http://www.640toronto.com/2015/03/26...me-households/
Once again the middle class getting screwed. And no way will it only cost the rest of us a buck a month.
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http://www.640toronto.com/2015/03/26...me-households/
Once again the middle class getting screwed. And no way will it only cost the rest of us a buck a month.
It reminds me of a family member who was on welfare and had thousands in dental and his glasses covered. We had to pay out of pocket as part time or contractors but he had everything paid for.
I see now why those families when I was growing up just had tons of kids and sat on welfare.
The 'Debt Retirement' FINALLY (after almost a decade) charge comes off and we will see a price increase and have to subsidize 'others'.
Awesome.
Will it actually ever come off the bill?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wahoo
"On April 23, 2014, the government announced that it is proposing to remove the DRC cost from residential users’ electricity bills after December 31, 2015. This would save a typical residential ratepayer about $70 per year. The DRC is to remain on all other electricity users’ bills until the residual stranded debt is retired — this has been estimated to occur by the end of 2018."
This if from the Ontario Ministry of Finance.
They have proposed to remove it, they have never said that they will remove it.
You got to be kidding...Like you said, who makes up this stuff
Hey, I was just parroting what I read over at 680News.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
Quote:
The changes will be accompanied by the removal of the so-called“debt retirement charge“ which hydro users have been paying for a decade now. The government says it will save an average residence about $70 per year.
Debt retirement would of been history a long time ago if Mcguilty hadn't borrowed against it.
Don't worry, not shooting the messenger, just don't trust that they will ever reduce our bill.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wahoo
I live in a rural area now, I am considering kerosene lanterns, ha ha.
My friend, with a large agribusiness, paying 6 figures a year for hydro, is unhooking this year and going with diesel generators. He can make it substantially cheaper himself, even factoring in generous amounts for maintainance and replacements.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
I know farmers who have done the same thing. Figuring in the cost of diesel fuel which they have delivered twice a month,they figure they're still lots of money ahead. I'm not technical enough to know the details of their system. I also have friends in Red Lake that power their entire operation by diesel generator and live completely off the grid. They've both thumbed their noses at Ontario Hydro for a long time,now,so it appears there's great merit to this approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaleK
She may be throwing peanuts to fool people but she will claw it all back when the carbon taxes kick in. They alone will cause everything to rise, likely more per month than any rebate given. Add in the Pension scam and you can expect your disposable income to drop 5-7% soon.
.Quote:
Originally Posted by fratri
A corrupt Liberal government !!! It's only the beginning !
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick_iles
Corrupt???? (sarcasm).... aren't they just doing what the experts tell them to do???
The Canadian Centre For Policy Alternatives says they must increase taxes, talks about the HST etc.
https://www.policyalternatives.ca/si...%20Problem.pdf
Conclusion
The Ontario government has set out two priorities: a) to balance the budget
by 2017–18 and b) to invest in people and infrastructure. As the government
faces increasing pressure to make good on its promises, one option is left: to
raise revenue. This paper presents a suite of options available to the prov-
incial government to restore Ontario’s fiscal health while preserving—and
hopefully enhancing public services. There are certainly more options
that could be explored. The point is: both goals can be met, but the government must raise taxes to do so.
So don't blame the Liberal government, they are just doing what the left wing think tanks tell them to and taxing everyone in sight and spending without thought..... cutbacks, wage freezes, responsibility, austerity, priorities, better decision making.... unknown words to the CCPA they just think the gov't needs to have and control all the money and help people by not allowing them to make decisions or have personal savings.
The Liberal gov't with the help of organizations like the CCPA will run up the personal debt to pay for the gov't debt that they are growing too... all because they can't figure out basic economics and act responsibly!
So taxes and pension plan taxes are added blame the CCPA.
Carbon taxes blame consultants like Gerald Butts and his group.
but don't call the Liberal gov't corrupt or blame the gov't for implementing these and giving huge contracts to insiders or cancelling gas plants, bribing and trying to fix elections etc. Like Justin Trudeau said they are just listening to the experts.... I am just trying to figure out at what and how they got the title "expert".
Give the libranos enough cash and you could become an expert too. Hell, one of their "experts" in education was just convicted of atrocious crimes and of being a pedophile though. So the term really doesn't mean what it used to anymore does it?Quote:
Originally Posted by mosquito
Hydro needs the money so we will have to make up the shortfall...... The more people that go off the grid the more its going to cost us all....Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
Good for your farmer friend...... too bad for the rest of us
Thank the LIEBERALS for sticking it up our rectum again!!!!!!!!!
Does this mean that they will be removing the 10% rebate that ALL customers have been getting for years? Last month my rebate was just over $90....
are we really complaining about the government helping out low income families? low income dosent just mean the person sitting at home playing the system on welfare... its our retired people that worked for 40+ years, its our families just starting out where mom and dad are working minimum wages jobs trying to make ends meet... dont get me wrong, i complain about my hydro bill as much as anyone, but id like to see those struggling get a helping hand... after all we are the "middle" class
What rubs me is the fact that it is Liberal mismanagement, corruption and down right plundering that has caused Ontario Hydro rates to rise 300% in the last 8 or 9 years !! Now they raise rates again, in an attempt to help with a serious problem they caused !!!!!
.Quote:
Originally Posted by patvetzal
Yes, that rebate will soon end. Next thing will be their carbon tax......we are screwed !!!!
Interesting one article makes it sound like not much more, then another looks at the annual costs and is talking about $120 more... I personally would be surprised if it is ONLY $120 more and not much more knowing the Liberals so far.
http://www.torontosun.com/2015/03/26...on-hydro-rates
I don't mind helping the people that truly need it but adding to my hydro bill in order to subtract from someone else's hydro bill is just plain stupid and another way to mismanage and piss away money. I would prefer they great a break on their taxes if it is truly warranted.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishy steve
This plan wouldn't cause a backlash against low income folks,at all,would it? These Liberals are right out to lunch.
I guess this is how many feel about this announcement.
Attachment 29037
I think I'm going to demote myself to take advantage of this. Especially since the last two bills have been up by 33% anyhow. This is going to get cute when hydro bills are higher than mortgage payments.
Someone turn out the lights on Ontario :)
this to (doing away with the rebate and the drc was predicted a long time ago).
Honestly not sure what some expect.
The Left and Unions go batty if god forbid anyone mention try to save some $$. Hudak tabled changing the pensions to DCP for all new hires and was vilified. If they wont reduce cost
That leaves *cough* revenue tools *cough* to not only
Get rid of the deficit
Pay for the 25billion in Infrastructure they are finally starting to realize is needed
but any more additional cost/spending???
Healthcare???
No idea what is actually going to occur over the next 2-3years but they are showing no signs of giving the working stiffs of Ontario a break for all their mistakes, mismangagemt and vote buying/elections.
12 billion is the deficit...Think about it.....12billion short each and every year
And Funny no-one talks about the 325billion in debt
Sooner or later rates will go up.
and there are dark clouds on the horizon.
a point to ponder, not completely on topic...
so this is something somebody mentioned to me the other day, and i do agrea with him and i am somewhat guilty of this myself... everyone likes to complain about hydro bills, yes some are complety unreasonable, but when you consider what the average person pays for other utilities such as cell phones, satelite tv, internet etc generally exceed what they pay in hydro, and these arent a necessity (sp), all three of which we are also getting the short end of the stick price wise compared to other countries... im paying $50/month just to have a landline in my house because i cant get cell service, and i need a long distance package, as my inlaws that live 20 minutes away from me are long distance, but north bay which is 45 minutes away from me is not...
So we come up with all these green energy initiatives to replace fossil fuel generated electricity only too have people running out and buying diesel generators. 300,000 manufacturing jobs have left the province and the few that are left are struggling too find affordable hydro. The McGuinty/Wynne green energy disaster has left us in a financial and social catastrophe that our grandchildrens children will be paying for.Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
I wouldn't be surprised,in the least,that very soon, Ontario Liberals enact legislation under their "green" energy program outlawing the use of all fossil fuel generating systems forcing everyone onto the grid. Isn't socialist/leftist/communist ideology a wonderful thing?Quote:
Originally Posted by warpipe
I watched an educational program on TV the other night that was all about the GEA and what wind farms are doing to Rural Ontario. So it's not just the cost of Hydro, but property values getting gutted….And what do farmers need in order to get credit from banks in order to replace, buy, equipment? What exactly is their credit based on?
The sheer ignorance/disdain of MCguinty, Wynne and green champions to them, and other stuff and mounting health problems from Turbines being erected within 550 meters of homes and residents having no say, not even compensation.
At least when the Feds take land for airports, roads, more, its expropriated.
So just who is dictator like and who isn't?
And more. Like Buzz Hargove and his involvement. Like Samsung (and other green companies) and millions and billions they are raking in.
Yep welcome to state and union run Ontario, and they are driving it into the ground.
Worth the hour to watch.
http://tvo.org/video/211702/big-wind
Well worth the time to watch. Thanks J
Those that would chastise others and accuse them of NIMBYism and are the champions of windmills never live near them. How the Liberals won any ridings outside Toronto is baffling? The sad reality is these poor landowners who were stuck with turbines have no recourse. The contracts were written to screw them for generations. I will repeat myself for the 100th time. The fix is in. The Liberals and PS unions are untouchable. They have police protection to cover scandals and fraud and PS unions to finance campaigns. We are beyond screwed and it will get much worse in the next 3 years. There will also likely be Trudough led coalition government next time and he and Wynne will screw your great Grand children into a lifetime of debt.
Just as an aside, what percentage of people living below the poverty line actually have hydro bills IN THEIR NAME to be able to benefit from this? Most of them don't own their own homes and a lot that rent will be places where the bill is in the landlords name. This sounds more and more crooked as time goes on.
DaleQuote:
Originally Posted by DaleK
I would hope that most recognize this for what it is. This is socialism at its best brought to you by the government at its most corrupt. Forget the labels and names, this is simply another tax.
Let's face it, the Debt Retirement Charge was going on well after the debt was paid so there needed to be another way to pay the bills - at the taxpayers expense of course.
Qualifying for the rebate is somewhere close to being able to qualify for astronaut training. Qualifying to pay the additional charge... not so much.
Q: Do you have income?
A: Yes.
"Good, we were going to take your money anyway!"
The OPG CEO isn't making enough money at just $1.56 million per year so hydro rates need to go up to pay him a bonus. And of course since he is getting one they all need to get more.
Just what is the "Poverty Line" anyway? I've tried finding out on the Internet but get a variety of answers. It seems to depend on age, employment status, where you live, how many children you have, marital status, etc, etc.
What agency will decide who is eligible for the rebate? Sounds like another boondoggle!
BTW
If you do a quick filter on the Sunshine List you will see that Hydro One employees have some 4400 people on the payroll making more than $100K
Now if we look at the OPG execs we see that there are 12 who are in the top 100, each making more than $450K/yr, with OPG execs (CEO and CFO) occupying the top two spots.
In the top 100, of these 12 execs the taxpayers put out $7.75 million per year plus bonuses.
So, out of curiousity, I did some more reading.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ticle23597189/
Using this link, I went to the bottom of the listing and sure enough the Globe and Mail was kind enough to provide a link to download the entire list.
So of course I downloaded the csv file just to play with the numbers a bit. Here is one for you.
From the list, I filtered Ontario Power Generation only.
The count is 7668 employees on the OPG list that make >$100K per year.
This is the part I really really like. (Edit: For clarity) The total salary for these 7668 OPG (Sunshine List Only) is... wait for it...
$1,056,097,207
And people hate me when I......Now, think about 20-30 years of pension pay outs on that number.....alone
Pete, I could easily be mistaken but I think the "poverty line" is measured somewhere along these lines.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...article619560/
The poor are still the poor
The rich are still the rich.
The only thing changing since the 60s
Middle class down, govt and .....up
Isnt it the left that claims to be the champions of the "middle class" and so often defends "social consciouses".
Let's be crystal clear,here. The ONLY reason the "left" says it supports the middle class is because that's the tax base. Without that,the Liberal/NDP/socialist-unionist dreams of a socialist regime comes crashing down. Poor people either don't pay taxes or,at least,exceedingly little and the rich have the money to kick the unionist's arses around the block,twice. One only needs to look at the end result of socialism in the eastern European bloc,the fiasco in Greece and here in Ontario with McGuinty-Wynne. This shyte ain't over,yet,by a long shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by JBen
This is just the frog in the pot of water getting ready for *cough cough* carbon taxes *cough* to finish him offQuote:
Originally Posted by DGearyFTE
But the unionized labour part of the left is not socialist at all. They only care about the union members and the protection of jobs and pensions. So we have created a third level...something like the pigs, if you've ever read "Animal Farm"...Not something like, exactly like.Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
Good analogy Werner and a great book.
I've read that book (studied in Poli-Sci) and that's an excellent analogy that I'd forgotten about. LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche