just because you have permission to be on private property you are no more than a guest.
You have no more legal authority than a guest unless it is specifically granted to you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gilroy

Simple analogy for you my pension plan OMERS owns Square One shopping mall.Shops rent the space,they become "occupiers".
The shops hire security guards to prevent crimes,they become agent of the occupiers under the TPA.
The courts accept these security guards are acting on behalf of the occupiers.Owners are out of the picture,occupiers are in.

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Let's compare these situations.
1.Shop rents space.
2.Hunter has permission to use property.
1.Exchange of money and contract spelling out rights & responsibilities.
2. No exchange of money or contract spelling out rights & responsibilities.
1. Occupier
2. Guest

Hunter is nothing more than a guest unless specifically given the authority of the agent of the occupier/owner.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gilroy

If I understand you in relation to the house and garden you feel you were the sole occupier.But when you ventured into the surrounding properties to hunt you lost this status, what exactly were you when you hunted?

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Guest

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In relation to the OFAH permission slips a landowner is inviting you onto his/her land to hunt.If they are not occupiers by definition what status are they?

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A landowner would in most cases be the occupier but if there is another occupier they would still be the landowner.

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How does a hunter with a written permission enjoy the land if he/she cannot tell a trespasser to get out.

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Where do you figure you have been granted this right on this property?

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Is it your contention that the hunter with permission has to get the landowner down and warn off the trespasser.

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Yes either the owner or legal occupier unless you have specifically been granted this authority.

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What if the landowner is a Corporation,a large Stadium and Shopping Mall, do you think the police and security companies need a physical owner in court.

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At least a legally authorized representative of the owner or the legal occupier. In the case of a mall the security company may be a legally appointed representative of the owner or occupier.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gilroy

Trespass to Property Act

1. (1) In this Act,
“occupier” includes,
(a) a person who is in physical possession of premises, or
(b) a person who has responsibility for and control over the condition of premises or the activities there carried on, or control over persons allowed to enter the premises,
even if there is more than one occupier of the same premises; (“occupant”)
“premises” means lands and structures, or either of them,
2. (1) Every person who is not acting under a right or authority conferred by law and who,
(a) without the express permission of the occupier, the proof of which rests on the defendant,
(i) enters on premises when entry is prohibited under this Act, or
(ii) engages in an activity on premises when the activity is prohibited under this Act; or
(b) does not leave the premises immediately after he or she is directed to do so by the occupier of the premises or a person authorized by the occupier,
is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not more than $10,000. R.S.O. 1990, c. T.21, s. 2 (1); 2016, c. 8, Sched. 6, s. 1.

As you can read even a "person authorized by the occupant" can direct a person to leave the premises.Otherwise the authorization slips would be useless.Hence a person authorized by the occupant becomes their agent.

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Yes a person authorized by the occupant can act as their agent under the Trespass to Property Act.
Just because you have permission to be on the property does not grant you this authority.
The OFAH slip only gives you permission to be there. Nothing more.
I highly doubt many landowners/occupiers would ever sign a permission slip if they thought they were giving permission for anything more than allowing someone to be on their property for the intended activity.
You must specifically be given the authority to act as an agent of the owner/occupier before you have this control.
To represent your self as an agent of the owner without their specific permission could lead to charges against you for misrepresenting your authority. If the police get involved and the owner states I never gave that person permission to act as my agent in respect to the Trespass to Property Act at best you would be looking at a warning.