Some advice and wisdom please.

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December 24th, 2015, 01:22 PM
dilly

Some advice and wisdom please.

Hello all muzzleloader veterans. I got the bug this fall after borrowing a CVU hunter bolt from my Dad and getting two deer with it. I sighted the gun in with 150grains of pyrodex (3 pellets), a cheddite 209 primer and a 245grain powerbelt bullet. I couldn't get the gun to group better than 8" at 100 yards. It worked for the close range shots I took, but I had to pass on a truly huge 10 pointer that was at 226 yards. So, my new mission is to try to get 200 yard performance out of a muzzleloader.

Looking back I think I was overloading the CVA and likely could have dialed it in better, but since it wasn't my gun, I decided to just start fresh. Below is what I have to work with...
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/f...pskpovybnm.jpg
I picked up a lightly used Thompson Center Impact. I prefer the break open action and read many good reviews on this "entry level" rifle. It came with a Leupold base and rings.
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/f...psxhujefkv.jpg
Cabelas had their Nikon in-line muzzleloader scope on sale with the bullet drop compensator reticle, so I got one and mounted it.
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/f...psznhyv7x1.jpg
I liked the convenience of pellets but wanted the ability to fine tune for accuracy, so I went with Blackhorn 209. I grabbed lots of Barnes Spitfire TMZ 250grain sabots and intend to use Cheddite 209 primers for ignition.

I guess what I am asking is, where should I start? I have a powder measure and flask on order as well as a range rod adapter and cleaning stuff. I intend to use a chronograph when I work up a load that groups and kills out to 200 yards.

What am I missing? anyone already using this combination?
December 24th, 2015, 01:55 PM
MikePal

Quote:

Originally Posted by dilly

I sighted the gun in with 150grains of pyrodex (3 pellets), a cheddite 209 primer and a 245grain powerbelt bullet. I couldn't get the gun to group better than 8" at 100 yards.

I liked the convenience of pellets but wanted the ability to fine tune for accuracy, so I went with Blackhorn 209.

The short answer is you used to much powder....

I haven't worked up a load with BH209 yet for my Traditions, but I know my gun performs best with 80-85 grains Pyrodex or T7. Loads over 110 gr and my groupings spread out. Most guys find the same thing, the sweet spot for most of the in-lines is around 80-90 grs.
December 24th, 2015, 01:59 PM
dilly

Thanks Mike. I was going to start at 90 grains and go up from there. Maybe I will start at 85.
December 24th, 2015, 02:06 PM
rippin_355

You also need to wait at least 15min between shots. Heat and plastic sabot equal mayhem! I shoot smokeless out of my savage but bh209 is very similar in the fact that you need a tight fitting sabot. Most on the market are too slick. Thats great for easy loading but not for tight groups and consistent ignition. I would get some MMP sabots and shoot bullets that the savage guys are using.
December 24th, 2015, 03:24 PM
JUDGE

With Blackhorn powder you will need shotgun primers, that's what I found worked best.
December 24th, 2015, 06:29 PM
Fenelon

Impact is a great gun, and they love TC Shockwave 250 gr. I've never used Blackhorn powder so I can't speak for it. I use loose 777 powder and Remington primers. Start with 90 grains and work up to 105grains. Cloverleafs off a leadsled at 100yds.
December 24th, 2015, 06:52 PM
fishhawk

I have the same ML, my particular gun likes heavier bullets. I'm using 90grs of BH powder with a 300gr Hornady SST using a CCI primer and getting MOA at 100yrds. I have also got excellent accuracy with 100grs of Pyrodex pellets (2 pellets). But prefer the BH loose powder as its much cleaner to use and less corrosive. Any time I tried using anything over 100grs of powder accuracy went out the window. Good luck with your new rifle, the TC Impact is a awesome rifle for the money.
December 24th, 2015, 08:42 PM
sharps4570

Quote:

Originally Posted by dilly

I liked the convenience of pellets but wanted the ability to fine tune for accuracy, so I went with Blackhorn 209. I grabbed lots of Barnes Spitfire TMZ 250grain sabots and intend to use Cheddite 209 primers for ignition.

I guess what I am asking is, where should I start? I have a powder measure and flask on order as well as a range rod adapter and cleaning stuff. I intend to use a chronograph when I work up a load that groups and kills out to 200 yards.

What am I missing? anyone already using this combination?

BH209 manufacturer specifically recommends the use of couple primer types behind their powder - CCI 209M and/or Federal 209A.

In way of accessories, I found the following couple items a great assist during range sessions:

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Thomp...out/741104.uts

http://www.cabelas.com/product/shoot...0#BVRRWidgetID

Note: The volume measure markings on the BH209 tube is not accurate. Therefore, one would need to rely on a powder measure. Otherwise the tubes are very handy in order to prep stuff prior to heading out to the range.

Some feed back from my 50/100 yds range sessions early during the year. However, I have only used TC Shockwaves Superglide and Hornady SST High Speed Low Drag (that's quite a mouthful for naming a sabot :))

http://www.oodmag.com/community/show...n-209-question
December 25th, 2015, 09:03 AM
johnjyb

I definitely agree with MikePal. I have used the Powerbelt products for years, and only have issues when I use more then 2 pellets, as the bullet starts to roll and flip around causing wild shots on paper that I just do not see with 100 grains or 2 pellets.
On a sidenote, I have had days where I have been all over the board shooting and the next time with the same load I have a tack driver. I attribute it to bad form, cheekweld, and unicorns, maybe mostly just the first 2 though.
John
December 26th, 2015, 08:47 AM
Bushbaby

I have an impact. It shoots very well with 2 t7 pellets, Remington primers, and a 350 grain qt bullet from pr bullets. SST's and spitfires also shoot well. You should not have too hard a time working up a 200 yard load. For the money I don't know if you could find a better rifle than the impact.
December 26th, 2015, 12:37 PM
dilly

Thanks everyone for the information. I'm going to start by using only these spitfire TMZ bullets because I have 48. I'm going to start at 80 grains and go up from there until I figure out the sweet spot. I'm going to try the cheddite primers as I've heard they are hot and should give reliable ignition. The "spot on" app with that scope gives you lots of virtual data to work with. I intend to shoot cold clean barrel for each shot and use a chrony....Range report will follow.
February 2nd, 2016, 12:36 AM
standup

Quote:

Originally Posted by rippin_355

You also need to wait at least 15min between shots. Heat and plastic sabot equal mayhem! I shoot smokeless out of my savage but bh209 is very similar in the fact that you need a tight fitting sabot. Most on the market are too slick. Thats great for easy loading but not for tight groups and consistent ignition. I would get some MMP sabots and shoot bullets that the savage guys are using.

Because BH 209 is a smokeless deriv it needs to work. It burns like smokeless so it needs the whole cycle of heat makes pressure makes heat makes pressure repeat. Doesn't go pop like BP or it's subs so yes things gotta be snug. Powerbelts and such will eventually run into a squib load
February 2nd, 2016, 07:04 AM
bellerivercrossbowhunter

The guys in my group have the impact guns. I have seen them work very well during our controlled hunt. Post some pics of your groups once you get it dialed in...
February 2nd, 2016, 04:37 PM
dilly

Quote:

Originally Posted by bellerivercrossbowhunter

The guys in my group have the impact guns. I have seen them work very well during our controlled hunt. Post some pics of your groups once you get it dialed in...

Have a look at my range report thread. I'm happy with the gun.