Custom Smokeless Muzzleloader

I just finished another Remington 700 ML conversion, the donor rifle was a blued version this time,stainless models are becoming alittle more scarce. It has a 30 in custom .458 stainless barrel installed on it , I picked up a boltnose conversion kit which completely seals any blowback, it uses a standard 209 shotshell primer for convenience and had a breech plug with an extended snout and a savage style replaceable ventliner. The stock is one of remingtons LVSF stocks that was bedded and spiderwebbed again. Once again this one will be primarily used sabotless with resized .45 cal. bullets.
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Nice! Where did you get the barrel and who did the work?

Smokeeeter

Nicely done and looks good.

Hope you don’t mind a few questions.

What make of barrel and contour did you choose to go with?
With so many others going with a bushing instead of a standard vent-liner why did you decide to remain with a standard vent-liner?

Enjoy your new addition for future hunts.


Ed

Ed, This barrel is an RKS barrel , a custom barrel maker from Alberta, the contour looks to be a varminter but it is extra long (over 30"). Someone else had started this project and had it threaded for the stock Remington ml specs. I got the boltnose kit from our friend south of the border that provides most of the Remington 700 ml conversions. He makes a breech plug that is a direct fit for the stock threads (just has to be adjusted for headspace), the only difference is that his breech plug has the extended snout and is designed for the savage style ventliner, I may modify the ventliner for a carbide bushing but I have a large supply of ventliners since none of my other muzzleloaders utilize them now.

Smokeeter

Thanks for the replies to my questions.

Yeah I too have a large supply of homemade vent-liners so I’m not getting a bushing for a long time.
30” barrel is really going to give some extended range. Hopefully it has a consistent load resistance down the full length of the bore.
Smokeless less muzzle loading has come a long way and still advancing. Regardless of the direction it takes I still love my 50.


Look forward to hearing about some range result down the road.


Ed

I made a collapsible ramrod that is carried in a sheath on my belt. I didn't want anything attached to the barrel that might have affected accuracy. I made this one out of an aluminum arrow shaft with a carbon shaft glued inside it, I left a 2 in. over lap to allow the pieces to interlock together. I used a shock cord to hold all three pieces together and allow folding for storage. The jag is made from a brass .40 cal bullet casing.
This rifle was made to be used with sized sabotless bullets, right now I'm using modified 300 gr. .45 cal. XTP's but it will also be capable of using .40 cal bullets inside .45 cal sabots. I modified some 200 gr. .40 cal XTP's for this application, it cuts down on the recoil and the spritzer nose improves the B.C. of both bullets.
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I took this one out on it's maiden voyage, I resized the spitzerized 300 gr. xtp's to .4493 dia. used a greased veggie wad and 60 grs. of Imr 4198 and a federal 209A primer , speeds were around 2530 fps with a low ES. The first shot out of the clean barrel is a little high but the other 2 settled in nicely. I only had 3 vials of powder measured at this load. Nothing fantastic but shows promise.
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300gr bullet at 2530fps, how did your shoulder feel?

That is more bang than a stock 45-70 or the 444 Marlin.

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Originally Posted by Fox

300gr bullet at 2530fps, how did your shoulder feel?

That is more bang than a stock 45-70 or the 444 Marlin.

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yeah that's a lot of bang.
shoulder felt fine, used a lead sled for sight in, usually don't feel a thing when shooting at game.

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Originally Posted by smokeeter

yeah that's a lot of bang.
shoulder felt fine, used a lead sled for sight in, usually don't feel a thing when shooting at game.

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If you were able to increase the BC on the bullet it would do wonders, although I an not sure of too many boat tail 45 cal bullets.

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Originally Posted by Fox

If you were able to increase the BC on the bullet it would do wonders, although I an not sure of too many boat tail 45 cal bullets.

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Here's a pic of the XTP before and after my modification, if that doesn't improve the B.C. of the bullet I don't know what does, and there isn't any boat tail. I have shot some of Barnes bullets with the boat tail and square bases always have better accuracy.I have shot this bullet out to 300 yrds with fantastic results.
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Originally Posted by smokeeter

Here's a pic of the XTP before and after my modification, if that doesn't improve the B.C. of the bullet I don't know what does, and there isn't any boat tail. I have shot some of Barnes bullets with the boat tail and square bases always have better accuracy.I have shot this bullet out to 300 yrds with fantastic results.
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Ok, so your mod is to put a point on it, got ya.

I just meant that with that speed in a more stream lined bullet the down range velocity would increase.

Maybe a .375 in a sabot with a BC of .357, but then again I may be talking crazy.

I really enjoy thinking of this stuff but at the moment I have to live through others.

Looks like a sweet smoke pole.

Why don't you try some .458 bullets? The Barnes 300gr semi spitzer has a bc of .289 The .452 bullets are lacking in that department.

I believe you're referring to the barnes originals my forming dies were modeled around their design these modified bullets have a B.C. equal to or better. The Barnes solid copper Spitfire and TEZ have a better B.C. but that is do to the longer ogive and plastic tip.

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Originally Posted by smokeeter

I took this one out on it's maiden voyage, I resized the spitzerized 300 gr. xtp's to .4493 dia. used a greased veggie wad and 60 grs. of Imr 4198 and a federal 209A primer , speeds were around 2530 fps with a low ES. The first shot out of the clean barrel is a little high but the other 2 settled in nicely. I only had 3 vials of powder measured at this load. Nothing fantastic but shows promise.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...psgis8rqoi.jpg

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Absolutely amazing how those modified bullets with a bit of a shoulder punched clean holes, , you would think they were "die cut".

Took her out for another spin today. Modified 300gr XTP's 60 gr. of Imr 4198 and a greased veggie wad. Load and go, no cooling between shots.
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Have you ever considered making a ML in 338? The thought of this intrigues me. There is a ton of bullet availability out there as well.

Yes I have but with smaller dia. bore size there are increased pressures. Slower powders are needed but in larger volumes which increases the powder column there by leaving less usable barrel length. Not to mention that a lot of hunting zones have a min. size requirement.
Smaller bores are intriguing but not without many challenges ...............but you never know.
I think the .45 cal. is the most versatile caliber and does everything I need done with a muzzleloader, I can shoot .40 in sabots or sabotless .45

I found an interesting article but have since lost it. They talked about taking a barrel and slicing a small piece of it off and making that into a die. So the bullet essentially became perfectly fitted to the lands and grooves. Incredibly accurate.

I think I will try the 45 cal next.

That is how the full form sizing dies are made. a one inch length of a particular barrel is cut and turned down just before the lands and grooves of the bore it is fit inside of a tapered die, this permits a slight adjustment for sizing bullets. The cross section alone isn't sufficient because certain bullets have springback when sized. Different bullets require different adjustments the individual bullets are tested for fit. I have two such FF dies for two of my .45 smokeless muzzies and they are excellent for specific sizing, these bullets are seated directly over the powder charge. When I use smooth formed bullets a greased veggie wad is placed between the bullet and powder to help with the seal and ignition of the smokeless powder.

Here's a pic showing various bullets that have been Full Formed for a particular bore, notice the striations on the side of the bullets, the settings on the dies were all different for the different bullets.
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Great info, Thanks

I pm'd you a few questions.

Thanks

Rob