Labradoodles

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Originally Posted by Waftrudnir

I don't know what you point you try to make, but if you keep reading on how the DD was created and the breed is maintained, anyone will see that it was one of the greatest success stories in modern dog breeding. Furthermore, the difference between the DD breeding and what is going on with doodles is vast to say the least. What is the purpose of a doodle, and how do you measure it's performance? Until this is crystal clear, all that breeding is useless even for a family pet

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My point is it took almost 100 years of breeding to get "the greatest success stories in modern breeding " and hence the word MODERN. before you start labeling people pets as mutts know that you yourself have a mutt, it didn't happen over night. and again one key breed in your mutt mix is the poodle!!!

I don't understand the dog breed racism,
So yes someone is trying to create another breed just as people have been doing for thousands of years, it takes time and genetic selection to get the right mix but this is a new breed so it will take time.

And why not pick the poodle, they have so many great attributes(other then the manly thing), and they are one of the smartest breeds of dogs, my wife has a "mutt" shih tzu/poodle mix and its the smartest thing I have ever seen, you don't even have to give the dog a command it just know's what you are wanting from him, I have spent very little time training him and he can do and know's everything. Very smart little guy

Here's a little reading for you to educate yourself before you start bashing.

http://www.gundogmag.com/breeds/gun-...andard-poodle/
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM

"In North America, in 1600, salt marshes formed a paradise for waterfowl from Newfoundland to the Carolinas; a conjoined paradise included the fresh water marshes, rivers, ponds and lakes between the Atlantic coast and the Great Lakes flyway. Water dogs were among the first European dogs brought to North America from the time of settlement of St. John's, Newfoundland in 1583 (see Ships' and/or fishermen's dogs..., Newfoundland)."

They were using poodles for hunting in Canada 300 years before your DD was even a idea, they were still mix breeding different breeds to make different breeds to mix to make your breed, wow that's a long history of "mutts" don't you think!!!

Personally I would never get a poodle, not for a lack of ability it just not my style of dog

Oh ya, poodles are useless dogs.

http://www.gundogmag.com/files/2011/...le_090611D.jpg

Poodles and Labs are both hunting dogs originally, why can you not have one of the best hunting breeds by combining the two and also allowing hunters with major allergies to have a dog in the home.

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Originally Posted by Big Gunner

My point is it took almost 100 years of breeding to get "the greatest success stories in modern breeding " and hence the word MODERN. before you start labeling people pets as mutts know that you yourself have a mutt, it didn't happen over night. and again one key breed in your mutt mix is the poodle!!!

I don't understand the dog breed racism,
So yes someone is trying to create another breed just as people have been doing for thousands of years, it takes time and genetic selection to get the right mix but this is a new breed so it will take time.

And why not pick the poodle, they have so many great attributes(other then the manly thing), and they are one of the smartest breeds of dogs, my wife has a "mutt" shih tzu/poodle mix and its the smartest thing I have ever seen, you don't even have to give the dog a command it just know's what you are wanting from him, I have spent very little time training him and he can do and know's everything. Very smart little guy

Here's a little reading for you to educate yourself before you start bashing.

http://www.gundogmag.com/breeds/gun-...andard-poodle/
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM

Personally I would never get a poodle, not for a lack of ability it just not my style of dog

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1. sorry, but the breed snob doesn't stick to me.
2. the DD is a pretty bad example to say all the doodle breeding is part of a master plan. oh right, you didn't say that. you said just go ahead and cross what comes your way, perhaps something good is coming out of it.
3. thank you defending poodles; I have no problem with them. wouldn't buy a puppy, but if I happened to end up with a rescue, I wouldn’t be ashamed to take him waterfowling as long as there is enough drive left in ‘em. I'm not overly stylish and couldn't care less about what snobs think of me.
With the same token, I wouldn’t look down on anybody showing up with a doodle in the blind next to me. However, I would be really interested how much he spent and what “research” he did LOL

I'm quite surprised actually at the amount of support being given to a useless breeding. Waftrudnir said it best - there is no way to measure performance, or more accurately - there is no standard to which any of these dogs are bred to. Perhaps these doodle breeders need to clearly articulate that and move forward from there if there is indeed a use for them. I think the "oodle" additive though is the only reason. Look at kijiji, there are all kinds of dog with some kind of "oodle" in them. It's a shame, poodles are a beautiful, intelligent breed but it seems most people would rather have something that is only half poodle.

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Originally Posted by Fox

Oh ya, poodles are useless dogs.

http://www.gundogmag.com/files/2011/...le_090611D.jpg

Poodles and Labs are both hunting dogs originally, why can you not have one of the best hunting breeds by combining the two and also allowing hunters with major allergies to have a dog in the home.

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Possible, but you are just as likely to end up with a completely degenerated potato with hip dysplasia that is absolutely not hypoallergenic.
Originally, there might have been a great vision and some purpose (allergies), but now they are big money. And it sounds like quite a few do cause allergies. Let’s see what is going to be left when the fashion factor wears off.

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Originally Posted by Cass

I'm quite surprised actually at the amount of support being given to a useless breeding. Waftrudnir said it best - there is no way to measure performance, or more accurately - there is no standard to which any of these dogs are bred to. Perhaps these doodle breeders need to clearly articulate that and move forward from there if there is indeed a use for them. I think the "oodle" additive though is the only reason. Look at kijiji, there are all kinds of dog with some kind of "oodle" in them. It's a shame, poodles are a beautiful, intelligent breed but it seems most people would rather have something that is only half poodle.

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My thoughts are once you acquire performance and traits one is looking for then you would set the standards to which dogs are to be breed, is that not how it goes.
If its not there yet then how do you set the standard, and what do you do with the dogs during this process kill them?
and why is it useless breeding? I don't get this.

And to Waftudnir how do you develop a breed without mixing breeds, Take the PP, it had to start with someone saying lets mix a poodle breed with this pointer breed and see what kind of dog comes out of it, and low and behold you have the poodle pointer arguably one of the best versatile hunting dogs(after decades of genetic selection)
It's not like there mixing dogs and cats

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Originally Posted by Big Gunner

...And to Waftudnir how do you develop a breed without mixing breeds, Take the PP, it had to start with someone saying lets mix a poodle breed with this pointer breed and see what kind of dog comes out of it, and low and behold you have the poodle pointer arguably one of the best versatile hunting dogs(after decades of genetic selection)
It's not like there mixing dogs and cats

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Why do you need a new breed? For the same reason why cooks develop new recipes - to make money. Yes, all the unpalatable stuff goes into the garbage. You have to try out a lot of things before one recipe will become part of the average person’s diet - because there are already so many good ones. Beside, if you don't like the cuisine of your area, just get a recipe book from Europe or Asia. The same (at least in the case of Europe) applies to dog breeds IMHO.
There are a few PP guys on here, so I won't dare to speak on their behalf. All I tried to tell you is that if you would apply the DD's breeding system (back then and now), you would not see doodles everywhere.

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Originally Posted by Big Gunner

My point is it took almost 100 years of breeding to get "the greatest success stories in modern breeding " and hence the word MODERN. before you start labeling people pets as mutts know that you yourself have a mutt, it didn't happen over night. and again one key breed in your mutt mix is the poodle!!!

I don't understand the dog breed racism,
So yes someone is trying to create another breed just as people have been doing for thousands of years, it takes time and genetic selection to get the right mix but this is a new breed so it will take time.

And why not pick the poodle, they have so many great attributes(other then the manly thing), and they are one of the smartest breeds of dogs, my wife has a "mutt" shih tzu/poodle mix and its the smartest thing I have ever seen, you don't even have to give the dog a command it just know's what you are wanting from him, I have spent very little time training him and he can do and know's everything. Very smart little guy

Here's a little reading for you to educate yourself before you start bashing.

http://www.gundogmag.com/breeds/gun-...andard-poodle/
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM
http://www.poodlehistory.org/PDUCKGU.HTM

"In North America, in 1600, salt marshes formed a paradise for waterfowl from Newfoundland to the Carolinas; a conjoined paradise included the fresh water marshes, rivers, ponds and lakes between the Atlantic coast and the Great Lakes flyway. Water dogs were among the first European dogs brought to North America from the time of settlement of St. John's, Newfoundland in 1583 (see Ships' and/or fishermen's dogs..., Newfoundland)."

They were using poodles for hunting in Canada 300 years before your DD was even a idea, they were still mix breeding different breeds to make different breeds to mix to make your breed, wow that's a long history of "mutts" don't you think!!!

Personally I would never get a poodle, not for a lack of ability it just not my style of dog

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Well said.

... and for the record (most know anyway):
a GWP is the offspring of a DD that did not meet breeding standards. that much about how you create a new "breed" nowadays.

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Originally Posted by Waftrudnir

Why do you need a new breed? For the same reason why cooks develop new recipes - to make money. Yes, all the unpalatable stuff goes into the garbage. You have to try out a lot of things before one recipe will become part of the average person’s diet - because there are already so many good ones. Beside, if you don't like the cuisine of your area, just get a recipe book from Europe or Asia. The same (at least in the case of Europe) applies to dog breeds IMHO.
There are a few PP guys on here, so I won't dare to speak on their behalf. All I tried to tell you is that if you would apply the DD's breeding system (back then and now), you would not see doodles everywhere.

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No you need a new breeds to meet changing peoples requirements, and you develop new recipes not to make money, but the introduction of new spices and idea's,

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"Beside, if you don't like the cuisine of your area, just get a recipe book from Europe or Asia. The same (at least in the case of Europe) applies to dog breeds IMHO."

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Really what does this even mean... and where do you think all dog breeds came from, Europe