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Just received the Questionnaire in the mail..gives you the option of doing it on-line at link below.
If your done hunting Deer for the year and even if you didn't fill your tag, please do your part to help the MNR with the numbers.....I was at a lecture a few years back (before the on-line) and the MNR said they only got around a 6% return annually from the questionnaires....surely as hunters we can do better.
https://www2.on.wildlifelicense.com/...1&type=Harvest
Thanks for posting the link. I just completed my survey. Pretty easy.
Done. Thanks for the link!
Done, thanks
So, do you have to receive a questionnaire by mail to be able to fill out the survey? That's how it used to be, and I used to receive them along with my license pretty much every year. I always filled them out, but it has been a few years now that I have not received the survey. I'm wondering if they have changed the system or something.
I do complete them every time I get one.
My beef is this why not make it COMPULSORY not voluntary.
I feel that every one participating on the controlled hunt which purpose is to control the deer population should have to fill up a survey after the hunt. I feel that this will give you a better feedback on the harvest during the hunt.
I do believe the Controlled hunts are already compulsory..page 70 of the 2014 regs..Quote:
Originally Posted by huntrfishr
mine just came in the mail Monday and yes I make sure to fill them out and remind everyone in are group to fill theres out as well .Dutch
You should HAVE to fill this out, You should only be able to buy a tag the following year if you completed the survey.
This has to be one of the MNR's best tool for judging animal populations.
agreedQuote:
Originally Posted by SongDog
Yes, deer hunters should complete the survey, and the MNR should have the postage prepaid. We are approaching $50 for a tag now.
And beside OOD members who tell the truth?!?Quote:
Originally Posted by SongDog
I'd rather them not pay postage. Thats dollars that can be better spent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness
They give us the option of doing it online, which the vast majority of the population has access to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness
You could have done it on-line FREE in about the same time it took to type that post MS :)Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
I'm just happy it's all online now. It was always hard to remember to fill out the bear one 3-4 months after the season ended and mail it in. I'm surprised it's actually so high at 6% considering it was voluntary reporting.
I'm curious how much some WMUs will have their tag numbers skewed by people wanting more tags the next year.
Recall that this isnt the only way quotas are set. MTO collision data is also used. Im sure some biologists just go off of "feel" and experience as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by x_xeon_x
They don't pay any attention to you anyway so what are we paying for .? Giving a job out to someone opening envelopes ? Last thing we need is more pencil pushers and analysts squandering the zero budget . Yes I fill them out when I get them but am too disgruntled to even give the MNR much weight in how they come up with their conclusions . The Ministry is run by a bunch of pencil pushing , pinko idiots . I can still hear them last year ." DON'T Supplemental FEED the DEER " while the poor buggers were above their ears in snow . Then at the end when the MNR stepped out in the sunlight they said " Oh My " . " It was a hard winter and we should feed " . IDIOTS . They protect the wolves and coyotes but let the deer starve .
Some of us got our deer here because we helped them out last winter but like most hunters here , and there , we don't have the budget to sustain the whole herd in the province . I'm up already over my knees in the white stuff and it is only November and I started feeding , and damned to the Ministry of NO Returns . Anybody worth their salt spending time in the bush knows when the deer or anything in the bush is in trouble . Do you honestly think a bunch of wet behind the ears biologists sitting behind a desk know anything ? They read graphs , not sign in the bush .
TD
C'mon bigbear, tell us what you really think. For the record, I like your assessment. I just completed my questionnaire online and I hope it is helpful to the ministry. Information provided by those of us afield at least gives them something to work with. We can't force them to analyze it correctly, but we can hope they do.
I agree with what you say bigbear. If the MNR even follow up on a lot of these questioners would surprise me.
That's a BS rumour about the MTO collision data. I checked into this in 2009 with the OPP (its actually them, not MTO) - and this data is not readily available.Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
I actually met the gal who processes the questionnaire data, she was at the same lecture. She went thru the whole process with what they do with the accumulated Deer data, real eye opener.Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxx
Someone asked about falsified data from guys who try to 'fudge' the numbers.....she says their data stands out of the bell curves so is quickly discarded. Wasted opportunity that could have been better used.
All this is in an effort to determine regional Deer densities per km/2...we might not like to see how that affects the Doe tags and extra Tags, but it's all in an attempt to ensure that the Deer don't become overpopulated.
I like it that it is made online yet we can go further.
Why not publish the results so everyone can see it.
Like how many deer were taken on a certain WMU compared to how many were estimated last year?
The personnel MNR (observation on the field) data compared to the survey data.
An ongoing reporting through the year like an open system or site online where we can put input in during the spring or summer on fawn sightings etc...might be helpful also.
Then maybe we can put those pencil pushers working efficiently this way.
Most hunters are almost always in the field one way or another anyway so an ongoing online reporting on sightings etc. should be great.
Any idea why they ask about wildlife sightings of everything EXCEPT moose? Bear, wolf, coyote, elk, turkey... no moose?
I saw moose in both areas I was deer hunting.
Tried to submit mine but couldn't get past continue...
This is what I am alluding to...a site on line that everyone can log in and report GAME ANIMALS sightings as part of an on going survey...Quote:
Originally Posted by northernontario
You need to answer the question: Do you have an outdoor card? It shows up as soon as you select "I'm a resident of Ontario".Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo D
You missed a checkbox of some sort.
If I said I harvested a deer with a gun in a bow only zone would I get in trouble? (Did not do that but I like messing with the gov't)
It would be a good way to know if they even care about the survey!Quote:
Originally Posted by topher
I'd bet you'd get a phone call out of that. IQuote:
Originally Posted by topher
applied for a bull tag in a wmu without any bull tags because I couldn't hunt that fall but wanted to stay in the A pool. That was worth about 5 phone calls from the MNR. They came out with unit 99Z the following year to allow people to intentionally do this. Now I think its all done with codes for WMU/cow/bull so you can't confuse them.
Or "under populated"? I have no doubt the info from these survey's is used to good advantage, and I would like to see a more thorough break down of the WMU included in the survey. Township perhaps? I hunt WMU 36 and it is huge, with many areas having very little deer population. There are a few small pockets within, however I believe it would be much more beneficial for the MNRF, the deer AND the hunters to break the info down even further. Deer density per square km. in a WMU this size can't possibly give them the real picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikePal
That's the second thing I did after getting home. First was opening the envelopes that CP delivered today. I fill mine out every year.
Fill mine out every year as well,still have a bow tag left so will wait till the end of the season.any info they can muster has to help,you sure don't see many co's out and about,like mentioned above hunters are afield all year long.mac
It would be nice if they published all their research and data that billions of our tax dollars over the decades have funded.
No, there are already far too many things "compulsory" in this province. I think that the surveys, as the main method of estimating deer numbers and sex and age ratios, are kind of a joke. There is no method of verifying the information, and, I routinely hear hunters agreeing to "cook the books" as far as surveys are concerned.Quote:
Originally Posted by huntrfishr
I have to agree, My unit is at least 4 different county`s. That is huge. 3 of the units the deer population has taken a major hit the last few years, The one county has a decent population mostly because it has a lot of anti hunters and land locked by water and provincial parks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bushmoose
Fudging the answers mean that they don't believe in it's value. So it's either the MNR hasn't sold this to the public by not giving enough info on it as you say or just plain irresponsible on part of hunters. I don't believe most of us are and if the goal is for conservation and game management then it's a good tool and everyone should welcome it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigbear
I'm sure deep down people who fudge the numbers do actually understand how important these surveys are for biologists, but I think some hunters only have the next season on their mind. If people are reporting they're seeing more animals than they did so they can get more tags the next year, the years after are only going to be continually worse for hunting. Especially with the winter we had last year, the deer herds need a couple good winters to rebound from that alone.Quote:
Originally Posted by huntrfishr
I'd think if they completely cut anterless tags in the hardest hit WMUs for a few years, the few years after would make for some fantastic hunts once the populations stabilized again. Seeing how there were very few tag reductions in most of those WMUs this year and people were already disappointed with their success, next year is going to be even worse for hunting in those areas.
Is there anywhere to see what the numbers or avg deer numbers look like per WMU?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SongDog
That's interesting, I was into the impression that the deer collapse was from last year tough winter and the over population of yotes, not hunters. If it the case the MNR should have reduce the tags a while ago so the survey is just a waste of time....
Fudging the answers means that the fudger knows that the process is a joke, and, decides to use it with impunity to further his own means. And all the best of intentions in the world from the MNR isn't going to change that.Quote:
Originally Posted by huntrfishr
It isn't that hunter surveys are of no value - it's just that they are pretty well the sole tool that the MNR uses to determine deer herd numbers and age and sex ratios.
All the more reason to fil them out properly and submit them....the least we can do as Hunters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigbear
One of the OODMag issues this summer had an article about how deer tag quotas were set. I can;t seem to find it.
EDIT - Its the September "Hunting Annual" issue. Its in the OFAH member section in the centre of the issue entitled "Why Ontario hunters are seeing deer deal cuts by the thousands". Go to page 50 and flip a couple more through the un-numbered section).
According to the article I just mentioned, they are indeed used.Quote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche
"Vehicle collision data provided by the Ministry of transportation...."
If you can find that data - either from the MTO or OPP, I'd be interested in it. But I suspect you'll find as I did that it doesn't exist. Try getting in touch with MTO or OPP about it. The only evidence I found of anyone tracking this is some cities do. Hamilton was one - there were a few others as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
Just because they wont give it to you (the public) doesnt mean they dont have it.Quote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche
MTO and MNR are both part of the OPS, im they're a little more open with data between themselves.
They don't refuse to release it - they said it doesn't exist. 20+ years ago, this data information was kept and published, but doesn't seem to be anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by blasted_saber
So why would the OFAH print it was used then?
Quote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche
Hey...you're preaching to the choir! Go out and convert the heathens!;)
Here's a link to a Deer Density report prepared by the MNR for the Ancaster area. If you read/scan thru you see the sources they use to gather the data for the report....(yes they even get the Vehicle collision data from the OPP page 9)
As you can see they gather data from a variety of sources, most however is done by aerial surveys (helicopter).
The deer density results for the Ancaster area are on page 20...
http://www.animalalliance.ca/wp-cont...rch11-2010.pdf