Just wondering if groups are having the same problem as us, finding younger hunters to commit time, money and resources to their moose hunt?
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Just wondering if groups are having the same problem as us, finding younger hunters to commit time, money and resources to their moose hunt?
Lucky for me that my son and his buddy, both 21 years old have committed to a huge amount of resources to the moose hunt this year. Both have new and almost new super crew pickups. The buddy is also supplying a brand new tandem axle trailer 14 feet long for the 3 ATV's we are bringing.
It also helps that both of them are volunteer fire fighters with the city of Ottawa so that my older buddy and I feel secure in the knowledge that they can haul the moose quarters out of the bush and our fat derriere if the need arises.
So yes, some young lads do commit!
Same story around here...time and time again....they can't get the young guys to participate in any of the logistics, planning or preparations of any of the Hunt Camps for either Moose or Deer. The camps are folding up, membership has dropped and they have a hard time getting enough guys to put together a Moose Camp. We've seen 2 local camps that have dropped to just 3-4 guys..they used to have 10-12.Quote:
Originally Posted by bucketboy
One multi-generational family of AVID Moose Hunters has a young lad that wasn't going to bother going...till he drew the Cow Tag...so Dad is now making him go. Sad..
My buddy in the Peg had to cut one guy from the group.....never contributed to anything..just showed with a pocket full of excuses just as they were pulling out year after year. The Tribe has spoken..snuffed out his flame.
The face of hunting has sure chaged over the past couple of decades.
Same boat here. Im 27 and Ive been trying to organize a bow moose hunt one of these years but no one will fully commit. I have everything I need, truck,trailer and atv but I want a couple of my friends to apply with me for a tag. They all say they will at first in the spring when I bring it up but by summer they have changed their minds.
I can gun hunt for moose every year with the hunt camp Im part of, but I want to go farther up north and try a bow hunt.
well guys this is the place to get a group together. I m new to moose hunting couldn t find a group to join so started to put one together here. this year added a couple of new guys who seem to be really good guys. this years hunt should be awesome. established groups ain t what they used to be.
im interested in joining a moose camp if you are willing to take me!!!
I think alot of it has to do with the time and money involved. Also alot of it has to do with where or not there employer will let them have the time off. It's not as cheap as it use to be to go away moose hunting any more. The costs involved seem to be one of the sticking points to this. Buying a vehicle,trailer,atv, and paying the cost to insure/fuel them cost a go chunk of change nowadays. Also the cost in fuel to go where you want to go isn't cheap ether. Some people nowadays look at what is cost for go moose hunting trip and the cost to go south somewhere warm and it' close to the same thing. Another sticking point I think is the draw process, you can draw a deer tag no matter what but for a bull or cow tag depending on where you want to go you may only get one of two in your lifetime.
The camp up the road from us is usually fully for moose (about 8 to 10 guys) as the last couple of years the drew bull tags, this year only 3 people are coming up because no one wants to spend the money or drive the 5 hours to just go and shoot a calf. I really like the article OOD has few years back about moose hunting trips on a budget, for someone starting out and even some one doing it for while it really helped break down the cost and time,
I am a tad over 40 and moose hunting is a great idea it just is too much commitment for someone with a family. As my kids age and become more dependent will I entertain a moose hunt. Would like to try a week in Quebec one day.
It's very hard for younger hunters to justify spending a bucket load of cash to go. Many hunters are afraid to take time off from work in case they don't have a job when they get back. There's no such thing as employer loyalty anymore with millions of Canadians looking for any job they can get.
Trying to just get a co-worker to get a membership at a local range so he can pratice is a dead end.
If he won't pay for a membership( about $250 a year) how do you think he would drop a few hundred bucks on a hunting trip for a week?
Invited him down for the first week of Oct.... Not too expensive there.. Drive to London, sleep on my couch, eat my food, ride around in my truck, and maybe even shoot a few rounds of trap at MY club.
He's generally a none starter. Lots of questions at work, but puts things off till the last minute. Got his Pal, and then waited a year to take his Hunter training.. Took the course Weekend of early goose season, but because I pushed him. Had to explain to him there is no Rifle/shotgun season for deer where we hunt. Easy mistake,
Oh well maybe he'll be a ok shot, and things will be ok. If not I don't think I will be missing shots to make him feel better. Plan to get him out for squirrel and ducks/geese. Maybe some coyotes if he seems ok..
If they can't do it in front of the TV , use an Ipod or Text iten they're not interested. Just about any activity involving physically moving their body they have little interest in--unless its borrowing daddy's car.
I think a few people have touched on a few possible under lying reasons.
Doubt I will ever go Moose hunting. Despite having a fair bit of freedom for days here, weekend get aways. Extended trips are very difficult. Then to we have a statistically proven declining quality of life. We work longer for less. What does this mean for young families? It means unlike my parents, mom and dad are working longer for less, if dad goes away for two weeks, mom is left to care for the kids, do the shopping, the laundry, get little Johnny to hockey/soccer...and join the rat race.
When I was growing up cable TV was a new fangled thing. I relied on getting out of the house, seeing my friends, doing things to socialize. Todays younger society "socializes" on Facebook, texting etc.
Whats one of the biggest draws to going to hunting?
Camaraderie.
Used to be, no such thing as Facebook, texting, the web and forums
:)
Re the expense.
No kidding, Ive spent a small fortune getting equipped for this/that. I still don't have a truck or ATV despite a growing need. Can't imagine what its like for a 20 something trying to get outfitted with a baby on the way or in the crib
With the comments posted do you think that with the end of the boomer generation the hunting camps too will subside as the next generation hasnt the time, interest or money?
I'm thinking you're pretty much right on, if it doesn't have wifi or a cell tower nearby, it's a no go.
WiFi...Cell tower..Heck I know of two lads who wouldn't come to our camp because we didn't have satellite TV...( in fact we don't have a TV..period). They opted to go to the camp down the road ( same family).
Can't imagine them going to a Moose camp with NO electricity. :scream:
yup hunted moose for 25 years..then group went down to 4..now they have lost their jobs so no go..and i drew a bull tag..My son went when he was 16 and shot a bull first day..and the following year his buddy went with us and shot a cow..both said it was too easy and havent been back...that was in 1995...have been trying to recruite some new guys but the cost and the 16 hr drive scares them off.
I'm hesitant to agree with you - I don't think this is the norm. I'm one of the younger members (just a little under 30) at our camp, and I love turning off my work phone and disconnecting. So do many others in the camp. While the 'older' generation likes to read paper, I buy books on my iPad. So while we're doing the same thing when relaxing at the end of the day, I use a different medium to do it. That doesn't mean I'm all over social media and can't live without it, in fact, I love getting away from it. Until recently, we did not have cell service at our camp; the addition of it has enabled far better communication while in the hunt.Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
As for young hunters, we have a mixed bag. Two of the newer members are active in planning and executing hunt strategy with fading input from the older generation, as well as opening and closing the camp -- the first to arrive and the last to leave. While some others arrive when all the preparation has been done and leave before camp gets closed. This is fine too, everyone gets some work done, and I think the 'overachievers' are fine with their role, while the ones who might do a little less are fine with this as well.
New recruitment has been tough to say the least. Those who weren't raised in a hunting family, or brought into the experience with hunting friends at a younger age, are less likely to be interested. One guy in particular has been 'trying' to get his PAL & Hunter Ed done for about 10 years. This year he lost a $200 bet as he still doesn't have his license. It seems that if you're brought up in a camp, you stay with that camp as your friends and family are there. If you're not brought up in a camp, or a hunting family, I think it is a harder sport to break into for numerous reasons (i.e. licensing, access to knowledge, property, and friends to do it with). Compare to a league sport, you sign up, buy the gear, and go to the arena/diamond/field/pitch etc.
We have also had issues finding people who are the 'right fit' for the camp. Let me explain. We love to hunt, but its not our priority. Yes we're all at the camp for a common goal - deer. However, the priority is much greater than weighing down the meat pole. Its the camaraderie and friendships developed year over year. More than anything, we like to enjoy ourselves. Its not a big deal if we're not in the bush at first light; if we don't hunt all day; if we only get in 2 hunts instead of 3 - no biggie. The right attitude is hard to find. I don't think we're being too selective, but the camp belongs to the members and we want to continue to enjoy it the way we have been and are continuing to enjoy it. This year there are 5 new guests coming out for the deer hunt, all the members are excited. It is certainly the exception to the rule. It will be the first year in about 10 that we have a FULL camp.
We got one new member, first one since my brother and I were old enough to join. He is a buddy of mine, and has no problem committing time and resources to the effort.
He is a stand up guy, and very dependable and reliable, which is why he was invited.
I don't know if it's hard to find guys to commit, or just hard to find the RIGHT guys.
At the end of the day, age only plays a small role in getting people to commit. I can assure you that all of today's diehard older moose/deer hunters were -years ago- diehard young hunters. For all the young guys out there a little piece of advice, choose your company wisely, take your time selecting hunting partners and once you establish a good core group of guys (usually 2-3) stick with them. People say and do stupid things sometimes, take a deep breath carry on and ignore, we all are guilty of it.
I don't have an issue with guys outright stating that they can't make it to camp on a particular year, the problem I have is with the "serial offenders" that yank your chain, promise to show up and come up with a lame-azz excuse for not showing up. Ring a bell? Usually every camp has a number of these guys. The members that really enjoy the comradery, atmosphere and thrill of the hunt work hard to plan, improve and enjoy the camps. Sadly, not every member thinks this way, many of them are stragglers that choose not to take the time,money or effort and join in the work. I've learned over the years not to take it personally, I work my darndest for the good of the camp and enjoy every minute of it while I'm there and constantly plan for future years when I'm not.
I usually agree with you Sawbill but this is pushing it. Its not cheap to go hunting, and whether you want to believe it or not, the cost of living has gone up since you were in your 20s. If I wasnt blessed and lucky enough to be born into a family with an established hunt camp, which costs me nothing except helping out, there is no chance I'd be able to take off a week for both moose and deer. In fact I'd struggle with just one week.Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
Id like to echo Fionn's reply (which was very well written and I feel addresses many of the common facts that face todays 20 somethings.)
Like every camp the two biggest issues we encounter is recruitment and fitting in with the guys. Luckily we have 3 guys in our roster of 12 who are under the age of 30, so things are looking up for the long term survival of the camp. But it is very hard to find someone who seems to fit in with a group of guys who have known each other for 30+ years. Our camp is very organized and our primary motivation is the hunting, so you cant bring up a group of guys who are looking for a week away to just drink beer (which is ok, but its a different type of hunt).
Of three of us who are under 30, we all turn off our cell phones aside from the times we call home (for a mid week hello to the wives). Depending on how individuals are brought up really dictates they're dependance on modern amenities.
A young guy who hasn't been raised with the enjoyment and serenity of the woods is unlikely to appreciate the "getting away" and is equally unlikely to hunt. So we can take all the pot shots at youngsters today, but its really not fair game.
The hardest thing for me, is the time away from work. As a guy who is a relative junior in our company, I only have a couple weeks vacation a year... Now Id love to spend EVERY minute of my vacation time hunting but it really isn't a realistic practice.
I hunt deer every year at camp, and ensure I'm committed for a full week. But to try to throw an additional week of moose hunting in there isnt in the cards for me YET. I really cant afford to pay for the expense of another week away from work, in combination of the price of food, fuel, butchering, etc. At this stage of the game I will have to pick my battles. I suspect for many younger hunters they are in the same boat.
Once my father passed ( I was 19) the number of people around me who hunted went from 1 to none. My own life at the time changed directions and it wasnt until a few years ago (when I got divorced) that I decided to hunt again.Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
Im pushing 50, have free time, both from home and work, dont have the financial commitments youngsters starting out do. And its all I can do, to get started. And theres still some big speed bumps to clear.
My GF wants to start joining me. Her family has property...great...except we need a 4x4 to get into it. We really need an atv to reach certain area's, if not to hunt to do some work.....and what if, she feathers a Doe/Buck....Yeah, we are going to have fun getting it out.....and then what, throw it on the roof of my VW ;)
Heck, I am seriously gung ho to get up there most weekends (its only Huntsville), start doing some work. Fixing old stands, getting new ones in, fix the place up, etc, etc. Her brother who really is the only one with a truck capable...Well he's got a career that ties him to the desk, a young family....
Times have changed, the bigger the more complex an adventure, the harder it will be getting people to commit.
Staring down the pipe at the big 3-O, I'm the youngest one at the camp by at least 30 years and the only one of the members' sons to commit to a full week of moose hunting. Work, as many of you have mentioned, is really what dictates how much time young guys can commit these days. I get 15 days holidays a year, 7 or 8 of which are used for moose/deer and the other half with the wife-to-be.
I can say though, once you find a good add to your group or camp, hang on to them. I invited a friend back to the camp for a work weekend (it was spring wood weekend) who had been interested in joining our deer hunt. He asked what kind of work was involved and then opted to not show up . . . his invitation for deer camp that year got lost in the mail.
I'm looking ahead at 45 when the members of the camp will be 75 or older . . . god help me if I'm still the youngest one there for an entire week. Everyone chips in and gets the job done, but at 75 . . .
10-15 years ago the starting salary was about $35K and the price of gas was 40-50 cents.
Now the starting salary is about $40k and gas is $1.30 and even higher on some days.
I think inflation is one of the main reasons. In addition, many guys who are in their 20's and 30's grew up playing video games with less physical activities than the generation before. They are used to having amenities and a smaller percentage can do without amenities.
Nailed it. Any 'youngster' who hasn't been exposed likely doesn't get it. If I were to bring a little cousin out (who is ADDICTED) to his phone, I would take it away from him for the week then let him decide what's better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Naiscoot
I struggled with vacation for a couple years, but I negotiated for more, and more, and more. Now I have so much its tough to use it all... If you're not in a union contract, try to negotiate for more vacation instead of a pay raise next year.
I find it funny that every generation complains about the younger generation....Really? Guess what? the generation before you complained about your generation LOL
Our whole moose camp 10-12 guys aged 30's to 70's stopped going after years of succesfull moose hunting. What started out as $500/wk crept up to $1500/wk. Eventually people say enough is enough. We are all still avid hunters, but stick closer to home with local deer camps, grouse, ducks & geese, etc,etc. Just no moose.
As well, to be honest I just enjoy the deer hunt more than the moose hunt and rather keep my vacation time for that. It was tough taking two weeks off so close together, even more so now with the young lads hockey schedule!
Not as young as some here but at 33 and fairly tech-connected I definitely take offense to the bullshyte spouted by sawbill.
Tech access or lack of it doesn't factor into my decisions to hunt at all. Before you even get to the point of worrying about jobs and finances... what about the fact its nearly impossible to take off a week of school as a HS senior or throughout college? That's a 4-6 yr stretch of no big game hunting right there. Then you graduate and land a crap entry level gig and have no discretional income or job security for another 3 years.
So now your time away from big game hunting is pushing a decade... and you have a gf or wife and a kid on the way... this isn't the 50s and women are no longer "fine" with their men just screwing off for a week or two while they're forced to do everything to keep the home running smoothly.
But yeah... its all because younger hunters prefer ipads over camp camraderie. Eff me.
Maybe it's because people prefer not to hang out with people who talk about their entire generation with contempt....
WOW for someone only 33 you sure are living in the dark...plan your vacations accordingly...i have only missed 1 deer season in over 40 years of hunting! A good student can afford to take a week off school...i have to agree with the post that the majority of young kids today are so hooked on their electronic gadgets that they can't even take a dump without a phone glued to their ears...also they spend hours planted on the couch playing stupid video games instead of been outside getting exercise and fresh air and we wonder why so many kids today are obese!
What does this have to do with the financial aspect of hunting?Quote:
Originally Posted by Brampton Mike
You need to make a hunting APP and then they would be interested.:moose:Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
Our new ballparks here are empty all summer. The soccer field has little kids only--no teens are interested in playing. We can't get young'uns out curling in the winter months. Free skating during the Christmas holidays at our arena and all you see are aged 40 and 50 and over taking advantage.
You tell me where the teens are then--other than hanging out at the malls or just plain 'hanging out'.
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
If they can afford cell phones, ipods, ipads, xboxes and who knows how much for the games then they can afford to hunt! they are just too lazy too!
I have said for along time if your were to call a hunting meeting in most areas, out of a hundred hunters you would be lucky to get 5 guys under the age of thirty-five, and as has been noted, they probably be more interested in the electronic part of the hunt rather than leaving all that crap at home and just go and enjoy the time in the bush.
I posted a link earlier in 2013 or late 2012 that detailed the number of hunters in Canada is the highest its ever been (2.5M rings a bell), and a huge chunk of those hunters are 30 and younger.
There's no shortage of young hunters. Likely, as Welsh pointed out, they just have no interest in hanging with camps that will harrass them, treat them with disdain or as the camp b!+ch. Or, they have educations and careers that are simply more important in their youth.
As for planning one's vacation better or skipping school... well I guess if you're not paying for your education or you're taking a complete joke program you can skip a week or two. I know for me that was never an option. Neither my profs nor my project mates would have been so blase about it. The only time I missed post secondary was for important family deaths.
You also ignored the other component of vacations... my wife supports my hunting. To a point. She's not looking to sit on her duff wasting a week of her holidays to keep our house/family in order while I'm off relaxing.
As a young hunter in my 20's I feel I should put my input on this. I have never been apart of a moose/deer camp, and its not that I don't want to be, its because I wouldn't feel comfortable going up to camp with a bunch of old guys I didn't know for a week. It has nothing to do with technology or being lazy or money or time, I would just rather be in a camp with people my own age.
Dilemma: People my age don't have a camp nor equipment nor money nor time.
Then you haven't found the right camp. We have tons of fun and harness the energy of youth - by this I don't mean make them camp .Quote:
Originally Posted by x_xeon_x
Hunting 60+ years ago was a necessity. It provided meat for the winter. It is obviously not a necessity on most areas of Ontario anymore times have changed.
I have been going to camp family camp where my grandfather was one of the first members. My brother and I are next 2 in line for memberships and within the last 4 years 2 guys have sold their shares back to the camp but none were offered back to myself or my brother to buy into. Really pisses me off as I would spend more weekends as a guest up there for work weekends and for the hunt spending the time and money to show I was commuted and the miserable old pricks don't care. Now they are talking of taking down the old camp and building new. Now I am an owner of a carpentry company with all my own tools vehicle trailers and everything and I now damn well I will be asked to go help build the new camp and then they will offer a camp membership at 3 times the cost of what it is right now. And the first thing I'm going to tell them is where to shove it. It pusses me off the most because it has been in the family for 3 generations and I wanted to be the next generation but now I would rather go buy a piece of land and build my own
I have to disagree with sawbill and Brampton Mike.
I am 23, so I guess that makes me one of the young guys. I am about an avid hunter as they come, but this is the first year I will really have any time or money that could be put towards any kind of hunting trip. Bottom line is, I am married, just wrapping up my electrical apprenticeship, I am the superintendent of a small apartment building and i am working extra side jobs to make ends meet. I take one week off in the summer with my wife, and to think about taking another week really stretches the budget and my responsibilities at home. I have been with my current employer for 3 years now and am starting to feel a little bit of job security.
Yes, I have a cell phone etc, but only because in today's world you have to have one. When I get away into the bush the first thing I do is shut it off and enjoy the peace and quiet.
Also, to say that taking a week off from any post secondary education is no problem is quite an insult to those who are actually in said post secondary programs. I don't know what it has been like in the past, but nowadays, you miss a week, you fail the semester, or are put so far back you have little chance of getting a decent grade.
Bottom line, the moose hunt itself is a SIGNIFICANT expense, that just cant be justified by most of today's young people who are struggling to get by. When you add on extra time and work commitments it just isn't worth it.
Now, come back to me when I'm a bit older, have a bit more income and a little more free time and I would love to join.
I didn't disagree with Sawbill, because as I mentioned I think its just one of the underlying issues. It's not the only issue, it's may be the smallest underlying issue, it's an underlying issue.
True, over all numbers may be up. So to is our population. I wonder what the per capita number of hunters is these days. Someone earlier mentioned something about youth not understanding the outdoors. If you don't connect it makes spending a week/two harder, ergo the desire to commit to a two weeks in October when its April……….
… Its one thing to rent a cottage for a weekend fishing with your school/college buddies, pound back a case or 4 and quite another to spend a week/two moose hunting.
There have been dozens of threads about todays "youth" and some things that plague them…Doesn't mean every single one of them, its a broad brush stroke. Most have agreed with those underlying themes. Do those things magically disappear just because the topic is hunting?
One of the biggest draws to hunting is the camaraderie.
Its a proven, statistical, hard fact society and none more so then youth today are "losing" socialization skills. Texting, Facebooking, forums are replacing letter writing, talking on the phone, the desire to sit around and do nothing more exciting than chatting by a lamps light.
One does not need to make time to stay connected with their best friends from College/Uni anymore, all you need to do is send a text or tweet 24/7 and speak in wonderful colourful words most not much longer than 3 or 4 letters.
Im not a hunter. how ever I would love to get into hunting. I follow many of the bunting threads here and learn a lot. And I am hoping to get my gun license and hunting license mabe end of the year or early next year. I'm an avid out doors man and grew up playing in the woods and fishing and all that. I was not born into a hunting or an out doors family for that matter. Its just me and my 2 other brothers. We are all in are 20's. Me only being 20 and my oldest brother being I think 28 lol. We do a lot of fishing together and the past few years we have been seriously looking into getting into hunting. We were just talking the other day about going for the one stop up in Uxbridge vary soon.
As for us young people being stuck to are phones it couldn't be farther then the truth. I love get5ing away from it all but havent been able to for most of the year with the gf being sick. For me it might be. As my gf is not well and its a must for me to be In sell rang in order to be sure that she is ok. Unless I can find someone like a friend who can make sure she's ok if she's having one of those days were she can't do much. I love when I can turn my phone off and go play in the woods or fish or just be outside. But living in the city can be vary hard at times with it being a long and costly drive to some places. And not to mention the time for me just isn't there right now mabe next year. Now when I do want to get away she doesn't hassle me cause she knows how happy the outdoors makes me and its a big stress re leaver.
I go to school and I work. Joining a camp for deer or moose at this point and time and putting out $1000 or more is not in the budget.
like most are saying if you don't grow up around it the chances are you wont ever get into it. My gf loves fishing and being in the woods with me. She even says she wants to get In to hunting with me and my brothers and she's from a family that doesn't look upon hunting and fishing as fun and even less so on hunting. So without me and my brothers chances are she would never have gotten into it.
the bottom line is unless you are brought up in a family that is some what Involved in the outdoors you probably wont be into it. I have found it hard getting started myself being in a non hunting family. money is also a big factor. Also just cause I can aford a phone and a tv and all that ( the only things I ow ln that are gaming systems are the original xbox that I got for my bday when was 14 and a wii I got last year witch only have fishing and hunting games for:fish::rolleyes: ) doesn't mean squat. My phone is for work and emergencys and I don't have a house phone no need. Truck is a toy and my transportation. Tablet was for school. Trust me I would love a nice trailer and atvs to go with it but they don't pay the bills and the gf would have a fit lol.
BUt I better go before I rant on some more hahahahha:D
Just my take
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Originally Posted by Fionn
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Originally Posted by Naiscoot
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Originally Posted by Oddmott
I'd like to say thanks to the guys for those posts, for taking the time to 'enlighten' me on some the tribulations you younger guys face in today's world. I sounds like it has become much more complicated and demanding that it was for many of us older guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by kdp89
We make fun of the guys (two of them) that sit with their iThingy out answering in incessant ring tones while they carry on text conversations with their GF's. Maybe that is just the way it is now to help them accept being away, we don't really get it, but then we never had the opportunity to call anyone back in the day....long drive to the closest pay phone :)
I'll try to be more understanding this year.....
I just wanted to put my two cents in about younger hunters. Since I was able to get my younger members to be able to come up on a consistent basses. The son in-law and son, I have learned a few things. For years I complained how come you cant get away its only a weekend or two or a couple weeks a year. Then after putting in some thought here is what I found. As others have posted. School - first job- then marriage and new babies. Each have taken up tremendous amount of time for them. now that they have settled into there lives they have a bit more time for the things they love to do such as the out doors. It is a juggling act but still more time. As far as me being older I have had a learning curve with it all. I realized I was in the same boat as these young men. I did not have the same amount of time for teaching my own kids do to the same situations. now that I do, have the time to teach them and my grandkids what little I do know. As well they have the time to teach me. I now see the benefits of texting out in the field as apposed to communicating over a walky-talky although we bring both. I can see the practical of synthetic or composite over wood. The benefits of having there young strength and endurance as well as new ideas and enthusiasm. Has brought new light and life back into our camp. It took a bit of give and take on both sides, but now that I was able to get them out of bed at 430am every thing is great.
Don
Well, not really. Only for a small minority of Canadian hunters living in more remote areas. As early as ~1880, hunting had essentially become a form of middle class recreation, and the middle class sportsmen began crowding out the subsistence hunters who had preceded them and introducing a class-driven code of fair chase intended to reserve game for recreational use. But let's not pursue that particular digression....Quote:
Originally Posted by Fionn
I think many people here are seriously underestimating the barriers to entry. I am 44 years old & live in the suburbs (well out in the suburbs; I can see a silo from my backyard). I'd love to hunt moose. But I don't own a truck -- it's not a practical vehicle for my family what with the cost of gas, the fact of three kids, and so on. I don't have a place to keep a trailer and an ATV, unless I somehow convince my wife that the garage should be used to store something I will use only a couple of weeks a year. Even if I could store the trailer and ATV all year, the cash outlay for truck, trailer, and ATV is simply unjustifiable. So there will be no moose. That's reality for a lot of people.
I Think it all has to do with how the younger hunters were brought up and how they were introduced to hunting.. Every year since I can remember my dad has taken me out of school for a couple days of the moose and deer hunt. Every year I would always be excited for hunting season and still am. Now a days I still go hunting with my dad and the same group of guys I've gone with for many years. I don't have problem leaving the cell at homeland just spending time in the bush with my dad.
Economic times have changed. Gone are the lifetime jobs that paid well and offered decent holidays. Most mid30 guys couldnt afford to hunt moose even if they could get time off from the two jobs many are working. It isn't the world I worked in that's for sure (I'm 61).
DanO, when you were a kid it was exactly the same way. In the early 50's there were mostly low paying jobs, parents had to work multiple jobs, few were permanent, nobody had more than one radio and when TV's came in, nobody could afford them, let alone have one for every room. But I remember the kids still got out--hunted and fished. They either walked, biked or hitchhiked.
Now the hunting and fishing pastimes are competing with Xboxes and cell phones.
Ok well can anyone connect me to any groups that are looking for new members. I already have a couple places to deer hunt and I have a group that I moose hunt with but I am always looking to connect with other hunters. I would def be open to joining a group for the deer hunt. I can always bow hunt at my other spots and would really to be able to open some doors to more hunting opportunities.
It's been said multiple times already but I just wanted to add my spin. As a 25 year old rookie hunter working 2 part time jobs (despite having a good education) I would love to spend a week Moose hunting. However, I am unable to commit to a full week off not only due to financial constraints but also because as the low man on the totem pole you want to be as dependable as possible in order to put yourself ahead of the next guy vying for that full time with benefits position. As far as contributing financially it would depend on the amount. For myself this being the first year of hunting the start up costs for me to deer hunt has left my budget stretched. I'm thankful I live on a rural property with my stand in walking distance and gas costs or travel time are not a factor. It's just not possible for me at this time in my life to afford an additional week long hunt that could could me $1000+.
As far as technology goes, yes my smartphone does come into the bush with me. However its purpose is to mark GPS locations of my stand, signs etc. From May-October I spend a great deal of time fishing with my 50 year old father and he spends likely more time on his smart phone than I do so while yes my generation does typically let their lives be dominated by technology it is not necessarily confined to teenagers and 20somethings.
Geez, based on all the comments posted here it would appear that I am very fortunate to have recruited 2 enthusiastic young lads. (well, this year anyway). We shall see what the future brings. We are having a meeting this afternoon to finalize the logistics of our trip. Mainly, who is bringing what for gear and making the food list.
All four of us are employed with full time jobs. The priority is hunting and taking time off for that activity even though 2 of the guys will receive zero wages. Now that is commitment!
The secret is that employers no longer care about their employees so loyalty to a company is no longer an issue. You have to look out for number 1 which is yourself. Ten years down the road you say to yourself I should have done this or that but guess what, it's too late. You will never recoup those lost years. Enjoy yourself while you can because life is too short not to do so. Where there is a will, there is a way even if it means taking a Grey Hound bus or train to the moose destination to save on cost and hook up with a group already on site. Four guys in a truck also helps to keep the expenses down especially for fuel. You don't all need an ATV. Just a couple for the group is plenty to haul a moose out of the bush. Go back to basics and you will find moose hunting affordable.
The gang!
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...a/100_4270.jpg
From some of the posts here regarding the stereotypes that apparently "young" hunters fit into its no wonder some camps are having trouble finding new members. I'm 28 and most of my friends and peers hunt and have no problems finding camps interested. Maybe "young hunters" arnt the problem with you finding new members for your moose camps...
Couldn't agree with anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffD
Also here is another stat that points to the problem.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/ontario...port-1.1473423
You can say all you want about phones and game system but this is among the biggest problem. You need money to hunt, without it you can't do anything or go anywhere whether is budget or any other type of hunt. Even though you may get money from the government, the important stuff is looked after 1st. Hunting is optional if you have any money left and that a big if. Hunting is no longer a cheap person sport.
Forsaking buying those expensive Iphone, Ipad etc. frees up a lot of money towards recreational activities such as hunting and fishing. It's all about allocating the few dollars that you have. Hunting does not have to be optional.
I think several posters have said the right reasons being primarily time and money allocations are hard for younger hunters with growing families to "justify". Younger or older, these barriers exist. Sure, they are not insurmountable if there is enough drive to make it happen, but so many other things arise to push the hunting to the back burner (especially Moose hunting given the more remote geographic locales and generally more infrastructure needed (4X4 truck, ATV, etc.). Other types of hunting are considerably less expensive to engage in, so Moose hunting falls by the wayside.
I'm not young (62) and have touched base with a couple of "Moose hunter wanted" posts here in OOD in the spring, but I only have a puddle-jumper car right now, no ATV or camper trailer, etc. and I found the costs projected by some groups seemed high. As it is, I've got a bull tag for 21A and will embark on a solo shoestring hunt tailored to my infrastructure limitations since I did not find a suitable group set-up to join. It's a 14 hour drive and a "cold turkey" adventure since I have never hunted in 21A before, so I'm relying on Google Earth and topo maps to decide exactly where to go.
I would say don't pick on the "young" hunters, the barriers are more universal than that.
The way folks here are slamming the younger guys for their use of technology is simply the reiteration of the older generations slamming them back in 1970 for being self-absorbed drug-addled idealists. Le plus ca change.
Im 23 and I have the same problem. Nobody will commit to what I want to do. I usually just end up going solo, im getting used to that now. Drew a bull tag a couple years ago, hunted one week with some other people, and then the rest of the season alone looking for my bull. right near the last week of the season I ended up connecting with a young bull. I was happy, and the satisfaction of hunting that long and hard by yourself and being successful is just awesome.
I havent met anybody who is willing to follow me on a hunt for moose. My longest trek to date was 18 km in a day (this season actually), on foot. That was a long day looking for moose sign and rut activity. Was a very quiet season, and a cow stole our bull from us, so there wasnt much chance of calling him away from her. Needless to say we were unsuccessful, but we gave it a good shot. You always learn something in the bush, so you never come home empty handed, and thats what I love about it.
I have dumped a ton of money into outdoor recreation (hunting fishing and trapping) because thats what I live for. Theres nothing else Id rather do with my money.
You just need to find the right people to bring hunting. Find the ones who want to go, not the ones that are "forced" to go.
I have only one question for you. Are you married?
I would be the exact same way if I was single. But I made my choices, I am not single, I have other responsibilities, and therefore dropping everything to run away on my own is just irresponsible.
I lucked out this year. My wife is sending me on a mulie trip in BC, because she knows how much I love hunting. But if she hadn't of planned the trip I would not be going anywhere, because in my mind our resources are better allocated elsewhere. This doesn't mean I don't really care about the out doors or I have no drive, or least of all that I don't want to get away from technology. It means that I am trying to be a responsible adult and look after my priorities at home before selfishly leaving the wife to keep up with the work and losing 2 weeks pay.
We older guys aren't slamming technology. There's nothing wrong with buying a GPS or any modern hunting device. We're saying that a kid with $500 in his pocket isn't going to spend it on a rifle, ammo or gas that he gets to use at most one week of the hunt.
He's going to spend it on a cell phone and contract that he gets to use 365 days a year.
...and I never touched an illegal drug in my life.
I think you just proved Welsh's point exactly. Older generations blow smoke about younger generations, without having a clue what they're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
When I went through high school you asked who's doing drugs. Now you ask who's not using drugs.
And how in the world does that mean I don't know what I'm talking about? I didn't go through life with my head in the sand.
Many of you older guys are also complaining that he can't be dragged away from his electronic toys, characterizing him as lazy, and condemning his choices. Let me quote an example:Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
If they can't do it in front of the TV , use an Ipod or Text iten they're not interested. Just about any activity involving physically moving their body they have little interest in--unless its borrowing daddy's car.
Who posted that gem? You did. Post 11.
I could go on.
People have been complaining about "kids today" since Cain slew Abel. It's tiresome.
I'll weigh in on the discussion here. I'm young by some standards (29), but I'm also an incredibly young hunter; This will only be my 2nd year deer hunting, and this weekend was my first ever attempt at bird hunting (unsuccessful). I've killed more grouse and small game with my car! There was a point where up until last Fall, I had never actually seen a deer in the woods. I had seen them on roads, in fields, and coming out of the trees... but I had never sat in the bush and watched a young buck with his head to the ground hot on the trail of a doe. I grew up in farming country in Peterborough County, friends and neighbours and extended family hunted... but not my immediate family.
I don't live a lavish lifestyle; The cars I own, I don't make any payments on (10+ and 18+ years old), with minimal upkeep costs. I have a mortgage, but on a house in the country and not something in the suburbs or a McMansion on a lake. I work 9-5 in a good job, but I also bust my when not at work... volunteer firefighter, small business owner, single-dad to two kids (50% of the time), I cut firewood and supplement my heat with wood. I have minimal credit card debt (ie... paid off monthly).
By all standards, I should have lots of extra income (when I see people making car payments, loan payments, putting their kids in hockey, etc etc)... but the money isn't there. I haven't been able to put anything into an RRSP in almost 12 months. Laid off for 3 months in the spring set me back a lot.
I have 5 days of vacation this year, because of the new job. ALL of those days will be used for deer hunting. I've caught one fish all season. I want to go hunting, I want to gain the experience as well as put food on my plate. I just happen to live in an area where I don't know many people. I can't take off on the weekend and go hunting, as that's when I have my kids.
Excuses excuses... we young people are full of them. I overheard some coworkers saying they wouldn't be moose hunting because they keep getting calf tags and it wasn't worth it to them.
But at the same time... I'm one of the younger guys in our deer camp. This camp has been around for over a century, passed down through the family. We've got 3 young guys, a young female, and the rest is middle-aged (50+) guys. It's a family; the wives and daughters are there. I spent time there as a kid with this family, but always in the summer, never hunting. Now I live 7 hours away, and I wish I could be there every weekend, even though it's all crown land. At least 3 members of the camp will be coming in from Alberta to hunt for the week. This place is their sanctuary, and they've opened it up to me. You haven't experienced the joys of the hunt until you've stood in a stand of mature oak trees at dusk, watching owls fly by and calling each other. Or listened to crows flying overhead during the day, singing songs to themselves.
Every day that goes by, my kids get a little older, and I get a little closer to being able to share those experiences with them. But until then, I'm full of reasons why I can't commit to joining a moose hunting group, or going duck hunting, etc etc... life just gets in the f'ing way.
I imagine a lot of "younger" guys could be like me as well. And that is that they are willing to join camps but not willing to be camp b!t@# for the next 10 years. I'm all up for doing as much as I can and spreading the work around, but I am not for being treated like your piece of crap because I'm the new guy.
There you have it... 4 pages of quality answers as to why younger hunters are hesitant or unable to commit to expensive, weeklong hunting excursions.
Plenty of great reasons such as important education commitments, important employment commitments, important family commitments (all of which greatly impact the fact that "the hunt" has become too costly and too complicated for many to partake in at certain points of their young-ish lives) and the fact that being mistreated by older established camp members is not anyone's idea of a good time.
Nowhere did anyone state their reason for not being able to join in a $1000+, 5-10 day, remote moose hunt was poor cell service or lack of satellite television.
I'd like to throw another reason into the mix (one that sadly isn't the case for me, yet).
More and more women are taking up hunting. Since 2005, something close to 30% of new hunters in the U.S. and 24% of new hunters in Canada have been females.
Because of this, many husbands/fathers are choosing to step away from their traditional male dominated hunt camps to introduce their wives/daughters to hunting in a less testosterone charged atmosphere.
Quite simply, times are a-changing, and hunt camps will have to as well.
I know one moose group that has taken to a lottery system. It's co-owned by 40 individuals (roughly 1/4 are women) who ALL can't attend every single year. So they draw lots to see who will attend each year. I believe it's something like Yr 1 - men, Yr 2 - co-ed, Yr 3 - men, Yr 4 - women... so on and so forth.
Every member gets to hunt every couple of years, which is all any of them could really afford anyways, and they get to enjoy both gender exclusive and inclusive camp atmospheres.
Still allot of reasons sound like excuses....I personally know guys here who find time to fish every weekend all summer and take vacations with the families down south during the march breaks etc etc....but they can't commit to a day of clearing trials or a day of fixing up the camp come fall. So I'm taking some of these 4 pages with a grain of salt..what gets said here is often not reality.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
Even the comments about being 'Camb Btch'...I find it hard to believe that to be true...we don't make the young members do more than anyone else, but yes they do get asked to do more of the physical stuff like filling the water tank on the roof of the buss. because we don't want to send the 65 yr old guy with a bad hip up there. Makes me wonder if some guys just aren't used to be asked to do stuff in general.
And like I said in a earlier post...we had two young guys (family of members) who choose to go to the other camp, based specifically on the fact that it had satellite TV and they didn't find sitting around playing cards with the camp 'fun'.
I know for a fact that the camps around here are dieing off....ours is one of them. We've had a few new guys come in and stay and a few left after a yr or two because of the reasons mentioned earlier ( family/money stuff etc.) We adapted a bit by holding our Deer camp the second week, so more guys (with low seniority at work) could get time off etc. That worked and we retained two other guys. But the numbers are no where near what they were 15 yrs ago.
As an outsider who isn't really part of a hunt camp... unless you'd consider a father & 2 sons a hunt camp... I can't really try to disagree with you MP. Maybe youth are lazier and less willing to help with camp days.
But judging from the stories shared here by Gilroy and yourself and others, and from my own observation of men in work and recreation and in general... I'd be willing to bet that the #s are pretty well split down the middle for lazy unreliable old farts vs lazy unreliable youths.
My dad's old camp started building a new cabin in 88 when i was 8 yrs old. Dad made all sorts of time to help with building it (easy for him as he lived closer than 60% of the crew, and being a construction foreman he provided most of the tools) but it still wasn't completed by the time he quit the club at the age of 32 in 1992.
The main reason for the delay in completion? Lack of commitment by the CAMP OWNERS, a pair of brothers who were about 20 yrs older than most of the members. One of the bros lived on site and preferred to spend most of his time drunk vs productive, the other brother managed at Schneider's in southern ON and rarely had time to drive 5-6hrs to the camp for work weekends.
For every story an older guy may have about younger hunters... a younger hunter can match with a negative story about an older hunter.
I agree hunting equipment is expensive, but I disagree that you need to have every piece. I have to make choices I have a young family still so I make do with all my equipment. I rarely buy anything other then ammo, when I do buy something I probably by used and fix it to suit myself. Hunting doesn't have to be expensive assuming you can hunt not far from where you live. I own several guns various shotguns most from my youth or purchased more then a decade ago all purchased used. I hunted grouse and rabbits most of my life with a single shot and even hunted ducks with a 16 gauge when lead shot was legal.
Most of my equipment I have gathered over a lifetime. Coleman laterns purchased over the years I have , Coleman stoves 3, about 5 dome tents all still used the oldest is 30 years (When they first hit the market)
Fishing equipment the same thing axes, chainsaws, boat, canoes (2).
Point is hunting is only as expensive as you make it. Heck I still don't have a game cam yet. One of the things I teach kid's is to make do with waht you have.
Someone mentioned he won't be anyone's at any camp. Well I will tell you when I go out hunting or camping I do expect the younger fellas do a good chunk of the work if they are capable of it. That's part of the learning process. When camping my kid's are expected to pick up the firewood after I cut it all. When I took the you lad out duck hunting the other day. He loaded my truck got my boots. Also before we even left he helped me plant some shrubs. It's called respect. In return he got his first duck hunting trip he used my gun well I handled the canoe. Heck I haven't even hunted with my gun yet.
Enough of my rambling just my 2 cents. I guess I'm just old school and becomming another old fart.
You right Oddmott...there is an 'Old Slug' in every camp...difference is they've been a fixture there so long nothing is ever expected or asked of them... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
I resemble that old slug at our camp come deer season, and a big reason for that is the countless hours I spend throughout the year that you never see when I am out fixing/building stands, clearing trails, dragging out firewood, hogging trails, keeping bait piles active, and an assortment of the other "biatch" work that has to be done but just isn't noticed by the 1 week wonders who also expect to do nothing and be catered to. I expect to relax during the deer season as this is the big reason I put all those hours of my time in to the camp, and it doesn't really feel like work either.
John
I find it is harder to get any age group of hunters to commit. Our camp is slowly shrinking, middle aged guys says they have no money, older guys with health problems, all ages not able to get time off work, and the kids too young can't miss school. Also women don't come to our camp so the ones who have girls only for children don't come at all.
Sounds pretty interesting people coming and going as they please and it all works out. Maybe some more details,how many acres are you hunting on for these 15 members.Are you hunting private or Crown land.How many guys get a stand. If people dont show for work weekends why do some show.Quote:
Originally Posted by REMAXER
Also some little details like how is your liability insurance.Your charging these guys per night,so do you have insurance when they fall/injure themselves on your property and they or their loved ones decide to sue you into the middles ages.
I am a young hunter 27 and as my peers stated the money and economy isn't what it once was to you baby boomers who are our parents . Houses have gone up so much , inflation ,gas ,food again housing . All this has put a huge impact on hunting making it seem more of a luxury for those getting there foot in the door .
I get two weeks of vacation a year one is used in the spring fishing the other is combined with long weekends . So no room for a week at camp . Another factor is we have a controlled deer hunt and no camp is required .
Technology if you do not keep updated you will be left behind ,yes I have a I phone , laptop ,flat screen etc but that is the future ,now kids get tablets in school instead of books see a trend ?
Hmmmm, where were all these "we need some hunters" camps this spring when I was looking for a group to join? OK, for the record, I'm interested in exchanging info with a Moose hunting group for next year. Lots of time, lol, to make sure the fit is right.
You might want to apply for this position under another forum "name".:moose:Quote:
Originally Posted by canthitathing
Your post made me rethink pushing a cousin of mine into hunting. He's also a world class mooch... and I don't think i could take having to pay for all the gear and supplies he uses on top of the rides I already give him.
Thanks for saving me from myself. lol
Young buck I am begining of Gen X or the end of the boomers depending how you look at it. But part of the problem I see is most people want everything new houses, computers, TV's what ever and they want it now and it doesn't work that way.
I can't count the number of times you lads 16 - 25 have said they want to go buy right away the crap I havae took me most of my life to aquire this junk.
I never had any help I buy all my equipment used from PC's to hunting and fishing equipment. I'm not saying you but most folks need to get their pirorities straight. BAby boomers didn't start out rich. Many were just as poor or even poorer then today's generation. When I was born my parents registered below the Canadian Poverty line (dad actually earned a second income from poker - yeah he was good).
Not trying to be insulting just my take on things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Young Buck
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigboss
i have a friend like this as well. scrounges for his fee for his two weeks at deer camp. stays maybe three nights. i have to supply him with smokes just to stay that long. has no problem using using any of our supplies or guns ( so cheap he wont even go get his PAL) then at the end of it all complains because he doesnt get enough meat from us after the hunt is all over with. And this guy is in his late 30's
Maybe they do, and their priorities simply don't happen to be the same as yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
This seems to be a possibility that several people here haven't considered, with all this talk of people "making excuses."
I have to disagree with that. If that is their pirorties and they cannot afford them because they feel they are something special and should magically have everything in life instantly then they need to reexamine them. Most people don't instantly have wealth some do but the majority doesn't. As I said before I can't start to count the number of people (young adults), that seem to think I have acquired all this crap over a life time. But yet they seem to think I did and that they should get it instantly as well. Doesn't work that way. It's called working your way up the ladder.
Get a kick speaking to teens, young adults that feel with no education and no experience they should be making 100K to sit on their .
The young lad I am teaching to hunt and handle guns was amazed at the various equipment I have aquired (nothing special). From Hunting and camping to automotive tools etc. I sat him down and showed him how old some of this equipment is and how I have rebuilt my own stuff over time years of sweat and tears. Yes some people get it easy but most don't it require something that many youth no longer seem to understand it require WORK.
Quote:
Originally Posted by welsh
The issue here is not that they can't afford their priorities. The issue is that they can't also afford to be members of some moose camp, prompting people like you to complain that they need to get their priorities straight because, as everyone knows, everyone whose priorities differ from yours is lazy and doesn't know the value of hard work.Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
Yes, yes. Young people are lazy, young people expect it all, young people ought to learn respect, blah, blah, blah. You're turning into a caricature with every passing word.
Im sometime surprised when people dig their heels in with respect to things that are widely accepted, known, whatever. Much has been written about Gen Y, just as much was written about Gen X and just as things have been and continue to be written about Baby Boomers.
Gen Y has a "fear of commitment". Its seen in their professional lives and personal.
Gen Y is also the instant access generation.
They've been pampered, told the world is theirs, and on and on and on.
Just one of hundreds of articles on it.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money...06-gen-y_x.htm
Finances/priorities. Some things apply to everyone young and old.
Some guys decide to buy bass boats, sacrificing vacations to sunny locales and dinners at restaurants. Some decide to buy trucks or ATVs. Me, I've sacrificed tons of common place luxuries many people just have to have (yearly vacations) (restaurants) etc, etc, etc, etc to buy my camera equipment. I cannot recall the last time I took 2 weeks off work and hopped on a plane. If I didn't have my camera equipment maybe Id have an ATV or a boat or maybe even 50 acres to call my own.
Then to, in this day and age we all have (broad terms) cable tv, ISP, Cells and much more. If I had to guess my yearly cost for my ISP/Cell/Tv is in the area of $3,000. <<Thats an expense my parents certainly didn't have. And incidentally more than covers the cost of Deer/Moose hunting for a week.
My parents walked to school in the snow uphill, they sacrificed, both loved the outdoors. for my Dad and my mother 4 day and 10 day trips into the bush were yearly things. Why? Because A) that was important to them and B) thats how they spent time with close friends/family…(in the absence of instant, 24/7 connectivity).
Im sure, if they were glued to the hip with their closest friends/family as todays youth/people are making the time to see them twice or thrice a year might not have been as high on the priority scale. My parents didn't even have cable TV for years and years. What did they do for "entertainment"? They went and visited friends, went camping, went fishing, went hunting.
How many people see kids playing hockey in the street anymore?
Obviously you are only focusing on the hunting portion when I am talking life in general. Most young people and article after article backs me up. They expect the world to drop in their lap.
I don't belong to any full time camp, I don't complain about life in general I take it as it comes. I don't belong to a "Real Camp" nor do I complain about it. Personally I cannot spend the money on it right now. Maybe some day I will build my own camp (Actually the lumber is sitting out back in the barn, just for that purpose). My point is to sometimes obtain objectives in life requires sacrifice very few are willing to do that and I see it every day in the News. The complaint about no job can't make enough money blah blah blah . I have turned down so many extra side jobs paying good coin it would make your head spin.
Currently my pirority are my wife and kids and their friends. Most of my spare time is spent with them. I don't have time for a full time camp nor do I complain about it. I don't do all the cool hunting and fishing trips others do on here primarily because I prefer and enjoy taking my kid's out on excursions. If people can't afford it instead of complaining about it do something.
Hunting and fishing doesn't requires a huge amount of money. I spend probably less then 100 a year on equipment. The rest I spend is to take my kid's and me out camping and fishing. By the way I have posted two myself and have seen at least a dozen camps looking for people that did not appear to be expensive.
By the way.anyone coming camping with me I would expect them to put more then their fair share in of work. Even the young lad I am teaching could understand that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by welsh
How's this for an excuse... Wife is due wit our second November 29th, got the OK to head to deer camp, Oct 31st back home on November 10th.
She goes to Doctor today, and was asked when are you do again? she says the 29th of November, dr says, yea, im gonna say 3-4 weeks I think your dialated already.
&%^$!!!!!!!!!
We'll see how this goes, off to the Midwife tomorrow and then hopefully an internal to get the facts.
Hunting is nowhere near as important as that date TR.....a no brainer and a good excuse :)
Early Congrats do you know yet boy or girl:thumbup:
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkeyRookie
Yes, I am talking about hunting because this is a thread about recruiting young hunters to moose camps.Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
"Article after article" backs nothing up. Any fool can write an article, especially that goofy lifestyle-section crap and the dumb business articles by various consultants and recruiters. Based on what? Someone's notion? Some methodologically flawed horsecrap someone put together? This stuff is junk. And "most young people?" You've done your own surveys, then? Or is this the availability heuristic at work?
"Kids today" were lazy and entitled and expected the world to drop in their laps in 1970, if you asked their progenitors. Kids have always had unrealistic expectations. There are lots of lazy young people today, because there always have been. There are also lots of hard working high achievers.
Sounds like a pretty lame excuse to me, TR. You kids today. In my day we left the wife home with her mother and went hunting.
No problem, right? The midwife will take pictures and email them to you?...:joker:Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkeyRookie
I mean how many children are born to service men serving their country overseas each and every year while their wives are home alone. No big event, right?
I know, I know...just kidding. Congrats on the soon to be addition to your family!
GW, I'm not sure what your getting at, you seem to be arguing for and against the young guys in the same post.
Many of us don't make it to camp because we have other priorities in our day to day lives that need taken care of... The opposite of expecting it to drop in our laps. I don't complain it's not fair that I can't go and that someone should pay for me. I'm a big boy and know that I have to work for what I get. Just like you have lumber in the shed for your future camp, I am working hard now when I am young so that I can have more opportunities later.
Im not trying to nitpick, but I stay home because I know that nothing is getting handed to me... But my priorities aren't right and I should be at camp?
Great post...! Couldn't agree more.
I've been following this thread with interest. My feeling is that it's not really a young/old thing. When it comes to hunting, people break into two categories. There are "hunters" and people who "go hunting".
Take a look at your average hunting camp out there. You might find 3 or 4 real hunters in a group of 12. They might be 21 years old or they might be 70, but they are the guys who are thinking, living, and breathing hunting year round. The bulk of people on this forum would fall into this group, otherwise you wouldn't be here talking about it. The rest of the gang, the guys that "go hunting" are usually just along for the ride. They don't think about it much, just one or two weeks a year at deer or moose camp. You're never going to get the same kind of commitment out of these guys that you would from a true hunter. It's not just camps either. Most of us know a guy or two that will go hunting "if you're going" but never on his own.
If you want commitment, you have to get together with a group of "hunters". These are not the guys who will blow their potential hunting budget for the year on the latest i-phone or the next gaming console. They might have a cell phone, but it's usually a couple of years behind everyone else's. Likely the "free" phone that came with the plan. Their disposable income will be set aside to make sure they have the equipment and money they need to hunt. They've made it a priority. This is true of young and older people alike. I know guys (who consider themselves hunters) much older than me who would rather spend their cash on a faster computer or a better TV than commit to a moose hunting trip. Beware though, if your group consists of all "hunters", everyone has a different opinion on how things should be done. The "go hunting" guys, if you can get them to commit, are a great addition to a group because they go along with the plan.
Even the guys who truly are hunters have to adjust their priorities once in a while. I used to get out every chance I could. Lately, with two kids under 6, getting into the field is a little tougher. Still, I make time for it. I've never missed my week in deer camp, college or high school didn't get in the way of that either. Now, I'm looking to the future and planning for my kids to get into it so I can maximize my time in the bush once again.
^^^^^
Well said and an accurate recap.
As a kid I remember my dad going on a 1 week hunting trip most years. Either Moose or Deer - Never both. and that was it. Never heard him complain or even mention not being able to do more, even though he probably would have liked to. He was happy for his one week away. and he'd spend his other week of vacation taking us camping. Now it seems we want and think we should be able to do it all.... and somewhat disappointed when we can't, instead of being grateful.
That's a great post GW11! Using your terms and relating them to this thread, I would say that I am a real hunter, but I'd never have the ability to commit to a moose hunting trip. I hunt hard and within very limited means; I can't afford (time or money) to drive up to moose country to hunt and maybe get some portion of an animal or two. I hunt mostly deer and ducks and geese because it's what's within half an hour from my house and I can't afford to travel to hunt (and, of course, locally my success rate is going to be 100% or damn near - I like that bang for my buck - It might feel like a long drive home if I'd wasted all of my precious vacation time without killng something).
Nicley put GW11..great analogy !!!
My version is shorter "Hunters with a vocation and hunters looking for a vacation"Quote:
Originally Posted by MikePal
Nobody said you had to be a good shot, lol. No sense taking yourself so seriously that you can't be self-depricating from time to time.:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by HuntCamp'r
Well put Gilroy and Gw11.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
I'm a 24 year old hunter and I have a harder time finding a group that doesn't mind bringing other people in
I am 33 and in same position, can't seem to find anyone that has a camp with openings, can't afford to buy my own land (YET), and or the older/established hunters in this area aren't willing to mentor/show the ropes to anyone on the land they have access too, but since I live in WMU # 80, I know there is not a lot of spots that allow hunting on private land and the people that have them, guard them, keep them quiet and don't let others inQuote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
So if anyone has a opening in Deer/Moose Camp - I am 33 years old, married with 2 kids under 6, been hunting for a few years (never killed anything yet), I enjoy a few beers every now and then. I have a 4x4 truck, my own ATV, Boat & Snowmobile. I am also an avid fisherman (not good one, but avid). Anyway if anyone has a camp space, I would love to apply, so that I can learn and eventually teach to my own kids!
Vacation time is not really a problem for me and Depending on how far camp is away, I am willing to put in some weekends, etc. for pre-season prep.
Cheers!
A while ago a member posted a link to a website designed to connect hunters. It may be a good start to sourcing out new camp members.
www.huntclubber.com
The more judgmental folks here would tell you to stop spouting excuses.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisM23
A truly dedicated hunter would a) pack up his whole family and move to an area where hunting lands are easier to beg or lease, b) rob a bank to acquire the funds to purchase your own hunting lands, or c) possibly take up poaching & trespassing to ensure you get your hunting fix.
There are all sorts of alternative opportunities as well. One could pimp his wife and children to raise the necessary funds. One could kill a wealthy land owner and assume his identity and assets. The opportunities abound... I leave it to you to find the one that works best.
Don't be afraid to get creative when finding your solution... but do remember that the most important thing is always hunting. If a single other thing trumps it on your list of priorities, you are not a hunter... you're a vacationer.
Well as one that has learned at the knee of older hunters, and grow up with hunting, fishing, and time in the woods and on the water. This is the end of it. I will no longer be hunting or fishing. My camping will now be hanging out on the back deck watching the steaks cook on the BBQ.
I can no longer the BS. Although I do not have much time at home because of my job, I took every chance I could this year to get out and knock on doors and get permissions. Even though I was only home a day and a half, once every two and a half weeks. I spent my time driving around trying to get permission. I really worked on getting setup for geese this year, got permission on a few places around london. All but one farm around a good roost for geese.
Came to find out that every one of the places I " HAD" permission for I lost. Why did I lose it...Some Outfitter came along and paid the land owners to not let anyone else but their clients and them hunt there. Remember the Farm that I did not get permision for? Well turns out that guy and the outfitter have something going.
Outfitters can be worse then used car salesmen.
A real tough break Snowwalker... but don't get too upset with the landowners, or burn any bridges.
Guides and outfitters start up and fail with as much frequency as restauranteurs. Chances are he won't be able to buy everyone off next year and you'll be able to go back to your old routine.
Well I don't think I will going to "jump to" and come running next time one of them calls about pests in the barn or garden. Sweated my rear off bowing for dirt pigs this summer in one lady's garden( more like a small vegge farm really) to get permission at one place. I did a few things for the others too. As for the outfitter, don't know maybe he'll think the drive from the southern states is too far next year. As for not having money....Don't think it's going to happen. His Clients are paying around $800 to $1000US a day. Seems they come up from the states for Early goose and then go home for goose season in their home state.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
I'd love to do a moose hunt. Before I even get started the cost of a tag and the current state of the draw system is a great big turn off. With the added cost of gas and gear. It has priced itself right out of my range. It's cheaper to buy lower bowl leaf tickets.
As for duck, goose and deer I have been quite fortunate to hunt with my son who is 19, he has more dedication then the guys I hunt with at my age. As well I hunt with my nephew when time permits for him and he has been quite diligent with the times not being late or bailing etc. The best part for me is that I have the opportunity to hunt with my son and I enjoy his company. He also has a good group of young guys that he hunts with and all appear to be dedicated.
I'm standing on the outside looking in. I can't get an invite to go out for a day let alone a camp. Every hunter I've expressed an interest in hunting to has given me the cold shoulder. And I'm not that "weird" annoying Guy. Just an average 32yr old with a wife and kids. I'm a first Gen hunter. and so far between the mnr hoops I've had to jump through, and cold shoulders it just seems like an old boys club so far...
Slow clap. Bravo!Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
*Bows* Thank you sirQuote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
Give it time and start switching gears. Become a member of a local open club (target range, Ducks Unlim, OFAH, etc) to be seen as an engaged and responsible member of the hunting/shooting community. A couple fundraisers and chats over coffees and you'll be in like Flynn.Quote:
Originally Posted by pmannat
The cold shoulders from landowners I can understand. People pay a fortune in property taxes, property upkeep, food plots, ground blinds & tree stands, etc... they're going to be resistant to inviting strangers to join them. Stick to public lands to start and build up good graces... eventually you'll get some invites.
I gave up offering assistance to newer hunters who were looking for places or experienced tutoring. I offered my camp for nothing and my time. All were full of p & v at the start but not one ever made the final commitment to come this far for a trip that would have cost them basically their gas to get here and some food for their stay.
I understand distance and time is a factor but both are excuses.
I find that odd. To me, part of the attractiveness of hunting is getting as far away from the city as possible. Couldn't imagine limiting my hunting opportunities only to what's available within a 1/2 drive (which is zip, zilch, zero).Quote:
Originally Posted by sawbill
Thanks Oddmott, I really appreciate to advice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
The OFAH idea sounds great! I don't have the $$ for a range club yet, I generally get by using my sister's hobby farm, but I don't like to as it's small (narrow 7 acre) with horses on one side and the 402 on the other.
OFAH is good for a few reasons, but not for meeting people.Quote:
Originally Posted by pmannat
Try to get out to a Rod and Gun club or something like that, you will actually talk to people, not just converse online, in person helps.
As a young hunter myself I have numerous friends who express interest in hunting and tell me they want to get their licenses etc, however none of them make the commitment. I think it has something to do with my generation. People are less likely to take a risk and dive into something that may intimidate them. I am fortunate to have an excellent mentor in my uncle, as well as a group of guys my age who are as committed to the field as I am (who I networked with through the OOD Community). I hope to eventually encourage some of my non-hunting friends into the sport, and have no problem mentoring them as I was, but will not babysit or put up with non-commitment when it counts...
Interesting article from the RealTree web blog about attitude by some towards young hunters, I'm not saying it relates up here in Canada as things are a little different.
http://www.realtree.com/hunting/real...uth-hunt-hater
For myself I started hunting with a gun and bow later in life at 47. I have been into wilderness travel on foot and canoe most of my life and as a nature/landscape photographer as well as wildlife. My father hunted all his life until he passed away in 2012 and left me his share of a hunt camp, I didn't have an interest in hunting before but when the opportunity presented itself I dove in. The transition for me was very easy both from a knowledge of habitat and game, although there was still a lot to learn. I'm certainly not young by any standards but at hunt camp, I'm the young buck...
I have 2 boys 13 and 18, I offered them the opportunity to start hunting, my youngest jumped aboard right away with my oldest not interested at first, I didn't push it but talked with him about all aspects of hunting both with our relationship and what I missed all those years not joining my father during his hunting years. Both my boys are well connected to the electronic/social media age and at times it does rule their lives, more-so with my older son, I always offer them to bring a friend when we go up as a family. On a recent trip to the camp for some grouse hunting with friends and family it was like pulling teeth to get my oldest to come but he did, we made the weekend fun by doing some trap shooting mixed in with ATV'ing and a few grouse, which my youngest took his first grouse. A couple days after we were home, to my surprise my oldest asked when the next firearms/hunter ed course was as he decided he would like to try. When I asked him why he said he had a good time, inside I feel he may have felt left out at times.
As far as expense for hunting, it can be as expensive as you want or as cheap as you can make it. Todays shows and marketing tell us we need all this equipment. You don't need an ATV, Truck and a locker full of guns.
okay well lets talk base prices then..
I have an older friend that got his FAC from the police chief in town by going in and shaking his hand...
For me now adays:
PAL course = $250
Hunt Course = $150
RCMP Background check = $65
outdoors card = $$
Tags = $$
turkey course DVD = $35
Turkey dummy test = $35+
oh wait! I don't even have a gun yet = $$$$$ , nor gear = $$$$$,
Okay know I spent all that, but I still haven't even hunted yet....
Worth every penny, maybe
Cheap as ~I~ make it.... No
Tell me any outdoor hobby that you can get into it for less than a $1K.... ( don't really I'm just making a point). Crap you can't even buy a good mountain bike for that anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by pmannat
Look what guys spend on fishing....and few even bring home the fish they catch (release). Nothing for the freezer.
If you pinching pennies, hobbies/sports in general will be a luxury, few are cheap.
I think pmannat's point stands... while many hobbies or outdoor activities can be expensive, hunting is the only one that is prohibitively expensive, before you've even able to plant your boots in the dirt.
$1500 for education, testing, gov't process & paperwork, tags and very basic gear (ie: a budget/used firearm and a blaze vest). That doesn't include clothes to keep one warm or dry, doesn't include a "nice" firearm, doesn't include travel, etc.
I bought a GREAT Trek 4-Series mountain bike. MRSP $800-$900 and I got mine on-sale for $530 +tax. Add a $30 helmet and i'm set to take part in a great outdoor adventure for just over $600.
I've been looking to get into canoeing or kayaking... there are TOO many options of great boats for around $600-$800.
Camping... i have 2 tents, flys & tarps, multiple mattresses, stoves, blades, etc all for under $500 total. The only thing i'm missing is an excursion grade backpack.
If i was only interested in enjoying the outdoors... I could essentially take up 3 other hobbies for the cost it takes to be able to hunt.
yup
I dont mind the long term investments ( Guns, Gear etc.) so much as the government money grabs every step of the way. I'm okay with safety measures, and conservation, but If I can pass all the dummy tests why should I have to pay to have it spoon fed to me. It's getting to be a bit much.
I love fishing, crappy tire rod and reel $20, $40ish bucks for a 3 yr card and 1 yr conservation license, 15min drive to port bruce on lake erie for perch. = good eatin!
How much is an iphone? Unlimited data and text plan? PS3? Xbox? A night or two every week at the bars with your buddies? Fast food? 50" TV? The list of things people think they need goes on and on. I'll never understand people's need to have all this expensive stuff to stay "connected" or to "keep up" with social media. If your business depends on it, that's justifiable, but for everyone else, didn't you quit talking to all those people (that you're now "keeping up" with) years ago for a reason? Social media is a time and money vampire. Go without some of that stuff and you'll have a hunting budget.
Personally, I need to go hunting every fall. Possibly at the cost of exploiting my wife and kids to raise the money and/or poaching and trespassing to get my fix (sarcasm). Seriously though, my wife is fine with me going away for a couple of weeks a year. I've been doing it since long before we got together. I pick up the slack throughout the rest of the year and use the rest of my holiday time for family.
When I was 16 I saved up until I could buy my first shotgun combo before I even bought a car. I'm closing in on 40 now and my wish list is still outdoor and hunting gear before phones, computers, gaming consoles TV's, etc. I get a real kick out of people complaining about the cost of hunting when they're sporting a phone worth as much as a shotgun and spending their free time on electronics worth more than any start-up fees. Do you really need any of it?
Again, if it's important enough to you, you'll go without some of the other stuff that you think you need.
iphones and data plans and xbox didn't even exist when i took my courses in the mid-90s. As a high school student at that time the only thing i was saving money for was college.
Yet the start-up hunting costs were still there and still somewhat prohibitive. I hunted in blue jeans and used blaze jackets, borrowing my father's rifles.
If you don't have family to help you get into it, as a young hunter the costs make it nearly impossible.
And for clarification, not a single person has said that hunting isn't "worth" it. Only that the costs are much higher than some choose to admit.
Claiming that hunting is no more expensive than other outdoor pursuits is misleading, almost outright false. Claiming that it can be as cheap or as expensive as you like, is also false because none of us would choose to spend $1000 on courses and paperwork.
There's a difference between affording to hunt and affording to drive 10 hrs north for 2 weeks at camp in a pickup with atvs. I hunt regularly, just not at a camp. I don't think that means I have the wrong priorities.
RCMP background check $65? I certainly didn't have to payQuote:
Originally Posted by pmannat
One-stop firearms/hunter ed was $220 not sure where you get $250 for PAL course alone?
My point is entry level hunting is not that expensive to start out with your small game licence. Sure there is an up front cost like just about anything you want to do but realistically lets not make it more than it is. For sure if you want to expand your hunting beyond that and want all the toys then costs go up. As a guest at the camp I belong to it's $200 a week for deer/moose includes room and food +transportation cost. Do the math on that and it's a pretty cheap week
The RCMP check is $60. I paid $300 for the onestop course all in (taxes and books included). It was $60 for me upgrade my fishing licence to hunting, along with a small games tag and my moose tag for the year.
So before I bought a gun and clothing, I paid $420. Is it expensive to start up - Yes! Is it something you need to do to get into the hunt? Yes!
Just like say, starting hockey there are start up costs. Once you buy the equipment, you have the basics required. You then need to pay your annual fess for ice, sticks, skate sharpening, gas... (in our case tags and gas money / accommodations) each year afterwards. Hunting is no different than most other sports that require an initial investment.
Hunting is a luxury whether you want to look at it that way or not. It's expensive to get started, and depending on the type of hunting you want to do it can be very expensive. Once you have your initial investment made, the costs year to year are up to you.
FishFrenzy
I'd love the chance to join a moose camp, I've never found one taking new members though.
This is the issue for my hunting buddies, I've been trying to convince them to go moose hunting but no one but me wants to drop $60 to enter a lottery that we (statistically) won't win for 3 years (I made the mistake of doing the math), $180 + 3 years time invested for a chance to be the one guy out of the group that gets to shoot a moose is a really ty deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by roosterman
There seems to be several people on here who have not been able to get an invite to a moose camp. I was in the same boat. So I started my own group. Not that hard to do. Just takes someone to get the ball rolling. There seems to be enough interested people on this thread alone to get a group started.Quote:
Originally Posted by thing
As far as the tags go it can be done if you really want to hunt Moose. Last year we had 3 tags for 5 guys this year it was 2 for the 5 of us. Moose is probably the most expensive type of hunting and the most dependent on others but again if there is a will there is a way. Don't give up on the idea. For me this is the best, most challenging hunting Ontario has to offer right now. Of course there is always the easy way were you can drop $20,000 USD on a one week Moose hunt out West were everything is done for you but pull the trigger.
Sounds like we had a similar start. I agree that it is difficult to get into if you don't have a relative or at least a mentor to help you get started. I helped two friends get into hunting around 15 years ago that had no family or relatives that hunted. If I remember correctly, they both had inherited older guns from deceased grandparents so it made their initial costs a little lower by a couple of hundred dollars. Still, it can be done. Used shotgun combos are pretty cheap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
To address your response about the iphones and Xboxes, well, maybe it's best they weren't around when we were younger or our priorities might have been different. I think what's important to people these days has change quite a lot in the last 20 years.
True enough. I believe the OP was talking about committing to a camp and some of the discussion turned to hunting in general. A moose camp that involves driving long distances can be an expensive yearly endeavor. But, as long as you're hunting you have your priorities straight....:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by kdp89
Statistics don't necessarily tell the whole story though. My group started moose hunting last yr. Between 4 guys we got two calf tags the first yr. This yr I snagged a bull tag.Quote:
Originally Posted by thing
I mentioned this before: I go to the Gun Auction in Perth every year..the place is full of young hunters..75-100 most nights.
There are lots of guns from Mil-Surp bolt actions to Semi-Auto to 300 Winmags......the young guys rarely ever buy up the bolt action .303 etc...even though they are good guns and sell for around $100.....they all hold out for the synthetic camo stocked scope mounted rifles. They go for $400+, lots in the $600 range...
So they can't complain they don't have the money to get into hunting...it appears it has to be the best (coolest) guns for them.
Gee thanks for all the replys....
Our group is just back after a remote 3 week hunt in 18a. Now that we are back we will continue to evolve and work to improve the camp for next year. Input from the other members will be considered to make necessary changes to make for a more comfortable camp next year. But my camp started because i was the junior guy in someone elses camp. To show my gratitude i showed up to work weekend details, worked on the camp itself,(interior renovations) then went swimming for the downed moose. after the moose was hanging i asked if i could return home as i am a contractor and was newly married with small children. I was told if i didn t stay to the end of camp to close up i wouldn t get any of the animal. I chose to keep good blood between the camp owner and myself and decided to give up the meat to keep my friends. During that long drive home i decided that I would no longer return to that camp. That winter i bought a used school bus and coverted it to a very comfortable mobile camp. Each year more equipment is added to make less work for the group. As time and temperatures changed a i purchased an enclosed trailer and changed it to accomadate a commerical reffer unit on it , boat rack, atv position and even a washing machine! I find the more effort i put into the bus down here the more time we have in the bush, or just to sit and chew the fat. The fires in the evening are great to see the northern lights. Each fella without being asks, contributes in some way or form, from cooking , dishes or cleaning. Building the camp is a days chore as is the tear down. but the memories in between last a lifetime. As the group ages,we would like to convince a younger go getter to come along this is a tough challenge. As i have read the expressed concerns from both young and old i ponder the tought of asking another into camp. When the group fuctions well and there are no slackers (young or old) we have a great time hunting , fishing and birding. Thats why we go for so long :) I took for granted that another hunter would jump at the opportunity to come to an established group that has knowledge of the area they hunt, knowledge and equipment to harvest an animal and just generally has fun. I have been sadly mistaken in the last five years. We have had to ask as many not to return as we have had, a theif and cheat, a compulsive liar, a couple of drunks, a terrible lazy slacker so i agree with the coment there are Hunters and folks that go hunting. I need only a hunter.
With all due respect to the Lee Enfield (I own two) they arent the greatest hunting rifle. The are a tad heavy, unless the barrel has been cut they are long, they have an awkward mount for a scope, and 303 ammo isnt getting any cheaper (for comparison soft point ammo in 308 is typically 60-75% of the price of a box of 303 brit).Quote:
Originally Posted by MikePal
If I needed a rock solid rifle to last me a century or more, and withstand harsh conditions, the LE 303 is at the top of the list. But as a primary hunting rifle they are not. They are also above the 270 limit for those int he south whom may be looking for a multi purpose rifle.
I think you missed the point.....hunting like everything else can be done cheaper if you don't set your 'wish' list to high...using Grandpa's old bolt action until you can afford a new rifle is better than whining that you can't afford to go hunting. Peer pressure and TV advertising sets the bar too high for some guys budgets.
I agree everybody wants and has to have the very best equipment these days. From $1200 guns to $600 jackets. Forna first year person that alone is a huge expense. But it is so hard to get people to commit a week of their time to go hunting. Which in my mind is the most relaxing week of the year lol.
You don't need to spend thousands to go hunting. I have other responsibilities in life and obviously my funds are not unlimited. I do have quite a few guns that I have purchased or received over time. My most recent purchases were a SKS for plinking and a Mossberg 535. I made my own Goose Decoys. My tents one I purchased for 50 a 10 man as my 20 year old one finally gave up the ghost. I have a two man for myself that I bought 25 years ago. My Coleman stoves and lanterns I purchased on Kijiji for like 20.00 Every year I spend no more then 40.00 on fishing equipment gear most times only 20 bucks. I repair old stuff. Some things like axes and saw can be purchased at yard sales for next to nothing something I just pick up I don't know where. In fact I have never bought a ladder yet I have 3 found them squashed on the road took them home and repaired them 1 16 foot ladder, a folding multi step ladder and a saw horse ladder rope I buy at the dollar store same with those tie downs and bungee cords.
If your on a strict budget you can still afford to hunt. The only tough part to eliminate is the transportation part very difficult to find fuel. Although I did think of getting a diesel and using some vegetable oil. :)
Oh by the way now that I have put a few boxes through the Mossberg 535 I'm very happy with it. The gun cost me delivered I think 440.00 with a barrel, slug barrel and 3 chokes.
the cost of our three week excursion was 800 per man all in fuel, grocries, and propane i just read this and i found it to be true... the most relaxing time of the year.
But you don't have to spend 800.00 for a hunting. I do 3-5 trips of camping spring, summer and fall camping and fishing I do a bit of grouse hunting if I go up late hunting. Each trip run's me 200 - 300 These trips are anyplace from 2 nights upto 6 nights all together around 1000.00.. I could hunt bear up there at the same time if I wanted. I do my duck and goose, duck and deer within 20 km of my house. If I couldn't afford to fish up by Algonquin I wouldn't. One thing I do is look for potential hunting areas every place I go regulatory that's as close as possible. I don't buy the expensive shells you don't have to have them just watch you shots more carefully. I think I buy Winchesters BB 12 gauge for about 17.00 with tax. Over the years I have built up a useful supply of equipment for most things. But to be honest it has probably made me some what lazey. I use to user a double bladed ax probably from 12 years until I was about 43. Then for some reason I decided to bring the chainsaw. Made me lazy. If you have the interest you can find the way.
Ask around wait be patience, watch forums like this one meet people and you will find others to hunt with. I have actually hunted with a fella I was discussing hunting with while buying ammo waiting for the guy at Walmart.
Oh yeah and if your younger them me (under 31) we make you younger guy's carry the decoy's and clean the gun's :).
I'm a 24 year old hunter trying to get in with a hunting group for anything from grouse to moose hunting. I am having a hard time trying to get in because in my area they are either full or have an over abundance of rules and regulation. Such as having to hunt with the person who invited me. Yet he can only hunt a few hours here and there through the week, where I want to be out everyday all day for the whole week
It's tough, but rules are there for a reason...someone caused the camp to feel to need to make them :)Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
If you balking at them even before you join, your probably better off trying something else.
If groups really need young blood than instead of pushing them out with rules such as only being able to hunt with the one person they know from the group. The person who can't hunt at all throughout the week. It seems more of a deterant than anything else. Your right some rules are fine. Such as everyone pitching in, saftey, ect but Atleast implement rules that are helpful to bringing in good dependable hunters.
I think the desire here is that you need to prove your a 'good dependable hunter'....while under the tutelage of the guy who is sponsoring you.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
It's not uncommon for a clubs like the Shriner's and Freemason's etc to have tight membership rules...it's how, historically, things have proven out to work for the best of all concerned. They aren't try to snub you, just making sure that your going to be a good fit.
MP is correct rules are there for a reason. In my opinion these rules help to weed out those you want and don't want in your group. I am currently mentoring a young lad who's 15 I take him out for goose and grouse. When I invite someone into the group I expect certain things. Right now the young lad comes over to my house about a half hr early and helps me pile wood. Some might say "I'm not your ". But I and so does he look at it this way if I don't get my chores done we aint going out. Which means he doesn't get to hunt.
But I will be honest if you questions my rules then your probably not someone who will enjoy comming out with me. I have gone out with a few people on this site experienced and taken out a few new hunters.
Groups do need young blood but not smart allecks that feel they will do what they want.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
To be honest with an attitude like that I would cross you off very quickly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
I can appreciate your eagerness to step out as often as possible. However, for the time being, you may wish to look at it from a different angle - to start with, go out that gentleman even if the excursions may be too brief to fulfill your urge during the initial season.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyMcIntyre
But in this manner, you would also have an opportunity to develop the necessary rapport. Once a certain confidence level has been reached, I'm sure that individual will convey his first hand impressions to others in the group and thus enable you to merge in with ease.
Mutual respect, trust, reliability etc are key words here. :)
Yep. Those sorts of rules are because the camp doesn't want to deal with a dozen new guys, so your sponser can vet you to see if you're someone that would fit in with the camp, or send you to the showers before the other folks have to deal with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
Exactly.
Hey I thought you lived out this way did you move?
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Originally Posted by Keating
yep
Was in Metcalfe for 8 years. Moved to North Kanata, near Carp, last fall.
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Originally Posted by greatwhite
this year, I have recruited 2 new members from this forum to join our hunt camp. Both young(ish). the issue for me is finding a new hunter from the ottawa region. my 2 kids (21 and 16) cannot join me and probably not for a few years so I decided to see if I can find someone new to the sport to mentor. so far it is exactly as described - from a hunting family and not looking OR .....???
Had one hunter from the canadian forces just posted to ottawa and invited him to hunt at my place as I do not hunt here. on his third time out took a nice buck. great welcome for him to the ottawa region. Great guy, hope he can also join us next year.
I'll be jumping in head first next year, with no plan or places to hunt yet. hopefully be able to find a place when the time comes. Not exactly young (late 30s) but only a little experience from a looong time a go in a land far away (NS).
I started this year and so far just trying to convince friends to pick up the sport is hard enough. So many show interest but when it comes down to it, no one signs up for their pal/hunters ed course or they don't want to spend on the correct equipment. A lot of the commitment issues relate to the money and time required. I was fortunate enough to finish school and land a job that leaves me with a stable schedule. However, most of the people I was planning to hunt with are still in school with a schedule that is all over the place and will still be in the next two years.
If anyone is in the same situation as me or wants to potentially find a new hunting partner, send me a message.
I might be starting a new group to hunt deer next year, possibly Moose but haven't decided yet. 4 of the people I hunted with have dropped out of the group I am in. I hunted with the fellas the other evening and will again tonight.
Probably hunting in my area for deer and possibly up at Bissett Creek. but not sure yet, probably decide next Spring.
No problem at all. They go on a moose hunt in 18A with other guys. One guys there to ride his ATV 24/7. One's there to blast only birds right where the most moose sign is and the other two are sloshed most times. Why wouldn't a lad commit to that BS? Geez I can't imagineQuote:
Originally Posted by bucketboy
oh my dear god. I can't believe what i just read and from who. Writes a story . The last three lines describing himself to a tee, then makes like those attributes were in multiple others. Whew that's scary, and i was in the bush with that and a 410 shotgun. Glad to be on this side of the sod. Swim for a moose. I couldn't even get you to stay out hunting the very first day. Boy you got deeper issues than were even reveiled to me. Mods, delete if you want, but think about this. If you delete the truth and someone gets hurt it's on youQuote:
Originally Posted by bucketboy
Wow! Some extreme sarcastic views on here towards the young people. I agree with many that its not the age of the hunter its just finding the right mentality. I have been dying to go moose hunting for years but have not been able for the same reason as many on here. Time off work is hard to get when you aren't as high up on seniority as the older guys. Plus with todays dwindling moose tags its hard to justify spending $1000+ and a weeks vacation instead of using that week for deer hunting. Doing both can be tricky with the seasons being so close to each other. The freezer needs to be filled and deer fills it more reliably in my part of the woods. Money is also a big issue. Many of you older hunters should remember how tight money was with a mortgage and small kids at home. I don't have money to buy an ATV or crew cab truck to make myself more useful and alluring to the older guys in the groups. The last defense for the young guys could be having to hunt with the older guys. I know a few groups where all they want from the younger guys is their money and toys but they are not really allowed an opinion on where to hunt or are allowed to try new ways of doing things. They are to just fall in line and do things like they have for however many years in the past. They just need the young guys to make the groups big enough to get adult tags. No wonder the guys won't commit.
i put a group of 4 together this year for moose... wasnt very difficult.. well see how it works at camp... the hardest part for me s finding time to meet up with everyone... as we all have different schedules..
What area?
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Originally Posted by topher
21a... Y you wanna come?
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Originally Posted by greatwhite
Little far for me to travel this year. But good luck. What do you have a bull tag?
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Originally Posted by topher
Sounds like everybody and their brother is heading to 21A this year. See ya there! lolQuote:
Originally Posted by topher
Bull,cow, calfsQuote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
What week you going? We are heading the second week of rifle..Quote:
Originally Posted by LowbanksArcher
Archery for us. Headin up this Thursday. But since I'm in my 20's I'll likely bail out cause I can't be away from my "i-thing". ;) And there's no electricity or cell signal where we're going. LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by topher
No cell signal up there? Ahhh f@#$ I guess I should rethink this.... I'm in my eatlrly 30's.... So I can't be away from my phone either ..
An old thread resurrected, but then again this is the time of the year on this board when "new hunter looking for help" posts start popping up.
I'm no ol' timer, but I do believe it is harder these days to get young hunters to commit. But its not so much for reasons of financial, family or time constraints. Its because of attitude. Slacker attitude.
I firmly believe in mentoring and creating opportunities for young hunters, and I make it my goal to help at least one newcomer every season. But I have also given up on helping hunters from internet boards like this one. I now only make the effort for family or people I meet; acquaintances, friends of friends, friend's kids, etc.
A decade ago I reached out to a stranger on this board who was looking for help. He has turned out to be a valued member of our hunt camp and a successful deer hunter who will someday be leader for other hunters. Unfortunately, he is also the exception.
I've since tried several times to create opportunities (big game, small game, clay sports) for other hunters who came to this board looking for help. But each of those subsequent experiences left me wondering why I bothered. To put it briefly, I've found too many who are all talk and no action. I convince my group to let a new guy in only to have the guy drop off the face of the earth never to be heard from again. Or I set up the hunt and the guy never shows while I'm waiting at 5:00 a.m., again without ever another word. I've actually seen some of the same slackers posting year after year.
Its too bad, because I'm sure that among the posters here looking for help there are some who are genuine and who would truly appreciate a break. I'm just tired of trying to find them among all the weeds.
I'll say this for what everyone hopes is the last time. Hunting (And I use that word in it's loosest sense) with Bucketboy or Lazyman is garaunteed to leave You wishing You hadn't
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Originally Posted by standup
Is this from experience?
On the subject of recruiting young hunters, me being 21 and having never hunted moose, I was looking for a group to hunt with to show me the ropes, but from the people I talked to, their groups were tight-knit and didn't want "rookies" or "outsiders". That being said, I got together with 3 classmates and we put a group together and we pulled a bull and a cow tag...the test will be if we do it gain next year!
theres definitely young people wanting to hunt.
I have to ask what is an "i-thing" :)
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Originally Posted by LowbanksArcher
Every year around July and Aug even into Sept people post on here that they are looking for someone new.
Seen several this year for Deer and Moose. Also asking others out there to form a group is another option.
Next year I might go Goose hunting, cant this year.
I try to network with others on here so that I will either be able to form a group in the future or get invited. I have met several on here and hunted with some as well and hoping to hunt with some if my time permits.
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Originally Posted by player11111
GW, you looking for a gang for deer? rifle, 2nd week, Brudenell. Might have one more spot to fill. We run the hounds.
all I have to say is who is hunting solo ? That might speak volumesQuote:
Originally Posted by standup
And then there's people like me who don't have the financial ability due to kids and mortgage etc. But are willing to put in the extra time needed to make up for it, however a lot of people won't let you come in unless you have an ATV,truck,trailer.. Etc...Quote:
Originally Posted by ninepointer
Be more.than willing to spend a weekend if time allowed swinging a hammer.. Or whatever.. Yes even fat young guys like me understand a team effort.
Yes your right ppl in the 20's and 30's have an "I deserve it attitude" but we are not ALL like that.
yes... seems everyone say they want to join group until right before hunt. and if they do want to hunt, they want to hunt for free... times aren't changing times have changed.
ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfhunter
A little personal, don't ya think ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
Good on you. My group is the same way. We all came from non-hunting families and started hunting in our early 20's. Started a moose group from scratch and we do things on a budget. Carport tent, yardsale woodstove, and little bit of redneck ingenuity here and there, and off we go.Quote:
Originally Posted by player11111
No prob . The guy who's the one putting the meat on the ground while the children play should be the one with the meat (solo) while the children stay on their bottled rationQuote:
Originally Posted by lazyman
I'm thinking maybe I could trade the wife for an ATV. :)
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Originally Posted by topher
Ahhh I see you found some pot in the bush too. Surely you know that a woman is like a leased car? Once that ring is on there its the same as running over your alloted mileage, you must pay to return them. And pay dearly might I add.Quote:
Originally Posted by greatwhite
Should have quit when the training wife left. :)
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Originally Posted by oaknut