Good first Calibre for 18 year old daughter.

Printable View

May 17th, 2014, 12:05 PM
Species8472

Good first Calibre for 18 year old daughter.

So my 18 year old daughter just got PAL and hunting licence and wants to go deer hunting this fall. I am going to start her shooting the 22LR and the 17 HMR to hone her technique, but after she is proficient with these two than the question becomes what is a good first deer calibre for her.

A little background - she only weighs 105 lbs, so I am little concerned about recoil. My thoughts were:

.243
6.5 Swede
7-08

One other thing, in the areas we hunt the longest shot would be 200 yards with 90% of shots being under 100 yards.
May 17th, 2014, 12:15 PM
laker taker

Got my granddaughter a BLR 243 a few years back and she has taken a few deer with it.

You couldn't pry it from her hands.
May 17th, 2014, 12:17 PM
dutchhunter

then243 and the 260 are great for young shooters but do not over look the good old 3030 DUTCH
May 17th, 2014, 12:45 PM
SongDog

My brother g/f is 21 and she's about 100lbs and can handle a .308 no problem. She is a good shot, but has practiced with a 17hmr and .22-250 quite a bit.

I'd go for a Ruger American Compact in .243. They are under 37" long which helps a small framed person hold the gun up a lot better. 6lb rifle with a decent 3-9-40mm scope and she should be good to go.
May 17th, 2014, 04:34 PM
jlmorgan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Species8472

So my 18 year old daughter just got PAL and hunting licence and wants to go deer hunting this fall. I am going to start her shooting the 22LR and the 17 HMR to hone her technique, but after she is proficient with these two than the question becomes what is a good first deer calibre for her.

A little background - she only weighs 105 lbs, so I am little concerned about recoil. My thoughts were:

.243
6.5 Swede
7-08

One other thing, in the areas we hunt the longest shot would be 200 yards with 90% of shots being under 100 yards.

Any of those are good for the distances you are talking plus you could add the .26o rem. in there, find a gun that fits her and one she is comfortable shooting and any of those calibres are good
May 17th, 2014, 04:56 PM
terrym

The .260 is what you want. Very little recoil and a dependable killer. The 6.5x55 is a ballistic twin but needs a longer action so the rifle will be heavier.
May 17th, 2014, 05:36 PM
sgb

6.5 x 55, Good for any one!
May 17th, 2014, 05:53 PM
trimmer21

I would simply suggest a rifle that fits and that she likes and can be proud of. Easy ammo availability helps,too,so she doesn't go broke buying practice rounds. Any versatile cartridge from .243 to .270 should do quite nicely.
May 17th, 2014, 06:35 PM
6.5er

6.5x55 gets my nod --- make sure the stock fits her though. However if you have a chance - have her experience a few different calibers at a range - most shooters would be glad to help in that area.
May 17th, 2014, 06:40 PM
GoldenLakePete

Another vote for the 6.5x55.
May 17th, 2014, 08:58 PM
Muskokaguy20

250-3000 savage if you can find one
May 17th, 2014, 10:03 PM
blargon

Go for the .243. Endless choices for ammo, and also doubles as a great coyote round.

My personal favorite is the .260, but unless you are handloading, probably not the best choice.
May 18th, 2014, 07:11 AM
Whosinthebushes

243 is a great choice out of the box she should be able to handle it no problem. 270 would be a gun she could hunt anything in ontario with although you might want to upgrade the recoil pad depending on the brand. Ask around see if you could get her to the range with a gun in each cal am let her try them out and see what she likes and what she thinks she can handle. Remember to tell her to wear a thicker coat. When your hunting your rarely going to be just wearing a t shirt or a thin Long sleeve.
May 18th, 2014, 12:27 PM
NoCleverMoniker

SWEDE, SWEDE, SWEDE, all the way. Awsome round for everything from coyotes, to Moose!!!! Recoil is so so minimal. My boy has had his since he was 12. Thats his go to gun everytime!!!
May 18th, 2014, 02:07 PM
mox72

20 gauge with smooth and rifled barrels is another option but agree with the rifle suggestions too
May 18th, 2014, 02:54 PM
Roper

Earlier Laker Taker ( I have never caught a laker) said a .243 BLR. I own a .243 BLR and it is an incredible gun. They are light, easy to handle and extremely accurate. I shoot very tight groups with mine. If you choose to follow this suggestion - I would spend some time on the computer looking for a good used BLR pre 1981. Mine is 1980 and the quality of the gun is far superior to the 1981 and later models. These pre 1981 BLR's are not expensive. IMO
May 18th, 2014, 10:15 PM
Kilo Charlie

Any of the ones you listed, plus the .250 Savage and the .257 Roberts. People will yelp about ammo availability but I never had the slightest problem finding ammo in the South, ever. Mind you, when I went to a gun shop I bought more than one box at a time.
May 20th, 2014, 12:48 PM
Big Jack

You can't go wrong with a 6.5x55. Sold one to a fellow member here and it was a T3 blued synthetic and out of the box shot 3/4 groups all day long.

The one I still have is the Tikka varmint version and it is so darn accurate it is scary.

Easy on someone her stature and if she ever decides to go for moose or bear she will have no problem.

If you handload you can make a round for everything out there. 85 grain to 160 grain. Or just buy over the counter stuff.
May 20th, 2014, 01:13 PM
GrouseWhisperer

Quote:

Originally Posted by SongDog

My brother g/f is 21 and she's about 100lbs and can handle a .308 no problem. She is a good shot, but has practiced with a 17hmr and .22-250 quite a bit.

I'd go for a Ruger American Compact in .243. They are under 37" long which helps a small framed person hold the gun up a lot better. 6lb rifle with a decent 3-9-40mm scope and she should be good to go.

I'd agree. I like the Ruger American, and plan on buying one soon. .243 should mean lots of ammo choice/availability too. Recoil should be reasonable for even a light gun like this. Heck, my (not quite) 5' tall, 12 year old daughter was shooting 12ga. slugs off hand on Sunday, and was disappointed when we ran out of the 15 I brought! :)
May 20th, 2014, 01:15 PM
Species8472

Thanks for the input everyone.

I think we have decided to start shouldering some rifles in 6.5x55 Swede Calibre. If she does not find something that fits we will then move to a .243. We are not in any rush and as long as we have it figured out by the end of the summer it should be fine. That will give us the months of September and October to break it in (if new) and practice.
May 20th, 2014, 01:46 PM
blasted_saber

The one consideration about the 6.5 swede is that often people are most familiar with sporterized mausers in that calibre which weigh almost as much as the average 18 year woman (lol). That weight significantly reduces felt recoil. Even Big Jack above mentions his gun is varmint version, which also would weigh more then a typical sporter. A sporter weight or light weight rifle in that gun will have recoil, although less then you would expect from a "big" calibre.

If the gun is solely to be used for a deer rifle, I would look into a .243. Light recoil no matter what the weight of the gun, devastating on deer, wide spread and varied ammunition choices.

Another consideration would be something like 308 which has commercial loaded Remington "Managed Recoil" loads available. These loads offer the same performance as full load cartridges out to 200m or so. Then, when she is ready, she can bump up to much heavier shells and have the same gun for life to cover everything in Canada (grizzlies and polar bear exempted).

http://www.remington.com/product-fam...ed-recoil.aspx
May 20th, 2014, 01:48 PM
huntaway

I'd go with a .270 and start with the reduced Recoil ammo from Remington. As she becomes more comfortable and wishes to do a moose hunt up her ammo to some premium stuff and she'll be good to go. The reduced recoil stuff is fine for deer.

HA
May 20th, 2014, 02:25 PM
Exo200

Quote:

Originally Posted by Species8472

Thanks for the input everyone.

I think we have decided to start shouldering some rifles in 6.5x55 Swede Calibre. If she does not find something that fits we will then move to a .243. We are not in any rush and as long as we have it figured out by the end of the summer it should be fine. That will give us the months of September and October to break it in (if new) and practice.

Think your going a good direction. I have a 260 rem that I love but buying it I was well prepared to call it a reloader gun as ammo is hard to come buy at store's. Those 2 calibre's will do her fine
May 21st, 2014, 12:42 PM
Big Jack

Quote:

Originally Posted by blasted_saber

The one consideration about the 6.5 swede is that often people are most familiar with sporterized mausers in that calibre which weigh almost as much as the average 18 year woman (lol). That weight significantly reduces felt recoil. Even Big Jack above mentions his gun is varmint version, which also would weigh more then a typical sporter. A sporter weight or light weight rifle in that gun will have recoil, although less then you would expect from a "big" calibre.

If the gun is solely to be used for a deer rifle, I would look into a .243. Light recoil no matter what the weight of the gun, devastating on deer, wide spread and varied ammunition choices.

Another consideration would be something like 308 which has commercial loaded Remington "Managed Recoil" loads available. These loads offer the same performance as full load cartridges out to 200m or so. Then, when she is ready, she can bump up to much heavier shells and have the same gun for life to cover everything in Canada (grizzlies and polar bear exempted).

http://www.remington.com/product-fam...ed-recoil.aspx

Nope I may not have been clear. I have owned both the Tikka T3 lite (6+) pounds which I sold and still own a varmint version. Slightly more recoil on the t3 lite but nowhere near a 270. It was a pleasure to shoot.

Recoil is about the same as a 243 as far as I can tell....
May 21st, 2014, 03:29 PM
Pat32rf

I have a 270 in Rem 700. My buddy has one in a Rem pump. Pretty well similar grouping at 100yds, but they take more effort with the pump because the recoil seems worse. Don't notice it with the 700 until after I've shot my 243 Ruger #1, then I can start to feel the 270 effects.
May 22nd, 2014, 01:50 AM
GW11

I'm going to side with Dutch and vote for the 30-30. A little model 94 with a peep sight would be nice and light to handle for a 105 lb 18 year old. Or go with a Marlin 336 if a scope is a must. Very little recoil and kills deer just fine.

Here is a recoild table to give you a perspective of what recoil levels you get with most commercial rounds:

Cartridge (Wb@MV) Rifle Weight Recoil energy Recoil velocity

.17 HMR (17 at 2550) 7.5 0.2 n/a

.17 Rem. (25 at 4000) 8.5 1.6 3.5

.204 Ruger (33 at 4225) 8.5 2.6 4.4

.218 Bee (45 at 2800) 8.5 1.3 3.1

.219 Wasp (55 at 3300) 8.5 3.2 4.9

.219 Zipper (55 at 3400) 8.5 3.4 5.1

.22 LR (40 at 1165) 4.0 0.2 n/a

.22 WMR (40 at 1910) 6.75 0.4 n/a

.22 Hornet (45 at 2800) 7.5 1.3 3.3

.22 PPC (52 at 3300) 8.5 3.0 4.8

.221 Fireball (50 at 3000) 8.5 1.8 3.7

.222 Rem. (50 at 3200) 7.5 3.0 5.1

.223 Rem. (45 at 3500) 8.5 2.6 4.5

.223 Rem. (55 at 3200) 8.0 3.2 5.1

.223 Rem. (62 at 3025) 7.0 3.9 6.0

.225 Win. (55 at 3700) 8.5 4.4 5.7

.224 Wby. Mag. (55 at 3700) 10.0 3.6 4.8

.22-250 Rem. (55 at 3600) 8.5 4.7 6.0

.22-250 Rem. (60 at 3500) 12.5 3.1 4.0

.220 Swift (50 at 3900) 10.5 3.7 4.8

.220 Swift (55 at 3800) 8.5 5.3 6.4

.223 WSSM (55 at 3850) 7.5 6.4 7.4

.224 TTH (80 at 3550) 7.5 10.2 9.4

5.6x50 Mag. (60 at 3300) 7.5 4.0 5.9

5.6x52R (70 at 2800) 7.5 3.7 5.7

5.6x57 RWS (60 at 3800) 7.5 6.9 7.7

6mm PPC (85 at 2800) 7.5 5.3 n/a

6mm BR Rem. (80 at 3100) 8.5 5.2 6.3

6mm-223 (75 at 2950) 7.5 4.6 n/a

6mm Norma BR (95 at 2914) 8.5 5.9 6.7

6mm Lee Navy (112 at 2650) 8.5 6.5 7.0

.243 Win. (75 at 3400) 8.5 7.2 7.4

.243 Win. (95 at 3100) 7.25 11.0 9.9

.243 Win. (100 at 2960)
7.5 8.8 8.7

6mm Rem. (100 at 3100) 8.0 10.0 9.0

.243 WSSM (100 at 3100) 7.5 10.1 9.3

6mm-284 (105 at 3000) 7.5 10.9 9.7

6mm-06 (105 at 3000) 8.0 10.2 9.1

.240 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3406) 8.0 17.9 n/a

.25-20 Win. (86 at 1460) 6.5 1.3 3.5

.256 Win. Mag. (75 at 2400) 7.5 2.4 4.5

.25-35 Win. (117 at 2230) 6.5 7.0 8.3

.250 Savage (100 at 2900) 7.5 7.8 8.2

.257 Roberts (100 at 3000) 7.5 9.3 8.9

.257 Roberts (120 at 2800) 8.0 10.7 9.3

.257 Rob. Imp. (115 at 2900) 8.0 10.8 9.3

.25 WSSM (120 at 2990) 7.25 13.8 11.1

.25-06 Rem. (100 at 3230) 8.0 11.0 9.4

.25-06 Rem. (120 at 3000) 8.0 12.5 10.0

.257 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3602) 9.25 15.8 10.5

.257 Wby. Mag. (115 at 3433) 9.25 17.7 11.1

.257 Wby. Mag. (120 at 3300) 9.25 15.1 10.3

6.5mm Grendel (120 at 2600) 7.5 8.9 8.8

6.5x50 Arisaka (140 at 2600) 8.0 10.0 n/a

6.5x52 M-C (140 at 2200) 8.0 7.8 n/a

6.5x54 M-S (140 at 2400) 7.5 11.1 9.7

6.5x55 Swede (129 at 2700) 8.0 12.5 10.0

6.5x55 Swede (140 at 2650) 9.0 10.6 8.7

.260 Rem. (120 at 2860) 7.5 13.0 10.6

.260 Rem. (140 at 2750) 8.25 11.9 9.7

6.5x57 (140 at 2700) 8.0 12.5 10.0

6.5mm-284 Norma (140 at 2920) 8.0 14.7 10.9

6.5mm Rem. Mag. (120 at 3100) 8.0 13.1 10.3

6.5mm Rem. Mag. (140 at 2900) 8.5 13.9 10.3

6.5x68 S (140 at 2990) 8.5 16.8 11.3

.264 Win. Mag. (140 at 3200) 8.5 19.2 12.1

6.8mm Rem. SPC (115 at 2625) 7.5 8.0 8.3

.270 Win. (130 at 3140) 8.0 16.5 n/a

.270 Win. (140 at 3000) 8.0 17.1 11.7

.270 Win. (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.0 11.7

.270 WSM (130 at 3275) 8.0 18.7 12.3

.270 WSM (150 at 3000) 8.0 18.9 12.3

.270 Wby. Mag. (130 at 3375) 9.0 21.0 12.3

.270 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3000) 9.25 17.8 11.1

7-30 Waters (120 at 2700) 7.0 10.0 9.6

7x57 Mauser (139 at 2700) 8.75 11.7 9.3

7x57 Mauser (145 at 2725) 8.5 13.0 9.9

7x57 Mauser (160 at 2600) 8.0 14.3 n/a

7x57 Mauser (175 at 2500) 8.0 15.5 11.2

7mm-08 Rem. (120 at 3000) 7.5 12.1 10.2

7mm-08 Rem. (140 at 2860) 8.0 12.6 10.1

.284 Win (150 at 2860) 7.5 17.4 n/a

7x64 (154 at 2850) 8.0 17.9 n/a

7x65R (175 at 2600) 8.0 17.1 11.7

.280 Rem. (140 at 3000) 8.0 17.2 11.8

.280 Rem. (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.4 11.8

.280 Rem. (160 at 2800) 8.0 17.0 11.7

7x61 S&H Mag. (154 at 3000) 8.5 18.4 11.8

7mm Rem. SAUM (160 at 2931) 8.0 21.5 13.2

7mm WSM (140 at 3200) 8.0 20.7 12.9

7mm WSM (160 at 3000) 8.0 21.9 13.3

7mm Rem. Mag. (139 at 3100) 9.0 19.3 11.8

7mm Rem. Mag. (150 at 3100) 8.5 19.2 12.1

7mm Rem. Mag. (160 at 2950) 9.0 20.3 12.0

7mm Rem. Mag. (175 at 2870) 9.0 21.7 12.5

.275 H&H Mag. (160 at 3050) 8.5 19.5 12.2

7mm Wby. Mag. (140 at 3300) 9.25 19.5 11.7

7mm Wby. Mag. (160 at 3200) 9.0 25.6 13.5

7mm STW (160 at 3185) 8.5 27.9 14.6

7mm Ultra Mag. (140 at 3425) 8.5 25.3 n/a

7mm Ultra Mag. (160 at 3200) 8.5 29.4 n/a

.30 Carbine (110 at 1990) 7.0 3.5 5.7

.30 Rem. (170 at 2120) 7.5 9.8 9.2

.30-30 Win. (150 at 2400) 7.5 10.6 9.5

.30-30 Win. (160 at 2400) 7.5 12.7 10.5

.30-30 Win. (170 at 2200) 7.5 11.0 9.7

.30-40 Krag (180 at 2430) 8.0 16.6 n/a

.300 Sav. (150 at 2630) 7.5 14.8 n/a

.307 Win. (150 at 2600) 7.5 13.7 10.9

.308 Marlin Express (160 at 2660) 8.0 13.4 10.4

7.5x55 Swiss (150 at 2800) 9.0 12.9 9.6

.308 Win. (150 at 2800) 7.5 15.8 11.7

.308 Win. (165 at 2700) 7.5 18.1 12.5

.308 Win. (180 at 2610) 8.0 17.5 11.9

.30-06 Spfd. (150 at 2910) 8.0 17.6 11.9

.30-06 Spfd. (165 at 2900) 8.0 20.1 12.7

.30-06 Spfd. (180 at 2700) 8.0 20.3 12.8

.300 Rem. SAUM (180 at 2960) 8.25 23.5 13.6

.300 WSM (150 at 3300) 8.25 22.5 13.3

.300 WSM (180 at 2970) 7.25 27.1 15.5

.300 WSM (180 at 2970) 8.25 23.8 13.6

.308 Norma Mag. (180 at 3000) 8.5 25.9 14.0

.300 Win. Mag. (150 at 3320) 8.5 23.5 13.3

.300 Win. Mag. (165 at 3110) 8.0 26.2 14.5

.300 Win. Mag. (180 at 2960) 8.5 25.9 14.0

.300 H&H Mag. (180 at 2920) 8.5 23.1 13.2

.300 Dakota (180 at 3100) 8.5 28.3 14.7

.300 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3400) 9.25 24.6 13.1

.300 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3240) 9.0 31.6 15.0

.300 Ultra Mag. (180 at 3230) 8.5 32.8 15.8

.30-378 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3300) 9.75 42.6 16.8

7.62x39 Soviet (125 at 2350) 7.0 6.9 8.0

.303 Savage (170 at 2170) 7.5 10.3 9.4

7.65x53 Mauser (180 at 2500) 8.0 15.4 n/a

7.62x53R Finn (150 at 2800) 9.0 13.1 9.7

7.62x54R Russian (150 at 2800) 9.0 13.1 9.7

7.62x54R Russian (174 at 2600) 9.0 15.0 10.4

.303 British (150 at 2700) 7.5 14.2 11.0

.303 British (180 at 2420) 8.0 15.4 11.1

7.7x58 Jap (150 at 2700) 9.0 11.9 9.2

.32-20 Win. (100 at 1984) 6.5 3.3 n/a

.32 Spec. (170 at 2250) 7.0 12.2 10.6

8x56 M-S (170 at 2260) 8.0 12.4 10.0

8x57 Mauser (170 at 2400) 8.0 13.6 10.4

8x57JS Mauser (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.1 11.7

8x57JS Mauser (195 at 2500) 8.0 18.5 12.2

.325 WSM (180 at 3060) 7.5 33.1 16.9

.325 WSM (220 at 2840) 7.5 37.5 17.9

8x68S (150 at 3300) 8.5 25.3 13.9

8x68S (200 at 2950) 9.0 29.1 14.4

8mm Rem. Mag. (200 at 2900) 8.5 32.9 15.8

.33 Win. (200 at 2100) 8.0 13.9 10.6

.338-57 O'Connor (200 at 2400) 8.0 19.2 12.4

.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2400) 8.0 16.2 11.4

.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2600) 8.0 22.0 14.0

.338 Federal (200 at 2600) 7.0 22.2 14.3

.338 Federal (210 at 2630) 8.0 21.9 13.3

.338-06 A-Square (200 at 2800) 8.0 23.9 13.9

.338-06 A-Square (250 at 2500) 8.5 28.2 14.6

.338 Win. Mag. (200 at 2950) 8.5 32.8 15.8

.338 Win. Mag. (225 at 2780) 8.5 35.2 16.3

.338 Win. Mag. (250 at 2700) 9.0 33.1 15.4

.330 Dakota (250 at 2878) 8.5 40.5 17.6

.340 Wby. Mag. (200 at 3100) 10.0 29.6 13.8

.340 Wby. Mag. (250 at 2941) 9.0 43.4 17.6

.338 Ultra Mag (250 at 2860) 8.5 43.1 n/a

.338 Lapua Mag. (225 at 3000) 9.5 37.2 15.9

.338-378 Wby. Mag. (250 at 3040) 11.75 41.1 15.0

.348 Win. (200 at 2510) 8.0 23.7 n/a

.357 Mag. (158 at 1650) 7.0 4.7 6.6

.35 Rem. (200 at 2050) 7.5 13.5 10.8

.356 Win. (200 at 2400) 7.5 17.5 n/a

.358 Win. (200 at 2490) 8.0 20.9 13.0

.358 Win. (250 at 2260) 7.66 23.0 13.9

.35 Whelen (200 at 2675) 8.0 22.6 13.5

.35 Whelen (225 at 2525) 8.0 25.0 14.2

.35 Whelen (250 at 2400) 7.5 27.9 15.5

.350 Rem. Mag. (200 at 2700) 8.5 22.3 13.0

.350 Rem. Mag. (225 at 2550) 8.5 24.2 13.5

.350 Rem. Mag. (250 at 2500) 8.5 29.0 14.8

.358 Norma Mag. (250 at 2723) 9.0 31.2 15.0

9.3x57 (232 at 2330) 8.5 19.8 12.2

9.3x62 (250 at 2450) 8.5 25.7 14.0

9.3x62 (270 at 2550) 8.5 33.3 n/a

9.3x62 (286 at 2360) 9.0 28.0 14.1

9.3x64 (286 at 2650) 9.0 36.5 16.2

9.3x74R (250 at 2550) 9.0 29.1 14.4

9.3x74R (286 at 2400) 8.25 34.3 16.6

.370 Sako Mag. (286 at 2550) 8.5 35.2 16.3

.375 Win. (220 at 2200) 7.5 17.1 12.1

.375 Ruger (270 at 2840) 9.0 41.3 17.2

.375 H&H Mag. (235 at 2700) 9.0 29.5 14.5

.375 H&H Mag. (270 at 2690) 9.0 36.1 16.1

.375 H&H Mag. (300 at 2530) 9.0 37.3 16.3

.375 Dakota (300 at 2600) 8.5 44.5 18.4

.375 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2700) 10.0 47.3 17.5

.375 Ultra Mag (300 at 2800) 8.75 53.2 n/a

.376 Steyr (270 at 2580) 8.0 39.0 n/a

.378 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2900) 10.25 71.1 n/a

.38-40 Win. (180 at 1100) 7.5 3.1 5.2

.38-55 Win. (220 at 1650) 7.5 10.1 9.3

.38-55 Win. (255 at 1415) 7.0 9.5 n/a

.450/.400-3" (400 at 2150) 9.0 51.0 n/a

.404 Jeffery (400 at 2170) 10.25 41.0 16.1

.405 Win. (300 at 2200) 8.0 30.6 15.7

.416 Taylor (400 at 2350) 10.0 47.8 17.5

.416 Rem. Mag. (400 at 2400) 10.0 52.9 18.5

.416 Rigby (400 at 2400) 10.0 58.1 19.3

.416 Dakota (400 at 2500) 10.0 59.2 19.5

.416 Wby. Mag. (400 at 2700) 10.25 83.0 22.8

.44-40 Win. (200 at 1200) 7.0 3.4 n/a

.44 Rem. Mag. (240 at 1760) 7.5 11.2 9.8

.44 Rem. Mag. (275 at 1580) 7.5 11.4 9.9

.444 Marlin (240 at 2400) 7.5 23.3 14.2

.444 Marlin (265 at 2200) 8.5 22.1 12.9

.45 Colt (255 at 1100) 8.0 4.0 5.6

.45 Colt +P (250 at 1500) 6.5 11.1 10.5

.45-70 (300 at 1800) 7.0 23.9 14.8

.45-70 (350 at 1900) 7.0 37.9 18.7

.45-70 (405 at 1330) 7.5 18.7 12.7

.450 Marlin (350 at 2000) 7.0 37.2 18.5

.450 Marlin (350 at 2100) 8.5 33.6 16.0

.45-120 Sharps (405 at 1850) 9.0 33.9 n/a

.450 N.E. (465 at 2150) 11.0 55.5 18.0

.458 Win. Mag. (400 at 2050) 9.0 41.7 17.3

.458 Win. Mag. (500 at 2100) 9.0 62.3 21.1

.458 Lott (500 at 2300) 10.0 70.4 21.3

.460 Wby. Mag. (500 at 2600) 11.25 99.6 n/a

.500/.465 N.E. (480 at 2150) 11.0 60.7 n/a

.470 N.E. (500 at 2150) 11.0 69.3 20.1

.470 Mbogo (500 at 2509) 11.0 83.5 22.1

.480 Ruger (325 at 1450) 6.25 16.4 13.0

.500 N.E. (570 at 2150) 12.0 74.5 n/a

.50 BMG (647 at 2710) 30.0 70.0 12.3

.577 N.E. (750 at 2050) 12.0 127.5 n/a

.600 N.E. (900 at 1950) 12.0 154.0 28.8

May 22nd, 2014, 08:28 AM
Goosesniper

Go western on her. Get a scoped marlin 3030. Low recoil. Small compact carbine, great for someone with a small frame. . 300 yard range with this rifle. She will also have a rifle that she will consider to be one of her favourites. Mine is anyway. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/22/uba7ysed.jpg
May 22nd, 2014, 11:32 AM
GrouseWhisperer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Species8472

Thanks for the input everyone.

I think we have decided to start shouldering some rifles in 6.5x55 Swede Calibre. If she does not find something that fits we will then move to a .243. We are not in any rush and as long as we have it figured out by the end of the summer it should be fine. That will give us the months of September and October to break it in (if new) and practice.

Good plan, but, if I could make a suggestion~with the supply of some guns/ammo being so spotty in recent years, I'd urge you to buy what you want as soon as you can. ESPECIALLY deer-caliber rifles on the doorstep of deer season. I've adopted a "see it, buy it" mantra when it comes to ammo, regardless of whether the need for it is pressing. Too many times, I've gone to a gun shop to buy something that was there last week, only to have it gone...with no ETA on when it's replacement is coming.
May 24th, 2014, 09:04 PM
35wailin

6.5x55. Those long, heavy for calibre bullets in the upper end of that cartridges range penetrate like nobodies business. That is one of the most popular calibers for moose in Scandanavia.
May 25th, 2014, 10:00 AM
Roe+

Species,

Your problem will be her short arms, I went through the same thing with my daughter (now 18) a couple of years ago. I went with the Savage Model 11 with the youth stock (it only comes in .243) and it work perfect, shorter but stock that fit her perfect, soft recoil pad, she hardly feels the recoil. Bottom line- she loves to shoot it.

Checkout this link: http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/finder/

Roe+
July 11th, 2014, 11:50 AM
spikedbat

Gun looks sweet.. Where can I buy, anybody selling one used?

what kinda price range are we talking for this setup?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goosesniper

Go western on her. Get a scoped marlin 3030. Low recoil. Small compact carbine, great for someone with a small frame. . 300 yard range with this rifle. She will also have a rifle that she will consider to be one of her favourites. Mine is anyway. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/22/uba7ysed.jpg
July 11th, 2014, 04:05 PM
blasted_saber

Quote:

Originally Posted by spikedbat

Gun looks sweet.. Where can I buy, anybody selling one used?

what kinda price range are we talking for this setup?

$500ish at any gun shop.
July 11th, 2014, 04:31 PM
trimmer21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goosesniper

Go western on her. Get a scoped marlin 3030. Low recoil. Small compact carbine, great for someone with a small frame. . 300 yard range with this rifle. She will also have a rifle that she will consider to be one of her favourites. Mine is anyway. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/22/uba7ysed.jpg

X2 on the Marlin for a young lady. It's smallish,lots of swat,easy to shoulder and will last her whole life. Cabela's for $499.
July 11th, 2014, 05:01 PM
Hardman

I went with a youth model 7 in a .243 for my daughter. She is very accurate with it and fits well.
July 11th, 2014, 05:48 PM
pbonura

6.5x55 tikka lite. Load some 120 bullets. Perfect gun for everything and accurate. Once your daughter gets older and is looking for something for bear or deer load up 140 or 156 grain and you are good to go. 120 grain has very little recoil.
July 11th, 2014, 06:33 PM
mveniot

lever for a new shooter

Quote:

Originally Posted by trimmer21

X2 on the Marlin for a young lady. It's smallish,lots of swat,easy to shoulder and will last her whole life. Cabela's for $499.

Who in there right mind would give a lever action with an exposed hammer and tubular magazine to a NEW shooter! Look for a bolt with a good safety and a detachable magazine.
July 11th, 2014, 07:00 PM
trimmer21

Quote:

Originally Posted by mveniot

Who in there right mind would give a lever action with an exposed hammer and tubular magazine to a NEW shooter! Look for a bolt with a good safety and a detachable magazine.

Well,first,welcome to the forum. Exposed hammer and tubular mag is completely irrelevant. Why would you think it's an issue? Marlin rifles have a half-hammer safety and the lever must be fully depressed before the rifle will fire. The new ones even have a cross-bolt safety. No other firearm on the market is as safe for a new shooter. Having said that,I have no issue with bolts. I have three.
July 11th, 2014, 08:26 PM
blasted_saber

Quote:

Originally Posted by mveniot

Who in there right mind would give a lever action with an exposed hammer and tubular magazine to a NEW shooter! Look for a bolt with a good safety and a detachable magazine.

Marlins have a crossbolt safety. I dont get your problem with tubular magazines. Personally I find detachable magazines a terrible idea. You can't lose a magazine that is permanently attached to your gun.
July 13th, 2014, 09:23 AM
mveniot

Didn't realize that Marlin had a cross bolt safety, we had a group of young fellows who were unloading there firearms at the truck. One of the firearms discharged and killed his buddy. It was a model 94. Thumb slipped off the hammer. Terrible scene! Life long consequences. The less amount of motion it takes to download a firearm the better for an inexperienced hunter.
July 13th, 2014, 10:34 AM
jaycee

Quote:

Originally Posted by mveniot

Didn't realize that Marlin had a cross bolt safety, we had a group of young fellows who were unloading there firearms at the truck. One of the firearms discharged and killed his buddy. It was a model 94. Thumb slipped off the hammer. Terrible scene! Life long consequences. The less amount of motion it takes to download a firearm the better for an inexperienced hunter.

This would not have happened if he would have unloaded the proper way ;

depress the loading gate and remove all the rounds in the mag. tube, you have one round left in the chamber which you unload by racking the lever , VOILA EMPTY SAFE FIREARM.
Do not forget , do this while pointing the firearm in a safe direction.
OBVIOUSLY THAT YOUNG FELLOW DID NOT POINT IT IN A SAFE DIRECTION AND WAS CARELESS, NEEDLESSLY ENDING SOME ONE'S LIFE.
July 13th, 2014, 03:35 PM
blasted_saber

Quote:

Originally Posted by mveniot

Didn't realize that Marlin had a cross bolt safety, we had a group of young fellows who were unloading there firearms at the truck. One of the firearms discharged and killed his buddy. It was a model 94. Thumb slipped off the hammer. Terrible scene! Life long consequences. The less amount of motion it takes to download a firearm the better for an inexperienced hunter.

If the gun discharged and hit his buddy it means he wasnt controlling the muzzle. Yes I agree it is terrible, but blaming operator negligence on a firearm isnt the correct response.

As an aside, a hammer extension is "must have" for any rifle with an exposed hammer. It makes dropping the hammer pretty much fool proof.
July 13th, 2014, 05:17 PM
shorst97

I vote the .243 or the 7mm-08 in a youth model. As long as it fits her well so that it is comfortable to shoulder and shoot, the recoil will be that much more manageable. I vote the .243 for the availability of ammo anywhere you go.
July 14th, 2014, 10:43 AM
Fox

I love the 6.5x55mm, but with the weight of the sporters it can be a problem.
I picked up a CIL (Savage) bolt action 30-30 for the fiancee, she is 5'1" tall so we needed something compact. Partner this with Hornady LeverRevolution (I know we can use spire point but the OAL length is a problem) and she would be able to go on a moose hunt with it. The 6.5x55mm she shot once and burst into tears, but I think the shock of the bang did it, this was her first shot with anything stronger then the 410.

She shoots the 20ga 3" turkey shells no problem now, after laughing at me patterning the 3 1/2" 12ga shells and having my arm go numb.
July 15th, 2014, 06:41 PM
werner.reiche

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaycee

This would not have happened if he would have unloaded the proper way ;

depress the loading gate and remove all the rounds in the mag. tube, you have one round left in the chamber which you unload by racking the lever , VOILA EMPTY SAFE FIREARM.
Do not forget , do this while pointing the firearm in a safe direction.
OBVIOUSLY THAT YOUNG FELLOW DID NOT POINT IT IN A SAFE DIRECTION AND WAS CARELESS, NEEDLESSLY ENDING SOME ONE'S LIFE.

Jaycee - none of my levers - Winchesters or Marlins can be unloaded like that - that includes 3 marlin 444s from mid 60's to a few years ago and Winchesters from 1900 to 1992. Muzzle control is what its all about - and if your not doing that right, even a muzzleloader is dangerous.

Blasted - re: hammer extensions - I don't have a problem with the Winchesters - but I do with the marlins. They all have extensions as well as a couple of the Winchesters.

Re: the hammer block safeties - the problem I see with them is that guys don't like using two safeties - so they either leave the hammer block on fire all the time or use it as a safety and walk around with the rifle fully cocked all the time.

The Winchester hammer blocks are made of some crappy very brittle metal. I broke one of them by dry firing against it. Glad there wasn't a live round in the chamber.
July 16th, 2014, 09:56 AM
jaycee

Quote:

Originally Posted by werner.reiche

Jaycee - none of my levers - Winchesters or Marlins can be unloaded like that - that includes 3 marlin 444s from mid 60's to a few years ago and Winchesters from 1900 to 1992. Muzzle control is what its all about - and if your not doing that right, even a muzzleloader is dangerous
.

On my model 94,built in 1951, and my buddy's at camp an older one , that is how we unload them , depress the loading gate and just give the round a forward nudge to get it past the cartridge stop [I guess they call it]and the round comes out, you have to do this with all the succeeding rounds as they do not just voluntarily come out.
I was taught this by a fellow much older than myself at 72.
July 16th, 2014, 12:03 PM
Fox

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaycee

On my model 94,built in 1951, and my buddy's at camp an older one , that is how we unload them , depress the loading gate and just give the round a forward nudge to get it past the cartridge stop [I guess they call it]and the round comes out, you have to do this with all the succeeding rounds as they do not just voluntarily come out.
I was taught this by a fellow much older than myself at 72.

I will check my Win 94AE, I cannot remember being able to unload through the gate very easily.

The Win94 is actually a very safe gun, there are 3 safeties on it I believe, you have to have the gun fully locked up before it will fire, if the gun is leaning on something even with the hammer cocked you cannot fire it with a stick, you have to pull up on the lever as well as pull the trigger while having the hammer back.

It is all muzzle control, as lots of people have said. The Win 94 is no more dangerous then single shot exposed hammer shotguns, Win 1897, cooey single shot. That being said, if you want a bullet proof safety you have to go military where a strong piece of metal blocks the firing pin rather then the trigger as in most modern firearms.
July 16th, 2014, 08:49 PM
TPM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mveniot

Didn't realize that Marlin had a cross bolt safety, we had a group of young fellows who were unloading there firearms at the truck. One of the firearms discharged and killed his buddy. It was a model 94. Thumb slipped off the hammer. Terrible scene! Life long consequences. The less amount of motion it takes to download a firearm the better for an inexperienced hunter.

Why would his thumb be anywhere near the hammer while unloading it?
July 17th, 2014, 06:53 AM
Fox

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPM

Why would his thumb be anywhere near the hammer while unloading it?

Good point, I missed that, when loading and putting it on safe then it makes sense, unloading, why was the trigger pulled?
July 17th, 2014, 09:33 AM
trimmer21

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPM

Why would his thumb be anywhere near the hammer while unloading it?

The only way that could happen is if he miscounted the number of rounds he removed. Without checking the breech,he attempted to lower the hammer which would still be in fullcock positon and a round was still in the chamber. His thumb slipped and "BANG"!
July 17th, 2014, 09:41 AM
werner.reiche

Quote:

Originally Posted by trimmer21

The only way that could happen is if he miscounted the number of rounds he removed. Without checking the breech,he attempted to lower the hammer which would still be in fullcock positon and a round was still in the chamber. His thumb slipped and "BANG"!

Or he just dry fired on an "empty" chamber to uncock it.
July 17th, 2014, 10:27 AM
trimmer21

Quote:

Originally Posted by werner.reiche

Or he just dry fired on an "empty" chamber to uncock it.

You just gave me the willies,werner. That's criminal negligence cause death. Prison-slam dunk.
July 19th, 2014, 09:38 PM
FrucksOutdoor

My oldest daughter has been using my .243 with good results. She's about the same weight as your daughter. I love that calibre as a deer gun. If you can get one with a little weight to it, she should be able to handle the recoil without an issue

Cartridge (Wb@MV)	Rifle Weight	Recoil energy	Recoil velocity
.17 HMR (17 at 2550)	7.5	0.2	n/a
.17 Rem. (25 at 4000)	8.5	1.6	3.5
.204 Ruger (33 at 4225)	8.5	2.6	4.4
.218 Bee (45 at 2800)	8.5	1.3	3.1
.219 Wasp (55 at 3300)	8.5	3.2	4.9
.219 Zipper (55 at 3400)	8.5	3.4	5.1
.22 LR (40 at 1165)	4.0	0.2	n/a
.22 WMR (40 at 1910)	6.75	0.4	n/a
.22 Hornet (45 at 2800)	7.5	1.3	3.3
.22 PPC (52 at 3300)	8.5	3.0	4.8
.221 Fireball (50 at 3000)	8.5	1.8	3.7
.222 Rem. (50 at 3200)	7.5	3.0	5.1
.223 Rem. (45 at 3500)	8.5	2.6	4.5
.223 Rem. (55 at 3200)	8.0	3.2	5.1
.223 Rem. (62 at 3025)	7.0	3.9	6.0
.225 Win. (55 at 3700)	8.5	4.4	5.7
.224 Wby. Mag. (55 at 3700)	10.0	3.6	4.8
.22-250 Rem. (55 at 3600)	8.5	4.7	6.0
.22-250 Rem. (60 at 3500)	12.5	3.1	4.0
.220 Swift (50 at 3900)	10.5	3.7	4.8
.220 Swift (55 at 3800)	8.5	5.3	6.4
.223 WSSM (55 at 3850)	7.5	6.4	7.4
.224 TTH (80 at 3550)	7.5	10.2	9.4
5.6x50 Mag. (60 at 3300)	7.5	4.0	5.9
5.6x52R (70 at 2800)	7.5	3.7	5.7
5.6x57 RWS (60 at 3800)	7.5	6.9	7.7
6mm PPC (85 at 2800)	7.5	5.3	n/a
6mm BR Rem. (80 at 3100)	8.5	5.2	6.3
6mm-223 (75 at 2950)	7.5	4.6	n/a
6mm Norma BR (95 at 2914)	8.5	5.9	6.7
6mm Lee Navy (112 at 2650)	8.5	6.5	7.0
.243 Win. (75 at 3400)	8.5	7.2	7.4
.243 Win. (95 at 3100)	7.25	11.0	9.9
.243 Win. (100 at 2960)	7.5	8.8	8.7
6mm Rem. (100 at 3100)	8.0	10.0	9.0
.243 WSSM (100 at 3100)	7.5	10.1	9.3
6mm-284 (105 at 3000)	7.5	10.9	9.7
6mm-06 (105 at 3000)	8.0	10.2	9.1
.240 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3406)	8.0	17.9	n/a
.25-20 Win. (86 at 1460)	6.5	1.3	3.5
.256 Win. Mag. (75 at 2400)	7.5	2.4	4.5
.25-35 Win. (117 at 2230)	6.5	7.0	8.3
.250 Savage (100 at 2900)	7.5	7.8	8.2
.257 Roberts (100 at 3000)	7.5	9.3	8.9
.257 Roberts (120 at 2800)	8.0	10.7	9.3
.257 Rob. Imp. (115 at 2900)	8.0	10.8	9.3
.25 WSSM (120 at 2990)	7.25	13.8	11.1
.25-06 Rem. (100 at 3230)	8.0	11.0	9.4
.25-06 Rem. (120 at 3000)	8.0	12.5	10.0
.257 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3602)	9.25	15.8	10.5
.257 Wby. Mag. (115 at 3433)	9.25	17.7	11.1
.257 Wby. Mag. (120 at 3300)	9.25	15.1	10.3
6.5mm Grendel (120 at 2600)	7.5	8.9	8.8
6.5x50 Arisaka (140 at 2600)	8.0	10.0	n/a
6.5x52 M-C (140 at 2200)	8.0	7.8	n/a
6.5x54 M-S (140 at 2400)	7.5	11.1	9.7
6.5x55 Swede (129 at 2700)	8.0	12.5	10.0
6.5x55 Swede (140 at 2650)	9.0	10.6	8.7
.260 Rem. (120 at 2860)	7.5	13.0	10.6
.260 Rem. (140 at 2750)	8.25	11.9	9.7
6.5x57 (140 at 2700)	8.0	12.5	10.0
6.5mm-284 Norma (140 at 2920)	8.0	14.7	10.9
6.5mm Rem. Mag. (120 at 3100)	8.0	13.1	10.3
6.5mm Rem. Mag. (140 at 2900)	8.5	13.9	10.3
6.5x68 S (140 at 2990)	8.5	16.8	11.3
.264 Win. Mag. (140 at 3200)	8.5	19.2	12.1
6.8mm Rem. SPC (115 at 2625)	7.5	8.0	8.3
.270 Win. (130 at 3140)	8.0	16.5	n/a
.270 Win. (140 at 3000)	8.0	17.1	11.7
.270 Win. (150 at 2900)	8.0	17.0	11.7
.270 WSM (130 at 3275)	8.0	18.7	12.3
.270 WSM (150 at 3000)	8.0	18.9	12.3
.270 Wby. Mag. (130 at 3375)	9.0	21.0	12.3
.270 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3000)	9.25	17.8	11.1
7-30 Waters (120 at 2700)	7.0	10.0	9.6
7x57 Mauser (139 at 2700)	8.75	11.7	9.3
7x57 Mauser (145 at 2725)	8.5	13.0	9.9
7x57 Mauser (160 at 2600)	8.0	14.3	n/a
7x57 Mauser (175 at 2500)	8.0	15.5	11.2
7mm-08 Rem. (120 at 3000)	7.5	12.1	10.2
7mm-08 Rem. (140 at 2860)	8.0	12.6	10.1
.284 Win (150 at 2860)	7.5	17.4	n/a
7x64 (154 at 2850)	8.0	17.9	n/a
7x65R (175 at 2600)	8.0	17.1	11.7
.280 Rem. (140 at 3000)	8.0	17.2	11.8
.280 Rem. (150 at 2900)	8.0	17.4	11.8
.280 Rem. (160 at 2800)	8.0	17.0	11.7
7x61 S&H Mag. (154 at 3000)	8.5	18.4	11.8
7mm Rem. SAUM (160 at 2931)	8.0	21.5	13.2
7mm WSM (140 at 3200)	8.0	20.7	12.9
7mm WSM (160 at 3000)	8.0	21.9	13.3
7mm Rem. Mag. (139 at 3100)	9.0	19.3	11.8
7mm Rem. Mag. (150 at 3100)	8.5	19.2	12.1
7mm Rem. Mag. (160 at 2950)	9.0	20.3	12.0
7mm Rem. Mag. (175 at 2870)	9.0	21.7	12.5
.275 H&H Mag. (160 at 3050)	8.5	19.5	12.2
7mm Wby. Mag. (140 at 3300)	9.25	19.5	11.7
7mm Wby. Mag. (160 at 3200)	9.0	25.6	13.5
7mm STW (160 at 3185)	8.5	27.9	14.6
7mm Ultra Mag. (140 at 3425)	8.5	25.3	n/a
7mm Ultra Mag. (160 at 3200)	8.5	29.4	n/a
.30 Carbine (110 at 1990)	7.0	3.5	5.7
.30 Rem. (170 at 2120)	7.5	9.8	9.2
.30-30 Win. (150 at 2400)	7.5	10.6	9.5
.30-30 Win. (160 at 2400)	7.5	12.7	10.5
.30-30 Win. (170 at 2200)	7.5	11.0	9.7
.30-40 Krag (180 at 2430)	8.0	16.6	n/a
.300 Sav. (150 at 2630)	7.5	14.8	n/a
.307 Win. (150 at 2600)	7.5	13.7	10.9
.308 Marlin Express (160 at 2660)	8.0	13.4	10.4
7.5x55 Swiss (150 at 2800)	9.0	12.9	9.6
.308 Win. (150 at 2800)	7.5	15.8	11.7
.308 Win. (165 at 2700)	7.5	18.1	12.5
.308 Win. (180 at 2610)	8.0	17.5	11.9
.30-06 Spfd. (150 at 2910)	8.0	17.6	11.9
.30-06 Spfd. (165 at 2900)	8.0	20.1	12.7
.30-06 Spfd. (180 at 2700)	8.0	20.3	12.8
.300 Rem. SAUM (180 at 2960)	8.25	23.5	13.6
.300 WSM (150 at 3300)	8.25	22.5	13.3
.300 WSM (180 at 2970)	7.25	27.1	15.5
.300 WSM (180 at 2970)	8.25	23.8	13.6
.308 Norma Mag. (180 at 3000)	8.5	25.9	14.0
.300 Win. Mag. (150 at 3320)	8.5	23.5	13.3
.300 Win. Mag. (165 at 3110)	8.0	26.2	14.5
.300 Win. Mag. (180 at 2960)	8.5	25.9	14.0
.300 H&H Mag. (180 at 2920)	8.5	23.1	13.2
.300 Dakota (180 at 3100)	8.5	28.3	14.7
.300 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3400)	9.25	24.6	13.1
.300 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3240)	9.0	31.6	15.0
.300 Ultra Mag. (180 at 3230)	8.5	32.8	15.8
.30-378 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3300)	9.75	42.6	16.8
7.62x39 Soviet (125 at 2350)	7.0	6.9	8.0
.303 Savage (170 at 2170)	7.5	10.3	9.4
7.65x53 Mauser (180 at 2500)	8.0	15.4	n/a
7.62x53R Finn (150 at 2800)	9.0	13.1	9.7
7.62x54R Russian (150 at 2800)	9.0	13.1	9.7
7.62x54R Russian (174 at 2600)	9.0	15.0	10.4
.303 British (150 at 2700)	7.5	14.2	11.0
.303 British (180 at 2420)	8.0	15.4	11.1
7.7x58 Jap (150 at 2700)	9.0	11.9	9.2
.32-20 Win. (100 at 1984)	6.5	3.3	n/a
.32 Spec. (170 at 2250)	7.0	12.2	10.6
8x56 M-S (170 at 2260)	8.0	12.4	10.0
8x57 Mauser (170 at 2400)	8.0	13.6	10.4
8x57JS Mauser (150 at 2900)	8.0	17.1	11.7
8x57JS Mauser (195 at 2500)	8.0	18.5	12.2
.325 WSM (180 at 3060)	7.5	33.1	16.9
.325 WSM (220 at 2840)	7.5	37.5	17.9
8x68S (150 at 3300)	8.5	25.3	13.9
8x68S (200 at 2950)	9.0	29.1	14.4
8mm Rem. Mag. (200 at 2900)	8.5	32.9	15.8
.33 Win. (200 at 2100)	8.0	13.9	10.6
.338-57 O'Connor (200 at 2400)	8.0	19.2	12.4
.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2400)	8.0	16.2	11.4
.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2600)	8.0	22.0	14.0
.338 Federal (200 at 2600)	7.0	22.2	14.3
.338 Federal (210 at 2630)	8.0	21.9	13.3
.338-06 A-Square (200 at 2800)	8.0	23.9	13.9
.338-06 A-Square (250 at 2500)	8.5	28.2	14.6
.338 Win. Mag. (200 at 2950)	8.5	32.8	15.8
.338 Win. Mag. (225 at 2780)	8.5	35.2	16.3
.338 Win. Mag. (250 at 2700)	9.0	33.1	15.4
.330 Dakota (250 at 2878)	8.5	40.5	17.6
.340 Wby. Mag. (200 at 3100)	10.0	29.6	13.8
.340 Wby. Mag. (250 at 2941)	9.0	43.4	17.6
.338 Ultra Mag (250 at 2860)	8.5	43.1	n/a
.338 Lapua Mag. (225 at 3000)	9.5	37.2	15.9
.338-378 Wby. Mag. (250 at 3040)	11.75	41.1	15.0
.348 Win. (200 at 2510)	8.0	23.7	n/a
.357 Mag. (158 at 1650)	7.0	4.7	6.6
.35 Rem. (200 at 2050)	7.5	13.5	10.8
.356 Win. (200 at 2400)	7.5	17.5	n/a
.358 Win. (200 at 2490)	8.0	20.9	13.0
.358 Win. (250 at 2260)	7.66	23.0	13.9
.35 Whelen (200 at 2675)	8.0	22.6	13.5
.35 Whelen (225 at 2525)	8.0	25.0	14.2
.35 Whelen (250 at 2400)	7.5	27.9	15.5
.350 Rem. Mag. (200 at 2700)	8.5	22.3	13.0
.350 Rem. Mag. (225 at 2550)	8.5	24.2	13.5
.350 Rem. Mag. (250 at 2500)	8.5	29.0	14.8
.358 Norma Mag. (250 at 2723)	9.0	31.2	15.0
9.3x57 (232 at 2330)	8.5	19.8	12.2
9.3x62 (250 at 2450)	8.5	25.7	14.0
9.3x62 (270 at 2550)	8.5	33.3	n/a
9.3x62 (286 at 2360)	9.0	28.0	14.1
9.3x64 (286 at 2650)	9.0	36.5	16.2
9.3x74R (250 at 2550)	9.0	29.1	14.4
9.3x74R (286 at 2400)	8.25	34.3	16.6
.370 Sako Mag. (286 at 2550)	8.5	35.2	16.3
.375 Win. (220 at 2200)	7.5	17.1	12.1
.375 Ruger (270 at 2840)	9.0	41.3	17.2
.375 H&H Mag. (235 at 2700)	9.0	29.5	14.5
.375 H&H Mag. (270 at 2690)	9.0	36.1	16.1
.375 H&H Mag. (300 at 2530)	9.0	37.3	16.3
.375 Dakota (300 at 2600)	8.5	44.5	18.4
.375 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2700)	10.0	47.3	17.5
.375 Ultra Mag (300 at 2800)	8.75	53.2	n/a
.376 Steyr (270 at 2580)	8.0	39.0	n/a
.378 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2900)	10.25	71.1	n/a
.38-40 Win. (180 at 1100)	7.5	3.1	5.2
.38-55 Win. (220 at 1650)	7.5	10.1	9.3
.38-55 Win. (255 at 1415)	7.0	9.5	n/a
.450/.400-3" (400 at 2150)	9.0	51.0	n/a
.404 Jeffery (400 at 2170)	10.25	41.0	16.1
.405 Win. (300 at 2200)	8.0	30.6	15.7
.416 Taylor (400 at 2350)	10.0	47.8	17.5
.416 Rem. Mag. (400 at 2400)	10.0	52.9	18.5
.416 Rigby (400 at 2400)	10.0	58.1	19.3
.416 Dakota (400 at 2500)	10.0	59.2	19.5
.416 Wby. Mag. (400 at 2700)	10.25	83.0	22.8
.44-40 Win. (200 at 1200)	7.0	3.4	n/a
.44 Rem. Mag. (240 at 1760)	7.5	11.2	9.8
.44 Rem. Mag. (275 at 1580)	7.5	11.4	9.9
.444 Marlin (240 at 2400)	7.5	23.3	14.2
.444 Marlin (265 at 2200)	8.5	22.1	12.9
.45 Colt (255 at 1100)	8.0	4.0	5.6
.45 Colt +P (250 at 1500)	6.5	11.1	10.5
.45-70 (300 at 1800)	7.0	23.9	14.8
.45-70 (350 at 1900)	7.0	37.9	18.7
.45-70 (405 at 1330)	7.5	18.7	12.7
.450 Marlin (350 at 2000)	7.0	37.2	18.5
.450 Marlin (350 at 2100)	8.5	33.6	16.0
.45-120 Sharps (405 at 1850)	9.0	33.9	n/a
.450 N.E. (465 at 2150)	11.0	55.5	18.0
.458 Win. Mag. (400 at 2050)	9.0	41.7	17.3
.458 Win. Mag. (500 at 2100)	9.0	62.3	21.1
.458 Lott (500 at 2300)	10.0	70.4	21.3
.460 Wby. Mag. (500 at 2600)	11.25	99.6	n/a
.500/.465 N.E. (480 at 2150)	11.0	60.7	n/a
.470 N.E. (500 at 2150)	11.0	69.3	20.1
.470 Mbogo (500 at 2509)	11.0	83.5	22.1
.480 Ruger (325 at 1450)	6.25	16.4	13.0
.500 N.E. (570 at 2150)	12.0	74.5	n/a
.50 BMG (647 at 2710)	30.0	70.0	12.3
.577 N.E. (750 at 2050)	12.0	127.5	n/a
.600 N.E. (900 at 1950)	12.0	154.0	28.8