Like the question states. I am considering buying a crossbow and see they vary in fps. Is there a rule or guideline? Is 305 fps less than ideal or should you go with some thing much higher? Any comments or suggestions wold be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
There is no regulation on FPS, only on page 24 of the regulations...
" crossbows must have a draw length of at least 300 mm (11.8 in.) and a draw weight of at least 45 kilograms (99.2 lb.). At a minimum bolts must have a 22 mm (0.87 in) wide head with at least two sharp cutting edges."
Find a bow that fits you, shoulder the bow, shoot it if they will let you, they are not all the same. Find one in your price range that feels good in your hands and on the shoulder. Be sure the wear appropriate clothing (ie the same type you would wear hunting) when trying the bow. a heavy coat and sweaters will make a difference to the feel.
With a crossbow most guys are not making long shots so IMO FPS does not matter as much as with a vertical bow. All of my shots are at less then 35 yards, actually most of mine have been less then 15 yards.
305 is definitely fast enough.
Hey Doug, FPS is FPS, why would it make any difference for a compound? In my opinion, compounds are much quieter then crossbows, therefor you could get away with less speed. I do agree, 305 FPS is plenty.
It all depends on how deep into the ground you want the arrow to go on the far side of the deer :)
I have a x-bow that has a 150lb draw weight and the arrows go thru and thru....as they do with my 55 lb compound. Doesn't take much to punch a hole in the side of a deer.
I used to shoot one that only tossed the bolt about 220fps, still killed deer but you could watch the arrow rainbow as it headed down range.
faster bow shoots flatter and is more forgiving if your range estimate is a little off. A slow arcing bolt could lead to a non fatal hit if not ranged properly, but yes 305 is plenty.
At 305 fps the bolt is getting to the deer at 30 yards in way less than 1 second. I agree that the faster the flatter shooting.
I just purchased a pse fang last night. Had it sighted in within 15 min. Bullseye at 30 yards no problem fast shooting bow and nice and small. Can't beat it for 399. A lot cheaper then those expensive bows.
Speed alone is not a good indicator of a bows ability to harvest an animal. The question you should be asking is "how much kinetic energy do I need to humanely harvest a deer?" The general answer to that is something around 45 ft/lbs. Kinetic energy is a factor of the speed and weight of the arrow. The amount of KE produced is easily calculated using this formula;
KE = (arrow weight / 450240) x (velocity x velocity)
Usually the advertised fps rating is achieved using the lightest arrow recommended for the bow. For example, a bow that uses a minimum arrow weight of 350 grains achieving 305 fps would have
(350/450240) x (305x305) = 72.3 ft/lbs of kinetic energy
Simple, right?:D
I'll complicate things even more and say that it's actually momentum that plays a greater role in determining the penetration potential of an archery setup.Quote:
Originally Posted by delmer
" If one studies KE and momentum they would conclude that momentum formula results are more meaningful to the bowhunter as momentum can be translated into penetration potential."
http://www.tuffhead.com/education/fo..._momentum.html
From some experts...."According to Easton, a 400 grain arrow traveling at the glacial speed of 170 feet-per-second has sufficient energy to harvest a mature deer."
To kill a deer you need about; "25-41 ft. lbs."
http://bowsite.com/bowsite/features/...r/penetration/
The rest of the theories are marketing...
Hell, the recommended foot-poundage to send an arrow clean through an elk is 52 ft-lbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by delmer
You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut
Just like Doug mentioned previously. Look at the regs for specs & minimums for bows/crossbows. That's your bare minimum.
Well, I said around 45 ft/lbs, so 41 ft/lbs. falls within that area.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikePal
Thanks for the confirmation.:thumbup:
There is a great article in the OOD magazines latest issue (Nov/Dec) that explains this topic well in my opinion!
Speed is not listed at all, just draw weight. Since arrows kill by cutting and not that is what causes the shock as long as the arrow penetrates enough to get into the lungs/heart area it does not matter how fast the arrow is traveling. I went to a much faster bow with a much heavier draw weight but it was not for energy it was to reduce the rainbow trajectory, my old 220fps bow vs my 350fps bow, a huge difference on deer size game out to 40 yards.Quote:
Originally Posted by robster
Fox, the draw weights (DW) speed (FPS) and energy (KE) are shown in the chart on page 25.
The article is a fairly good look at a few different bows to help you decide what you feel is important for your hunting needs.
edit add: re rainbow effect...I wonder what the arrow drop between 20-30 yrds is compared to the different speeds. I know with my old 150 lb x-bow it was insignificant and accommodated for with the ballistic reticle. Much more between 30-40, so I don't shot that range.
Found this article to help explain away some of the myths and untruths about speed and arrow drop....some excellent examples, with corresponding graphs, worthwhile reading.
Quote:
There are those folks who will claim that they hold dead on with their pin and any distance up to 40 yards and hit the center. This is blatantly false and these people are either telling tall tales or subconsciously holding high or low. I have had the personal pleasure of shooting some of these “magic” bows and holding dead on with the pin and watching the arrow hit high or low. It’s not possible to outrun gravity! Some of the bow’s owners will claim that I aimed lower or such, and they have surely deluded themselves into either trying to save face or completely believing their own defiance of gravity.
http://archeryreport.com/2010/03/arr...-pin-40-yards/
My crossbow shoots about 275 fps and sends arrows through deer, in one side and out the other, diagonally.
I took a look at this when it came out, I know we discussed this as the breakfast, I think feeling in your hands means way more than anything else when shooting a bow. If you are not comfortable you will not be consistent any even with a crossbow anything that changes will throw you off quite a bit down range. I actually used a micro before the controlled hunt in SW Ontario, it is my dads bow, I hated it, the thumb hole stock is odd, I could not cradle it as I walked, I had to use my hand and it did not lock into my body like a traditional stock, I also found the length of pull to be way too short.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikePal
I would tell anyone to go out and shoot a box before they buy it, make sure it fits them and that will be a huge determining factor when it comes to being able to kill whatever the game is with it.
That old crossbow of mine, the slow one, I used to take it out for small game on Sundays before you would hunt with a gun on Sundays, I was able to take more small game with it than big game, I just knew that bow and knew where it would hit, I also knew when to not take the shot as the the drop was substantial and my pins were 10,20,30 yards.
This is a handy tool if you know your current bow speed and arrow weight. You can input different speeds to see the trajectory changes over the distances you normally shoot.
http://peteward.com/ballistic.calc.htm
The reason you can get away with less FPS in a compound than a crossbow which I believe was the second question after how many FPS do I need for deer is the compound arrows are longer thinner and more aerodynamic and thus carry their down range energy better.
The crossbow bolts need to have such a heavy spine to take the increased draw weight in such a short arrow that they dont fly as well at longer ranges. This is why xbow Manufacturers keep upping the draw trying to get more FPS to improve down range flight. It kind of gets to the point of diminishing returns though as you need such a heavy arrow to take that energy it doesn't fly as well.
That's why If you shoot a modern compound at about 65lbs draw with a 29" or better draw length with a relatively light arrow 300fps out of the bow is plenty fast enough to to carry the energy out to 50 yards.
Regardless 90% of deer shot with a bow should be inside 20 yards and pretty much any xbow or compound will do the job if the arrow is put in the proper location. I shoot one pin on my bow to 28 yards it makes it very easy for aiming !
And bester you are correct compounds are whiter than xbow said because you are releasing less stored energy on a 65lb bow than a 200lb draw weight cross bow. The longer draw length of the bow puts more of the stored energy efficiently into the arrow and that's why is quieter.
Whiter is quieter stupid auto correct
I have shot a truck load of deer over the years with the 150 lb horton crossbows .never felt under gunned and the arrows always went threw the deer if you hit them right. We always cut are arrows as short as we could and shot 90 grain heads .punch cutters .loved then broad heads ...Dutch
Basically it goes back to know your equipment.
i have 175# Exocet with the arrows I make 1 am around 285 fps.
the factory arrows are 315fps.
i would trade for a vixen for better hunting skills any day ��