Training a Stubborn Akitas Recall

Apparently Akita's have been used to hunt bears and other game in Japan for hundreds of years..

Mine definitely has a lot of prey drive.. her name is Deema she's 3 1/2.

http://s7.postimg.org/kt5dul1i3/2015..._49_36_397.jpg

http://s7.postimg.org/o2jt11pln/2015..._51_02_131.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ThZ2pQCbSM

The thing is it's not just my dog that has recall problems.. the breed is super stubborn and they try to be dominant.

When my dog was a puppy I trained her 3-4 hours a day and she would listen to recall commands about 80% of the time off leash.

Now she listens under 10% of the time. I kinda stopped training her though because my methods stopped working.

When she's off leash on a wooded path close to my house she listens pretty well. Sometimes she charges after a rabbit into the bush, but when she loses it she will come back when I call.

When we go out trekking into the middle of the woods to a new area (no path), that's when she gets really bad. She starts sniffing and will go on her own hunt, she won't listen or stop. I have a GSP collar on her but still I want her to always stay close, if she runs off to chase something she must always return.

Any training tips for dominant / stubborn breeds?

If she is deliberately refusing to obey a command that she is trained to do then it's time for the E-collar. She seems to have established dominance over you. Dangerous breed to not have control over.

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Originally Posted by terrym

If she is deliberately refusing to obey a command that she is trained to do then it's time for the E-collar. She seems to have established dominance over you. Dangerous breed to not have control over.

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Ya Akitas are not a submissive breed by any means, even after lots of training lol.

I've had multiple guys at the dog park tell me how their Akitas were too aggressive they had to give them away. Also I've had 1 lady scream at the top of her lungs once she saw my dog off leash (my dog was super friendly with all dogs at that time lol).

The thing is I trained and socialized her like crazy when she was a puppy, so she's not vicious, just stubborn and sometimes tries to dominate other dogs (I never let her, she gets a hard collar jerk for that).

I usually have her on a small prong pinch collar but ya an ecollar could be a really good solution.

Any idea if she can wear a tracking collar + ecollar at the same time?

You can put both collars on her no problem. I do it occasionally myself. That dog has long thick hair, you will need to use long prongs. I think you will be amazed at how it is effective.

Do your self a favour & for the sake & safety of your dog stay away from Dog parks.

Dog parks are full of un-obediant dogs & careless owners.

I never let my Lab near any strange dogs I will stand between her and another dog if one approaches. That situation can lead to multiple bad situations quickly...

In the training I took the re-call was the most important command you can tach your dog. It will save your dog's life someday if they are headed for danger. You have to convince your dog that coming to you is the best thing in the world. Worked for me & she is 100% reliable now. No e-collar needed...

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Originally Posted by terrym

You can put both collars on her no problem. I do it occasionally myself. That dog has long thick hair, you will need to use long prongs. I think you will be amazed at how it is effective.

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Nice, can't thank you enough for that tip. I never really considered ecollars for some reason, seems exactly like what I need though.

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Originally Posted by bellerivercrossbowhunter

Do your self a favour & for the sake & safety of your dog stay away from Dog parks.

Dog parks are full of un-obediant dogs & careless owners.

I never let my Lab near any strange dogs I will stand between her and another dog if one approaches. That situation can lead to multiple bad situations quickly...

In the training I took the re-call was the most important command you can tach your dog. It will save your dog's life someday if they are headed for danger. You have to convince your dog that coming to you is the best thing in the world. Worked for me & she is 100% reliable now. No e-collar needed...

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Ya I agree recall is the most important for sure. Could you tell me a bit about your training method please?

Keep in mind labs love to please their owners Akitas love to test their owners patience and will to lead :D She has no food drive (reward based training doesn't work - at all except for low value commands like paw, sit etc), no drive for toys. She does have a super high prey drive, could I somehow use that to my advantage?

So far all that's worked is corrective based training with the small prong pinch collar (smaller prongs are more painful). Basically I call her, and if he doesn't listen I give her a correction with the collar. She honestly doesn't care anymore though and it just feels kind of sadistic to keep correcting her with the collar.

I'm definitely open to trying anything.

One of the reasons her dominant characteristics came out IMO, was because she was attacked 5-6x at dog parks and on walking trails. All before she was 1 year old. A collie at bruce pit bit her lip and wouldn't let go for like 10 full second (my sister was walking her) and after that she was snapping at all dogs who approached her.

She is 50/50 when she meets a new dog, some she likes and plays wth, some she tries to dominate (pin and growl in their face). Sometimes she will meet 5 dogs in a row that she really likes. Overall for an Akita I think shes got a very good temperament, especially considering all the horror stories I hear.

Very important that you know how to use the e collar correctly with all breeds but especially with a dog like an Akita, otherwise you can cause bigger problems than you have.

( I've taken my JRTs to the dog park for years - not my setters. Never had a big problem, and they enjoy the other people and their pets, as do I. Essential though that you confident control of your dog before you go. )

I wouldn't take a dog that "She is 50/50 when she meets a new dog, some she likes and plays with, some she tries to dominate (pin and growl in their face). " quote

I would suggest to sign up for obediance training with a reputable trainer (not pet smart).

The method we used for re-call was very simple.

Start with a 6 fooot lead.

Make the dog sit & stand in front of the dog.

Take one step back & say "here" then move quickly backwards a few steps.

The dog will naturally be excited from your movement & move with you.

Stop the movement & praise the dog.

Repeat several times daily gradually increaseing the distance.

The next step was to use a long lead & let the dog move freely. You move away from the dog & pull the lead in when the dog is moving to you again lot's of praise & exitement when the dog is moving toward you.

They really drilled it in our heads to make sure that in the dogs mind going to you is the best thing in the world & nothing else matters except to go back to you as quickly as possible. If your dog does something really bad never ever use the "here" command then punish the dog. That will ruin all the above training & you will teach it that when you say "here" they will be punished & you will have to start all over....

Good luck & I can't stress the importance of good solid basic obediance training enough...

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Originally Posted by bellerivercrossbowhunter

I would suggest to sign up for obediance training with a reputable trainer (not pet smart).

The method we used for re-call was very simple.

Start with a 6 fooot lead.

Make the dog sit & stand in front of the dog.

Take one step back & say "here" then move quickly backwards a few steps.

The dog will naturally be excited from your movement & move with you.

Stop the movement & praise the dog.

Repeat several times daily gradually increaseing the distance.

The next step was to use a long lead & let the dog move freely. You move away from the dog & pull the lead in when the dog is moving to you again lot's of praise & exitement when the dog is moving toward you.

They really drilled it in our heads to make sure that in the dogs mind going to you is the best thing in the world & nothing else matters except to go back to you as quickly as possible. If your dog does something really bad never ever use the "here" command then punish the dog. That will ruin all the above training & you will teach it that when you say "here" they will be punished & you will have to start all over....

Good luck & I can't stress the importance of good solid basic obediance training enough...

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Excellent advice !

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Originally Posted by bellerivercrossbowhunter

I would suggest to sign up for obediance training with a reputable trainer (not pet smart).

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by bellerivercrossbowhunter

The method we used for re-call was very simple.

Start with a 6 fooot lead.

Make the dog sit & stand in front of the dog.

Take one step back & say "here" then move quickly backwards a few steps.

The dog will naturally be excited from your movement & move with you.

Stop the movement & praise the dog.

Repeat several times daily gradually increaseing the distance.

The next step was to use a long lead & let the dog move freely. You move away from the dog & pull the lead in when the dog is moving to you again lot's of praise & exitement when the dog is moving toward you.

They really drilled it in our heads to make sure that in the dogs mind going to you is the best thing in the world & nothing else matters except to go back to you as quickly as possible. If your dog does something really bad never ever use the "here" command then punish the dog. That will ruin all the above training & you will teach it that when you say "here" they will be punished & you will have to start all over....

Good luck & I can't stress the importance of good solid basic obediance training enough...

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Originally Posted by yellow dog

Excellent advice !

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Yep, x2.

x3 on that advice, with one proviso: "The dog will naturally be excited from your movement & move with you."

This will hold true with a pup or a dog that pays attention to its owner, but if the dog is ignoring the handler entirely & could not care less what you do, then that is the first thing you need to work on: to get the dog's attention on you. If the dog doesn't care about food, toys, or any other form of reward, that's going to be tough to do, because getting the dog's attention on you can really only be done with positive approaches.

I wouldn't have that dog outside a fenced yard until the problem was fixed.

I have no hands on experience with this breed or any Spitz breed.
What I've heard however, is that there is a age limitation until the dog may accept any training. Good thing that you trained a lot early. Dogs (and that is not limited to any breed) that have not received proper socialization and training early in their live, will make problems later.
Dogs needs to be trained to be trained!
Instead of focusing too much on the actual task at hand, you might need to go back one step more and recreate (as far as possible at this age/breed) the foundation for training.