CBC talks about firearms - fear mongering 101

Do we really need to split hairs and argue over semantics? Aka the literal definition of Sniper?

TO the point

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Originally Posted by skypilot

Nope. Just know better plus currently own and have owned Brownings and shot many. To quote Browning USA on a BAR accuracy issue "we only guarantee 5" @ 100yds." I said crap I have a Browning 375 H&H that is way better than that. He said "Well you got a good one"

Nobody in the business would knowingly pick a Browning for a sniper rifle regardless of whose definition of sniper you use.

That said, it's not that hard to hit a man at 180m with a scoped rifle. Many here likely sight in at 200 and shoot moose every year at that distance. After all, 10" is 10" inches whether it's a shot on a moose or a head.

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Skypilot knows it, I know it, we know it, I hope to god most cops know it, though obviously some don't and if they don't they maybe shouldn't be cops or allowed to carry. Simple question for the esteemed detective.

What rifle does his own guys use?.......

Name me one just one armed force, paramilitary, leo, anything. That uses BLRs as their weapons of (scuze the pun coming...see below)......surgical precision.

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Bingo....to snipe (verb) does not make you a Sniper (A sniper is a marksman or qualified specialist )


just as to doctor (verb) a wound (treat someone medically) doesn't make you a Dr.

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Doctoring a wound, does not make one a Doctor, that true. It's also highly improbable Mike, LEO and the Media would when crediting someone with saving someones life say "The unknown Doctor doctored the wound". No they would say Joe Blow treated the victim...Done, nuff said.

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Originally Posted by SongDog

But....but...a bi pod on a lever action? I just can't get over that.

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Originally Posted by smallgamer

Makes two of us.

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Makes me shiver. Though the thought of putting a pod on a thing of beauty makes me shiver with revulsion.
Just as the word Sniper and high powered sniper rifle might. Its menacing, and was chosen, used specifically for that reason. By the cops and the media.

Now if we want to argue semantics. (The meaning of words, phrases, etc)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantics

Why choose the word Sniper? Because it's threatening, menacing, scary ( A hidden marksman)
Why choose the phrase High Powered Sniper Rifle? See the same.

Translation. Browning BLRs are menacing.Instilling fear in the public, aka fear mongering.

Funny that.

Well that's it then....I guess we can all call ourselves 'Snipers' from now on because according to Welsh's literal translation of the dictionary and common usage and because we conceal ourselves behind our camo and hunting blinds... we are all Snipers.

So when we are heading down the hiways this fall on our annual pilgrimage to the Moose camp, the civilians will watch us go by and say "there go a bunch of snipers" and they won't be wrong ..LOL...

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Originally Posted by JBen

Doctoring a wound, does not make one a Doctor, that true. It's also highly improbable Mike, LEO and the Media would when crediting someone with saving someones life say The unknown Doctor doctored the wound. No they would say Joe Blow treated the victim...Done, nuff said.

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So a guy shots someone; did the Cops/media first analyze the scene to find out the guy was concealed, was he wearing camo when he made the shot ? Is that why they called it a sniper attack. or was it because he was, maybe, up to 200 yds away ? Or was it because his gun had a bipod and scope so it must be a sniper rifle, ergo he then must be a sniper.

Seems the common usage of the term Sniper is anything but realistic or factual and only being used willy-nilley to sensationalize the press release.

I think I'll retain my common usage..the true definition..."A sniper is a marksman or qualified specialist " less ambiguity; used and accepted by every Law Enforcement Agency and Military around the world.

Lol :)

There is power in words. This is undeniable. We can quibble over the literal definition and meaning of "sniper" and "Sniper Rifle". Immaterial. Or off the target, bullseye.

The question really, imo is why might they choose the those specific words.
To me anyways, theres only one reason, and that reason is fear. Everyone, even the "professionals" fear Snipers.
So those words were chosen and used to instill fear. In both the assailant (Hmmm anyone sense a difference)
Assailant (they could have used that word)....versus Sniper. How often do they use the words Assassin. (They might have used that to)..Heck JT goes to great lengths to avoid using the word "Terrororist.."


And the weapon used.

Not rifle, not hunting rifle,.....High Powered Sniper Rifle...Which Browning BLRS are not. And everyone knows that...except.
Likely the majority of the public and
apparently, the cops.
Why the Media would run with it, is obvious. "Sensationalism" and it sells.

So I guess the question is. Why might the cops want to portray an everyday hunting/bush rifle as something menacing.

Well, I conceal myself 20ft up in the tree canopy and lie in wait with a stainless BLR. I wonder if they are trying to make fat old guys who legally deer hunt with legally purchased firearms and ammunition sound evil? Naaahhh, they would never do that right? That wouldn't fit their agenda would it?

You give them too much credit Terry. They don't have nearly enough knowledge about hunting to make that connection. After all the "evil hunter" just walks into the woods and starts blasting at everything that moves. ...

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Well that's it then....I guess we can all call ourselves 'Snipers' from now on because according to Welsh's literal translation of the dictionary and common usage and because we conceal ourselves behind our camo and hunting blinds... we are all Snipers.

So when we are heading down the hiways this fall on our annual pilgrimage to the Moose camp, the civilians will watch us go by and say "there go a bunch of snipers" and they won't be wrong ..LOL...

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We are not snipers because we do not target people. If we start to, we then transition from hunters to snipers.

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Originally Posted by MikePal

So a guy shots someone; did the Cops/media first analyze the scene to find out the guy was concealed, was he wearing camo when he made the shot ? Is that why they called it a sniper attack. or was it because he was, maybe, up to 200 yds away ? Or was it because his gun had a bipod and scope so it must be a sniper rifle, ergo he then must be a sniper.

Seems the common usage of the term Sniper is anything but realistic or factual and only being used willy-nilley to sensationalize the press release.

I think I'll reserve by common usage to the true definition..."A sniper is a marksman or qualified specialist " less ambiguity; used and accepted by every Law Enforcement Agency and Military around the world.

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A marksman doesn't have to belong to a branch of the military or police services. We don't know what the crime scene (I am including the spot where the shot was taken in that definition) looks like. As welsh said, the term sniper doesn't automatically denote a military or police personnel. Even using mosquito's Wikipedia definition of a sniper it doesn't mention the military:

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Originally Posted by mosquito

Definition
A sniper is a marksman or qualified specialist who operates alone, in a pair, or with a sniper team to maintain close visual contact with the enemy and engage targets from concealed positions or distances exceeding the detection capabilities of enemy personnel.

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So was the shooter a marksman or qualified specialist? Yes I propose he qualifies as a marksman because the shot was at 200 yards, with a significant wind, it was at night with a Browning BLR short magnum lever action rifle (I can't find which exact caliber was used), which others have indicated isn't exactly a highly precise rifle so the shooter must have some skill.
Did the shooter operate alone, in a pair or with a sniper team? Yes, at least alone.
Did the shooter maintain close visual contact with the enemy? Yes, the shooter had visual contact throughout the shooting with the victim because as we know 200 yards is close and the shooter was able to see his target.
Did the shooter engage targets from concealed positions or distances exceeding the detection capabilities of enemy personnel? Yes, the shooting took place on a windy night. The victim was an enemy of the shooter (we don't know why right now) and the shooter was at a distance which exceeded the detection range of the victim (how far can any of us hear or see on a windy night?).

I submit since the shooter meets all of the criteria which even mosquito uses as a sniper definition, the shooter is a sniper. Hence, as a result of the afore mentioned qualification, anything involved in this crime used by the sniper can be denoted as have the term sniper prior to it (eg sniper rifle, sniper nest, etc).

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Well that's it then....I guess we can all call ourselves 'Snipers' from now on because according to Welsh's literal translation of the dictionary and common usage and because we conceal ourselves behind our camo and hunting blinds... we are all Snipers.

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If you shoot people, yes. Do you usually go around shooting people?

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Originally Posted by JBen

So I guess the question is. Why might the cops want to portray an everyday hunting/bush rifle as something menacing.

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Really?

As I pointed out previously, if the cops wanted to portray this rifle as something menacing, the first thing they'd do is call it a "hunting rifle," and go on about how easy these rifles are to get and how we're all in danger as a result. Did they do that?

No.

The cops hold a press conference and ask for the public's help regarding what they describe as an unusual crime. The firearms community circles the wagons and complains that it's under attack. The cops describe how a career criminal was shot in what they characterize as a targeted "sniper" attack; the firearms community complains that the cops are trying to sensationalize the event and frighten the public.

Just what do people think they're defending here?

What we have here is a classic example of the whole media dynamic surrounding guns. People aren't reacting because the cops used sensational language. They're reacting because firearms were in the news in a negative way, period.

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Originally Posted by welsh

And there's the gendered attack, right on schedule.

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What are you talking about, you disappoint me, you were the one worried about the relation between temperature and intelligence and being dismissive. To bad, here I was hoping with using a dictionary you might raise the mental temperature to body heat or even low grade fever. After we got your IQ was raised I was hoping we could work on the EQ and Empathy deficiencies but keep working on it.

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Originally Posted by welsh

What does this have to do with anything?

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Gee, you forgot already... go back and read Post #1 of this thread again. Repetition helps with memory.
http://www.oodmag.com/community/show...l=1#post967246

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Originally Posted by welsh

What does this have to do with the question at hand?

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You forgot already... here's I'll save you time, here is a link to Terry's post
http://www.oodmag.com/community/show...l=1#post970400

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Originally Posted by welsh

Are you off your meds?

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No, I remembered my crestor thanks for asking, I hope you are keeping up with your doctor's recommendations on diet, meds and exercise, I need less of the first and more of the third.

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Originally Posted by JBen

Do we really need to split hairs and argue over semantics?

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No, but it was fun to get some using educational things like a dictionary... me bad! ;)

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Originally Posted by JBen

Makes me shiver. Though the thought of putting a pod on a thing of beauty makes me shiver with revulsion.
Just as the word Sniper and high powered sniper rifle might. Its menacing, and was chosen, used specifically for that reason. By the cops and the media.

Now if we want to argue semantics. (The meaning of words, phrases, etc)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantics

Why choose the word Sniper? Because it's threatening, menacing, scary ( A hidden marksman)
Why choose the phrase High Powered Sniper Rifle? See the same.

Translation. Browning BLRs are menacing.Instilling fear in the public, aka fear mongering.

Funny that.

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:thumbup: BINGO :thumbup:


Now my issue is with the public perception, the quote below is an extreme taken from one of the animal rights groups (Animal Alliance) posts... I have seen more and petitions etc. but Jben summed up my point on the Post about the murderer perfectly and the agenda or slant behind the writing of the news, hence my biggest issue is the post 1 article.

Supporter comment
Hunting is legal murder, committed for pleasure by cruel and calloused people. Hunters are cold-blooded snipers. I despise them.
Steven Feinberg, Point Richmond, CA




As long as the public is ignorant and hunters and even firearms themselves are misrepresented the situation will only get worse especially with the Liberals in power, look at posts on S-223.
http://www.oodmag.com/community/show...l=1#post970038

http://www.therebel.media/canadian_f...e_with_new_law

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Originally Posted by mosquito

Gee, you forgot already... go back and read Post #1 of this thread again. Repetition helps with memory.
http://www.oodmag.com/community/show...l=1#post967246

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Right, but how is that connected to the second news item and the subsequent discussion?

Do you think all these things are the product of a media conspiracy? That there is a single intent behind all these reports?