I beleive this is the greatest issue that all hunters face. Period. We need a forum under hunting where people can discuss. Probably land and camps and clubs all together.
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I beleive this is the greatest issue that all hunters face. Period. We need a forum under hunting where people can discuss. Probably land and camps and clubs all together.
That's a great idea as accessing good hunting properties is an issue whether you live in Ontario and compete literally with hundreds of thousands of other hunters or you are in rual Saskatchewan....access to the private or Crown lands os getting more and more difficult..
That's the reason I sold my guns and bows and no longer hunt. I miss it dearly but just couldn't take the hassles anymore. Just too old and tired. Used to be a 5 minute drive to huntable land. Not any more.:sad:
I agree but for me I'm far to shy to go and ask for permission. I have access to my father in laws acreage but even still I feel like im imposing. Best solution is to one day by my own acreage. Until then I'll make do
agreed make a permanent thread for land owners and hunters to connect
Totally agree!Quote:
Originally Posted by blunttip
Call it "Hunting Ground Access" ;)
Finding land to hunt is part of hunting. With the increase of hunting bylaws and regulations it is always going to be a constant challenge. Buying your own land ads its own set of challenges. I would rather be interested in putting a group of maximum 4 to 6 hunters together who can combine resources and buy the acreage and build their own camp. They can maintain and manage it and hunt it forever.
i ran across an add similar to what your talking about on kijiji, it was called the outdoor property network, it redirected me to their website outdoorpropertynetwork.com that had a quick blurb about what they do. I emailed the contact on the page, seems interesting enough
You have my vote!
I live in Southern Ontario and the single largest reason I get a "no" from private landowners is due to previous hunters either leaving ruts in the field or garbage and making overall poor decisions. Farmers tell me stories of shooting to close to livestock to damaging fences and frankly coming and going whenever they feel like it. Something to consider..... when you ask to hunt there land it does not meet that's a free pass to come as much as you like and bring all your buddies who then intern bring their buddies. I think there are plenty of opportunities for hunters, it's work and to many look for a short cut.
I don't know how much traction you will get with landowners looking for hunters online....
I'm not really sure what a site like your discussing would accomplishment. Most on here who own their own land probably hunt it as well. some occasionally invite others out to it. But I don't think you will find to many non hunters that are landowners posting on here saying "Hey I have land for people to hunt.". The only way to find private hunting land is with boots on the ground going to farmers. If you go in a suit expect a No answer. I made my contacts years ago. By stopping and helping toss some bales of hay. One farmer I met tractor got jammed up and I help unjam it. If you get a deer be sure to offer him some meat.
But I don't think your going to find may on here offering up the land they have access to.
Boots on the ground meeting people is the only way.
I know this isn't the same thing but did you see this article? It's on how to find public land. http://www.oodmag.com/hunting/lands-opportunity/
There's an interactive PDF that lists phone numbers and websites.
I also saw that Kijiji ad and believe it is more of a brokerage where they are trying to lease up the land for a price and then re-lease access to hunters for a profit. I am basing the following purely on hearsay so feel free to correct me, but I believe such an arrangement may be illegal in Ontario. I would have to research it further to be certain. And while I know that many of us give a bottle, gift cards or other consideration as an expression of appreciation, I think this is an entirely different concept.
I can also tell you I think that it would be a slippery slope if that is the case. For example, I know that in most states, the vast majority of priivate land is leased by huge outfitting companies and that is why their national forests get such pressure. I would welcome more input from someone with more information about this company and the legalities of leasing private land for hunting. Feel free to contact me by PM or post directly here (or perhaps start a new thread, as I am not looking to hi-jack the post). Tks.
I dont think you will find many land owners lurking around a hunting and fishing site looking for someone to hunt there land. Most land owners on this site hunt and have hunting family and friends that use there land. You need to get out there and knock on doors, there is no easy way to get permission from behind your computer.Quote:
Originally Posted by blunttip
If you really want to hunt, there is crown land always available. If you want access to private land there is only one main way that is to hit the streets and start asking, very rarely do land owners come looking for hunters.
This is a gtreat resource. I'm not going to say where but I hunted this fall with a new hunter on one of these public properties and only saw hunters a few times. Also contact MNR offices and find out where they have lands that allow hunting.Quote:
Originally Posted by AprilOOD
I hunt exclusively on private land. Used to be no problem to get permission hunted somewhere every weekend of waterfowl season. These days thanks to two local waterfowl outfitters it's a different story. They are paying for access and now most landowners are expecting $100 to 200 per hunt. Too much for me to fork out. I think Ontario should take a lesson for Saskatchewan and make paying for access illegal. I also think outfitters should has a restricted season allowing a resident only portions of the season for real hunters and not guys who need to pay to hunt because they can't do the leg work themselves.
Only people who don't own land would feel this way. As a land owner I don't need the government telling me what I can and can't do on my land with exception to what land use zoning it falls under. With the rising costs of living (hydro, fuel, taxes, food, etc) why should I not be allowed to lease hunting rights to my property to help offset my costs of ownership?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
I agree with you and I don't even own land. A land owner doesn't have to share his land.
Quote:
Originally Posted by B Wilson
No only people that are true sportsman feel this way if you truly love the sport you would see it my way. I own my own acreage and believe me if you need a extra 1000 bucks to make your farm profitable you best be selling the farm and move into town. Farming is not a hurting industry these days. The sport of hunting depends on new hunters starting out and new hunters won't pay for access or at least not very often. This issues deeper then just extra costs to hunters the future of hunting May very we'll alter because of it. I also view land owners making money of access for the purpose of hunting no different then selling wild meat. What's next
Although I don't own any land in Ontario. My experience with land owners is most want people to respect their land. Most times when I have been turn down to hunt on private land it has been for 1 of 3 reasons. Land owner hunts, land owner is anti hunter, or land owner has had a bad experience with hunters.
So I can understand land owners who don't want people hunting on their land. Some do rent out their land but around here that doesn't happen at least I'm not aware of it.
To get access to land that is private you need to find a way to prove yourself to the owner. Would you want some yahoo lurking around your property with a gun? It's just like going for a job interview.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
Well I guess I am guilty of not truly loving the sport then. I don't need the the extra money and my land is not farm land. New hunters who don't seem to mind spending money on guns and the latest camo pattern can certainly afford to pay a small premium to increase their odds of success or they can join the many other hunters who choose to hunt on the thousands upon thousands of crown land for free.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
The sport hunting is not going to change because private land owners charge for access. The township I live in has more crown land than private land, so help me understand how private land owners are bring the sport hunting industry to its knees.
Selling wild game ? Wow that's stretching it pretty far and obliviously not the case or serveral private land owners and outfitters would be charged for it by now.
When I hear non landowners complaining that Landowners don't share enough I cringe. This is what drives landowners away from sharing. Landowners are not require to share their land nor should they. This is the type of thing that drives them away from even entertaining the thought of sharing. If you own you can do what you want with it. When you do find a land owner who is willing to share please be sure to treat him and his property with the Utmost respect.
A landowner has the right to to a share as he see's fit. If I ever get land I will also make decisions as who can and cannot use it.
I was only comparing it to selling meat as it is profiting off the harvest of wild game. If you have that much crown land where you live I am surprised anyone would pay for access. Where Iam from there is basically no crown land only a handful of conservation lands which get way over hunted. I have meet several young hunters who gave up the sport after having no luck with land access. When I started hunting 15 years ago we hunted all around a certain town that held major numbers of waterfowl in its lagoon ponds, we basically knew all the farmers and they knew us growing up in the area. Now we wont even scout the area as we know all access is pay only and not cheap either. The two outfitters in the area bring in almost exclusively Americans and are not good to the lands they hunt we have went in after them and picked up all their hulls and garbage and their also known to be rude and aggressive towards other hunters but because they pay they still get access. I just think the sport would be much better off if paying was not allowed keep the equal playing field for all those love the sport, I worry how bad things will be when my kids start huntingQuote:
Originally Posted by B Wilson
Some crown land isn't easily to hunt / very rough terrain vs private land with established and maintained trails along with multiple tree stands. Some people don't have the time or the energy to do the crown land route and choose to pay a few bucks to have areas pre scouted. The tree stands are there for a reason.
I can guarantee that if there was any garbage left behind, it would at some point get returned to the creator of the mess.
its unfortunate that the government didn't keep more land for recreation in southern ontario.
With tho all that being said, I don't lease out hunting rights, but I do vigorously stand behind my right to do what ever I want to on my land. That is my point, if a land owner wants to lease hunting rights, they should and if they don't, they don't
I emailed the guy, he said is kind of like a "kijiji" for individuals who wanna make a profit off there land and other individuals who want to hunt their land ultimately connecting the two parties. They make no profit from the transaction (like kijiji)Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyT
That is why fishing and waterfolwing on crown land is so much more enjoyable. One day I plan to hunt my own hunt camp and enjoy my own land and not deal with the bs of asking and getting permission.
As a landowner I find it more logical to let people I already know hunt my land than strangers who just show up to hunt then leave.
In a few months I will need my maple syrup trails packed down. Just need someone with a skidoo to drive over them a few times between now and then. Can't seem to get last years hunters to leave town to give me a hand..... Things like this go a long way.
If you were not so far from me I would be over in a heart beat to help make the maple syrup.
You would think those hunters would jump at the opportunity for an excuse to come out and help make syrup. Beer and Maple, maybe fresh venison cooking at the sametime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by patvetzal
If I had a sled I'll come.. If I coild hunt there next year..
^ what he said.Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyJR
I believe that most people who bellyache about lack of access haven't done much in the way of trying to get access. 'Too shy to ask' - well you just have to get over that if you want someone to let you use thier property.
I am sure that there are untold thousands of private acres not hunted and that will not be hunted for one simple reason LIABILITY.
With that being said the OFAH could probably be a little more pro active and push both government and private owners to help out.
If I were in the position of the OP I would do as has been stated, get together with 5 other guys,chip in buy land and build a simple camp.
Here you go only took me 20 minutes to locate, 6 guys x $4,000.
http://toronto.kijiji.ca/f-real-esta...-W0QQCatIdZ641
Anytime I've been denied permission to hunt on private property,owners always site "liability" reasons. Some folks have been badly burnt,so,who can blame them? It may be as simple as absolving landowners of all liability when allowing hunters on their property which can be done with amendments to the Trespass to Property Act and the Occupiers Liability Act. Landowners may be a lot more accommodating when they knew they couldn't be held responsible if someone got hurt.
Most people seem to have a hard time finding free private land to hunt on because of two reasons. They are afraid to go ask land owners and they are unwilling to to give a helping had to the owner. In 30 years I have been declined access 3 times and that's it. I have hundreds of ac to hunt on and can very easily add to this.
If you don't go out and meet people and show an interest you will not get access plain and simple.
Just to cast some light on the other side, being the guy in town. If you let me come out and run my sled around to pack trails for you, and I try to help you with some things over the year. That is what you would like right? Ok so you and I agree that come deer season I can put a stand or two up in the back forty, Seems like a fair deal no? Now come deer season you tell me that I can't hunt because some outfitter has offered you money for access for only him and his clients. :scream:Quote:
Originally Posted by patvetzal
This type of thing happen to me with geese hunting access to a few places around London. The outfitter never even showed up with clients( or money for that matter) and as far as I know no geese were hunted on the farms. :mad:
Now I ask after you burned me over the access for deer season, would you think it is ok to call me in January to come out pack trails again.:confused: Now I did enjoy sledding around your place, didn't mind running a saw to clear some of the trails. :goodstuff: I did this even when I was coming out to your place on the only day that I was home. What I mean is that Tuesday night I got home, Even though I have not seen My wife or friends for three weeks I get up early Wednesday and come to your place. After being out at your place I go home have a shower and my wife drives me back out to the truck and I leave for another two to three weeks. :(
How warm do you think I will be to you when the phone rings this year? :confused:
By the way one of the landowners that burned me last year have already called about pigeons and rats in the barns. Seems I am the only one he can find in Ontario that hunts with an Air Rifle.:whacked:
What do you think I should do.. and keep in mind I am out of Lipstick and Vaseline.:rolleyes:
By the way if I had a sled I would come pack trails for you too.:thumbup:
Just because four or five other landowners burned me, doesn't mean I would not give you a chance.:goodstuff:
Snowwalker I think sometimes those are the chances you take. The first chunk of land I got access to here in Ottawa was a fella who grew Xmas trees. I remember that year well, after talking with him I remember I offered to prune the Christmas trees for him at 6/hr in exchange for the low price I would get sole access to hunting the property. I hunted that property for several years my final years was when his wife and him had a messy divorce and they both tried to use me. I was still owed some money for several reports I had done on his property after I stopped hunting it. I never did see that money. Not totally the same but sometimes we have to roll with the punches.
Snowalker,
You are a hunter with a vocation,unfortunately still way to many hunters looking for a vacation.
But like a vacation ANYWHERE there is a price to pay to play.Plenty of hunters simply dont want to pay any price and kinda expect hunting properties to be free.
Guys will buy the best of guns,gear,ATV,s clothing, but cant find a buck to put into the properties they would like to hunt.
and it is the "Hunters" who have created the market.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tommy Taker
Not sure what you have heard, but I cannot see anything that would be illegal about this.Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyT
Maybe in Texas, where there is almost no public land either, but not in most other states.Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyT
I think a landowners right to what he can do with his property is a more important issue than hunting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
And if you think putting the screws to landowners over this is going to make them more accepting of hunters, well, you have another thought coming.
Not in ontario its not. The amount of Crown Land we have is incredable. I would guess a good percentage of it is lightly hunted if hunted at all. People might have to travel but the opertunity is there for those who want to hunt.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tommy Taker
Leasing might be the making of hunting in the future and make people appreciate the sport more.
i THINK some of the thinks I do seem strange to people too. Sitting in a cow barn/chicken shed shooting rats and pigeons/starlings crows/black birds with my (23Foot/Pound) Air Rifle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uars-T3jguk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uars-T3jguk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuqXlJbbxtE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooKIZABqr6M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIK6r4CDQ4U
I doubt it, maybe down by Toronto area. But up here most land owners don't mind allowing hunters to hunt on their land as long as you respect it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
you need to read the land occupiers act. no land owner can be held liable for any legal actions on his property .Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
That's my understanding too, as long as you are not charging for access.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark270wsm
I have been looking at different ways of getting permission for new hunting properties. It is getting harder and harder. I came across this thread and noticed someone had posted a comment about some website (www.outdoorpropertynetwork.com). Has anyone looked into this site? I have noticed that some people are using kijiji to obtain permission on private property and this site looks like it does the same thing, connecting hunters with people that have land to offer. Just looking for advice or input, otherwise its back to driving, drinking coffees and knocking on doors.
Thanks,
birdbuff
otherwise its back to driving, drinking coffees and knocking on doors.
Thanks,
birdbuff[/QUOTE]
Best way to do it!!
Talk too the OFAH they are buying and or leasing land for hunters... maybe they have some ready to go ... that is one of there mandates is to buy land or lease it for hunting
I don't know much about hunting in Southern Ontario. But the best way to get access to private land in Eastern Ontario. Is to knock on doors, be polite introduce yourself and above all put your best foot forward. Over the past 30 years I have been told no only once. I find the most important thing is a land owner wants you to respect his land. It also doesn't hurt to offer something in exchange. Help with chores (labor), if your an accountant you can always offer free services. Become a friend. Works best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdbuff
Everything changes when a landowner charges for access. They require extra insurance because of the liability if someone gets injured,whether the hunter does something stupid or not. Fees are also income which must be reported on the tax forms which can make a huge difference depending on their tax bracket.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark270wsm
Not a chance. Other than lobby various organisations that own/manage land on behalf of anglers and hunters,the OFAH has no such mandate,nor,did they ever have.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark270wsm
Just some advise from years of experience - years ago when I approached a farmer for permission to hunt his land I brought my small kids with me - who is going to refuse a father with 3 little boys with him when he knocks on the door and asks if he can hunt his land -
Just my .02, I have been at it for a while and been refused numerous times. Mostly because others already have permission. Tonight I finally got my first yes and I can't be more excited. It took alot of looking and asking but it does happen. Good luck I am sure you will find hunting grounds if you try hard enough.
yup 100% sure... it is part of there new land trust deals its in there annual report ..TAKE some time and read it . it will surprise you what they are doing for us huntersQuote:
Originally Posted by Moe
really you better read there annual report .. but better yet.. i will give a copy and paste of it ...Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
the OFAH Fish and Wildlife Land Trust Fund was established to fund the acquisition or lease of suitable fishing, hunting and outdoor recreation properties
You seem like a really open-minded guy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark270wsm
Thanks for the info,mark. I've been a member for decades and never realized that this was part of the organization.
Not when it comes to this issue . I Also think they should put a giant fence around the GTA and lock the gates on Friday and keep then locked till Sunday. LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by WayneGretzky99
ok bud.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
Cant we just keep it locked all the time?
I'll drive my tractor through it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
lol I have no issue with the GTA, long as they still think "up north" is Orillia, I'm fine up here ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
Orrila isn't up north.. Gotta go at least past north bay..Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkeyRookie
forgot my <sarcasm></sarcasm> tags :)Quote:
Originally Posted by topher
Always get a chuckle when I head into our Waterloo or Toronto office and meet some new folks, they ask where from "ah up North" "oh, like barrie? Orillia?" yep... :)
I live in between Bradford and Newmarket.. Work in the city.. When people hear im from Newmarket they go wow.. That's way up north isn't it? To them anything north of hwy 7, is the great white north.. I once had a client ask if I ever see moose at the farm... Had to tell him every day.. I see one.. Unless the bears are around..
Those darn menacing Newmarket bears lolQuote:
Originally Posted by topher
There was a bear a few years ago (10+) in Newmarket.. And an elephant was wandering around... (Not at the same time) within last 5 years..Quote:
Originally Posted by Romulus86
OMG,,,,,, Where is this land,,, CROWN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Moe
"The purpose is to fund the acquisition of lease of suitable fishing, hunting and outdoor recreation properties, which will focus on conservation, fish and wildlife habitat, and access for the purpose of fishing, hunting and other outdoor pursuits.
Paragraph they missed, Then we will support the MNR to close off these areas to residents of Ontario in the North,
"The properties will be managed under the direct supervision of OFAH Head Office staff, with the assistance as required"
Ya,,,,, I feel all warm and fussy.