Went to a Nature London event this week. MNR officer speaking.
800 000 Canada Geese in Ont. as of last Nov.
200 000 harvested last Fall.
Interesting ratio 1:4
Printable View
Went to a Nature London event this week. MNR officer speaking.
800 000 Canada Geese in Ont. as of last Nov.
200 000 harvested last Fall.
Interesting ratio 1:4
I guess those missed shots added up!
Not saying I am right but every fourth goose getting killed just doesn't sound right. If 25% get wiped out before they migrate over the border into the US you have to assume at the very least as many get shot down there. Can any species take that kind of harvest?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharon
How accurate can the data really be? Numbers don't seem at add up but I could be wrong
Probably misread the q card. Gotta be either 1.8 million or 20,000 shot
How do they determine that 200 000 are killed ? That doesn't make sense
Might be the same guys who calculated the costs of the gas plant scandals, dunno?Quote:
Originally Posted by mojo stick
Well.. If the people who did the math for the gas plants.. And the math for the goose harvest. Graduated recently from Ontario schools.. It all makes sense....Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
ya those numbers don't add up at all.
LOL Sorry but that's what the MNR guy said. :)... for Ontario. I was awake the whole time and just checked the numbers with my husband who was there too.
Sharons numbers sound about right. A good year is to lose 35+% of the breeding population with that number regained or lost in the next breeding season. This includes natural and hunting losses
If Stubblebum sees this post he probably has the DU reports for waterfowl recrutment from year to year.
I wonder if these number reflect total numbers or just resident birds ? We probably have a huge increase in number in Oct Nov when the migration passes through. I have read that Ontario is the largest harvester of Canada geese in North America which I found hard to believe with the number of hunters in some US states I guess we are just good hunters
I would have figured one of the US states would have had a higher harvest rate with the number of hunters and guides.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
I was talking to a friend if mine in Tennessee about waterfowl hunting.. He said a lot of people don't like hunting for geese.. For sport.. They prefer ducks.. However they will hunt geese to help out a farmer if requested, but they don't go looking for geese.
Your friend is mistaken, many people target geese.Quote:
Originally Posted by topher
-Nick
I heard Minnesota.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
seems to be that guys in the northern especially north central to north east really get after the geese...I think in general a lot of states have shorter seasons than we do as well...I don't know how the MNR tracks these numbers....I don't know about you but they never asked me how many I harvested...I know of the CWS Migratory bird survey, but those are random and probably don't account for many hunters...not to mention the are doing the bird count during mid migration...
I too would think they are referring to resident birds only for population and the harvest would include both resident and migrators.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardcoreducks
As for Ontario being the largest harvester I am not surprised... look at our landmass and hunting population compare the the tiny size of many states. Plus we get to hunt them when they are stupid, after we are done with them and they move south only the educated ones are left. Kinda like hunting Snows in the spring, by the time they come back to Canada they have been hunted for 6 months, its not like hunting stupid birds.
What are the bag limits down in the states? Are they mainly hunting the James Bay Migrators where there might be a two bird limit like some areas in Ontario or are they hunting local populations like many areas in Ontario with the 5 to 10 bird limits? Our generous bag limits in most areas could be what increases our numbers?
Dave
Depending on the time of year and state the bag limits change, some states have a more liberal limit than Ontario. With all the hunters south of the boarder and so few here in Ontario I find it hard to believe we would harvest more birds. I don't think Ontario would take 200K birds in a season.
Looking for some data.
Doug, we may have a large land mass but only a small portion puts hunters in a position to kill geese with success on a regular basis.
Found this link, Maryland alone has taken over 200K geese in a year.
Minnesota killed close to 300K just years ago!
http://www.flyways.us/regulations-an...harvest-trends
I found the number hard to believe as well Aaron. I assume they are getting their numbers from the survey they send out?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LondonDave
I'm curious too on bag limits in some states. I remember watching a Grind Waterfowl episode and I think it was Washington you could only hunt geese on like Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday and the bag limit was like 3, don't quote me on that lol.
A few years ago I was talking to guy from either Washington or Oregon.. He was pretty sure there was no goose season their.. Yes he was a hunter..Quote:
Originally Posted by IH8ATTN
Quote:
Originally Posted by topher
I happen to know for a fact that both have seasons and both states see a lot of birds
For Ontario I don't know if its 200K, but it may not be far off. We have two brief periods where we can kill 10 a day and the rest is 5 a day. No possession limits anymore.
I bet that each of the major guiding services kill 3000+ a year, add in the lesser known guides and its not hard to beleive that guiding services are contributing to 30K + to that number.
I see a fair number hit the dirt and I mostly hunt by myself or with one other person. If I had a little more time and hunting partners who actually cared about killing geese as a group we could get to 1000 birds a year.
Those are really high harvest numbers. My guess is the population size estimates they use might be understated?
I bet the harvest figure is accurate and maybe even a little conservative.
2008 havest was 185K in ON and 2009 was 180K
Last season's removal of the possession restriction probably encouraged some fellas to keep hunting longer than they normally would - exactly what the relaxed regulation was designed to encourage
I would guess the figure is bang on. Also don't discount the impact of a successful guiding/outfitting operation on harvest numbers over the course of a season, now multiply that out to the number of guiding operations.
- In regards to the US bag limits, I think if you were to average it out across their many mini seasons and across state lines, Ontario waterfowlers can take more geese per season than waterfowlers in the US.
- I think biologists use the November bird counts (# in province) because it is a blended number that captures portions of both migratory and resident populations.
- And don't forget how large the province is; from Point Pelee to James Bay is only a couple hundred kilometers shorter than Point Pelee to the Louisiana Delta. Not saying that geese migrate nearly that far but by the same token more than %50 of their migration happens within the province.
Here is a link to some historical goose harvest data from CWS(Canadian Wildlife Service). Pretty neat actually.
http://www.ec.gc.ca/rcom-mbhr/defaul...21396B-1#tab15
"Went to a Nature London event this week. MNR officer speaking.
800 000 Canada Geese in Ont. as of last Nov. 2013
200 000 harvested last Fall." quote
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Reviewed my notes for clarification.
Those figures are for the 3 Ontario groups:
Hudson's Bay migratory population.... through the Mississippi Valley
James Bay migratory population.... through the Tennessee Valley
Ontario temperate group... do not migrate .... south of the boreal forest
Does anyone on here know the estimated populations in Ontario of Giant Canada geese [what most refer to as local birds], the Hudson Bay and James Bay populations [which are both smaller geese] --it seems to me that in 1996 the Giant Canada poplulation in Ontario was about 400,000 -- if it has jumped to 800,000 with all the hunting pressure that's truly remarkable --even more remarkable is that in the 1970's it was in the 100s
Last figure I remember seeing was that in 2012 there were 80,000 breeding pairs of Temperate Breeding Large Canada Geese (nuisance or "local" birds)
That's 160,00 adult birds.
IMHO 800,000 isn't a stretch when you factor in non-breeding birds, juvies and old birds.
FYI - in 2010 there were 100,000 breeding pairs so the control methods are working to bring the population within management objectives
interesting numbers! I also think there are more people hunting geese then before.
Updated info here
http://www.ec.gc.ca/rcom-mbhr/defaul...n&n=B2A654BC-1
As recently as 1970, Canada Geese did not commonly nest in southern Ontario. However, results of the Southern Ontario Waterfowl Plot Survey show that the population south of the French and Mattawa rivers has grown since the 1970s to just over 83 000 pairs (5-year average since 2009; Figure 37). Increasing at a rate of 9.4% annually from 1971 to 2013, population growth has slowed down, with an average annual increase of 1.9% since 2003 (Table 1a). A relatively small but increasing number of geese also breed north of the surveyed area but south of the range of Ontario’s two sub-arctic breeding populations. The 2013 fall flight for the Ontario temperate-breeding population is estimated to be around 500 000 individuals. In 2013, 3525 temperate-breeding Canada Geese were banded in southern and central Ontario.
Would that possibly be 800,000 local geese and 200,000 total shot of all migrating birds?