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My 12 month old pup will likely have her second heat @ early May. Since I have an intact male also I will be spaying her. I'm not wild about it but have no intentions of breeding her. At 18 mths I'm hoping she will have matured enough physically to avoid some of the risks associated with spaying. For anybody who has been through this with their dogs what can I expect for recovery time and possible behavioural changes?
Just spayed my 24 month old girl and she was hunting 10 days later.
Make sure there is no licking the wound and you should be good.
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Have you considered having your male neutered instead ?Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
He's been through enough surgery as it is with his TPLO. I also rather not deal with the mess and her driving other males crazy during hunting season.Quote:
Originally Posted by yellow dog
I understand and it makes total sense Terry. I have had many females over the years in my kennel when i had working sled dogs. When a female was in season and had to work with the males in harness i would rub Vicks on her hind legs to mask the smell of her heat cycle. I would sometimes put Vicks on the males forehead as well. Never had a issue with the males trying to jump the females. I never had females spayed but would have males neutered it they were not to be included in the breeding program.Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
I've had 3 females spayed- not a scientific sample :) ) and both recovered quickly in a week or so and I noticed no behavioural changes.
( It is always best to spay a female before their first heat. Reduces the chance of mammary cancer. You're doing the right thing to spay before heat 2)
Have to disagree with you on this one Sharon .... you want to ensure that the female's growth plates are fully developed before spaying ..... usually around 24 months. One reason OFA won't certify hips before 24 months of age.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharon
That's the info I went by when spaying my girl. It was also stipulated in the contract.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota Creek
As for recovery Terry, what others have said. She sure was out of it on day one though. I felt really bad seeing her like that.
I've spayed every female dog I've ever owned and saw no changes afterwards. I too do it so I don't have to deal with the mess. I have only owned 3 male dogs and only had 1 neutered. His behavior never changed either (which is why I don't neuter males). With females it's just a convenience thing for me.
I guess it depends on who you listen to. My vet and "expert" breeders I know say before the first heat. ( talking about females , not males- 2years for males)Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota Creek
https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid...r+female+dog&*
another vet's opinion , which I value:
"Spaying before first heat will reduce chance of mammary cancer by something like 97 Percent. But what is the incidence of mammary cancer anyway? If its 20 percent then that's a pretty good reduction. But if it's 1 or 2 percent then to spay for that reason isn't worth it in my opinion. There are pretty decent studies out that suggest early spaying may contribute to certain cancers. I also think it's ironic that for humans there ads all over the radio touting the health benefits (increased energy, weight loss, vitality, faster healing, etc) of hormone supplementation for both sexes, but we are in such a hurry to take those hormones away from our dogs." quote
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The reason vets suggest before the first heat , is that for some reason or other is, that it is much easier to do, and they then charge more to spay an older dog.Quote:
I guess it depends on who you listen to. My vet and "expert" breeders I know say before the first heat. ( talking about females , not males- 2years for males)
[QUOTE=Sharon;1018175]My vet and "expert" breeders I know say before the first heat. ( talking about females , not males- 2years for males) .....
This had been the predominant thinking but many are now realizing the importance of those hormones to the completion of proper growth structure vs the chances of mammary cancer.
Coincidently this article came thru this morning ..... a study by UC Davis targeted at goldens but labs are mentioned as well and references both spays and neuters - http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites...etrievers.aspx
This is out of date thinking and there's lots of new studies out to prove it. Much more harm done spaying early than waiting for a couple cycles then spaying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharon
When is the last time you talked to these so called experts??? I'm willing to bet their train of thoughts have changed in the last few years.
Dakota nailed it with his last post!!
Interesting article. Thanks for posting. My plan is to spay her at 18 months of age or her second heat. My thinking is by then she should have fully developed "bone wise". Many opinions floating around but my goal is to reduce the risks of ligament injuries. I have been through that and don't want to go there again. My pup is also quite small for the breed standard. She was the runt of the litter. I hope this actually helps as being lighter won't be stressing joints as much? Might just be wishful thinking.
In my opinion and many other breeders that have working bloodlines, females typically mature between 18 to 24 months out of working lines(spaying). Males however can take up to 3 years to fully mature physically and mentally. Personally knowing this I would wait to have a male neutered until he is 3 years of age. Big difference between a 2 year old male and a 3 year old male.
Agreed. The same goes for neutering males. They should be fully mature before the surgery. Speak to your vet or check out Guelph Vet School for advice.
My vet told me its easier when they're pups because the blood vessels are smaller, and he wanted to do it then but I told him I'm waiting until she's 2 years old, no matter how much more it costs (it didn't cost more though, and i asked at the time).Quote:
Originally Posted by jaycee
Some people count how many heat cycles before they spay, but it has nothing to do with how many heats. It goes by age. Your dog could have 1, 2, 3 or more heat cycles before the age of 2. It's the dog's age that matters. Also, the spay/surgery shouldn't be done until several months after the last heat cycle. I forget the actual time period.
The cost of spaying after the first heat is higher because the blood vessels are more developed. Early spay reduces the risk of mammary cancer, which is relatively high.
Spaying before the first heat is associated with elevated risks of hip dysplasia and CCL injuries, and of certain cancers. In some breeds that are particularly prone to these cancers (Viszlas, Goldens), early spay is probably a bad idea for cancer risk alone.
Spay/neuter is also associated with several behavioral problems.
The last time I posted the UC Davis research on this, I got shouted down. I guess it depends who posts it.
[QUOTE=Dakota Creek;1018289]This is true. The quote(below) that I included in my last post says the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharon
"Spaying before first heat will reduce chance of mammary cancer by something like 97 Percent. But what is the incidence of mammary cancer anyway? If its 20 percent then that's a pretty good reduction. But if it's 1 or 2 percent then to spay for that reason isn't worth it in my opinion. There are pretty decent studies out that suggest early spaying may contribute to certain cancers. I also think it's ironic that for humans there ads all over the radio touting the health benefits (increased energy, weight loss, vitality, faster healing, etc) of hormone supplementation for both sexes, but we are in such a hurry to take those hormones away from our dogs." quote
PS I stand corrected gentlemen. Thank you :)
In some breeds, not every breed. Consult with your vet.Quote:
Originally Posted by welsh
In some breeds what?
I've had 5 females spayed, all before their first heat. Recovery time was quick and I didn't see any change in behaviour. The fun part is trying to keep a spaniel quiet. My britt came home from the surgery, walked on the front porch and jumped right to her favourite spot 2 feet off the floor! So much for staying quiet.