Sexual Harassment And More

I don't know if you guys are reading about all the sexual harassment charges that are being made by all of these women coming out of the woodwork recently - I think that it is a shame so many men do such terrible things to so many innocent women - note I said innocent - but let me say something about some of these gals - they ask for it - now before you jump all over me let me explain what I am getting at - there is this one model who claims this guy named Harvey on two different occasions raped her while they were in her apartment - Harvey is a well known movie producer - it shows pictures of her wearing hardly any clothes with a stupid look on her face that suppose to make her more sexy - when asked why she didn't report it the first time she said that she was afraid that it would ruin her career - so when you dress and act like a - guess what - some of these gals do everything they can to make themselves look sexy then when something happens they call foul -

Years ago there was a dress code that resulted in women wearing modest clothing and as a result they were treated like ladies - today it seems like the more skin you show the more stylish you are - so when some guy goes after the bait they get all bent out of shape - it's like dangling a nice big sucker in front of a musky - just thought I'd pass on some words of wisdom - cheers

Face in palms.

Here is a Wiki link on blaming the victim Joe, have a read.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victim_blaming

Oh, and don't forget about Moore running for US Senate, I am sure those 14 and 15 year old girls he went after were dressing ty and asking for it too right?

I believe what you are trying to point out Joe is the confusion that is caused by people sending and getting mixed or misunderstood signals. There is no need to talk about clothes. When a woman is comfortable with touching a man's arm simply because women in general are touchy with each other, it does not have to be any thing more then that. But when you think of ways a woman shows her interest to a man can be touching his arm, there is room for confusion.

Don't get me wrong. "NO" Should end that confusion pretty quick.

I find it odd that so many years go by before a claim. I wouldn’t file a claim from years ago because I may not be remembering the details correctly.

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Originally Posted by glen

I find it odd that so many years go by before a claim. I wouldn’t file a claim from years ago because I may not be remembering the details correctly.

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It seems as though there were stirrings but since these people were highly respected those stirrings were shot down. I do not know why a woman would choose not to go forward but yet I am not a woman who has been sexually harassed and more importantly at the work place with their career on the line. If they said something they would probably be black listed and never work again, think about that in your field, you worked so hard for your career and now because you said something bad about your boss you can never work in your field again and they say you were lying.

The entertainment industry is a joke. How many of these men and women were doing "naughty" at some point in their life. It is almost mandatory for each film to have a sex scene in it. How many are barely dressed walking down the red carpet at awards night!

So, a guy whips out his "member" for a show in a private hotel room and someone is offended and walks out the door as she should and good for her!
However, give me a break! Bunch of hypocrites.
I do not condone rape and agree that "no means no" however to ruin peoples lives by utilizing social media because someone was vexed by an event is just plain wrong especially when it happened decades ago.

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Originally Posted by JoePa

I don't know if you guys are reading about all the sexual harassment charges that are being made by all of these women coming out of the woodwork recently - I think that it is a shame so many men do such terrible things to so many innocent women - note I said innocent - but let me say something about some of these gals - they ask for it - now before you jump all over me let me explain what I am getting at - there is this one model who claims this guy named Harvey on two different occasions raped her while they were in her apartment - Harvey is a well known movie producer - it shows pictures of her wearing hardly any clothes with a stupid look on her face that suppose to make her more sexy - when asked why she didn't report it the first time she said that she was afraid that it would ruin her career - so when you dress and act like a - guess what - some of these gals do everything they can to make themselves look sexy then when something happens they call foul -

Years ago there was a dress code that resulted in women wearing modest clothing and as a result they were treated like ladies - today it seems like the more skin you show the more stylish you are - so when some guy goes after the bait they get all bent out of shape - it's like dangling a nice big sucker in front of a musky - just thought I'd pass on some words of wisdom - cheers

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Stop trying to pass off your stupidity as wisdom.

Hollywood for the past 100 years has been running on sexuality. T&A sells. We all know that.
Women showing off their fantastic bodies is part of the job.
When I go to work, I don't have to strip naked. Don't have to kiss or have sex with anyone. In Hollywood that is basic stuff in films.
You have seen the outfits women wear in these award shows.
Point being - sexuality standards in Hollywood are much different than the standards we see and live.
Now - I know there are some sexual offences being reported that are very serious and need to be dealt with severely. NObody should ever be assaulted. But I"m also hearing some women reporting that a person grabbed my bum 10 or 20 years ago. Really? Big deal. Being a drama queen is part of the job in Hollywood and getting your name in a newspaper is a potential career boost.
Having said that, I hope entitled scumbags Weinstein (sorry about the spelling) and Spacey get what they deserve - careers destroyed.

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Originally Posted by Dythbringer

Stop trying to pass off your stupidity as wisdom.

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Funny you should say that when you are quoting one of the guys that has been abusing women...
Could be seen as being hypocritical by some people.

Question to all...

Since unwanted and uninvited touching is bad, where do I report the women that touch me. Hugs, hand grabbing, arm/shoulder rubbing, chest/back/thigh touching/rubbing. I would get charged or in trouble at the very least for those things, but women do them all the time.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

Funny you should say that when you are quoting one of the guys that has been abusing women...
Could be seen as being hypocritical by some people.

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I have identified as much in another thread. I am having issues turning off my signature.

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Originally Posted by Dythbringer

Stop trying to pass off your stupidity as wisdom.

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Need I say more - http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment...ct-claims.html - at least I am not stupid enough to quote this scumbag on my posts and then have the audacity to call someone else stupid - as they say - you can't fix stupid - cheers

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

Question to all...

Since unwanted and uninvited touching is bad, where do I report the women that touch me. Hugs, hand grabbing, arm/shoulder rubbing, chest/back/thigh touching/rubbing. I would get charged or in trouble at the very least for those things, but women do them all the time.

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Same place the women report.....the police!

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Need I say more - http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment...ct-claims.html - at least I am not stupid enough to quote this scumbag on my posts and then have the audacity to call someone else stupid - as they say - you can't fix stupid - cheers

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See the post above yours. Signature should be gone by now. I quoted something funny he said a few years ago when the general public didn't know what was going on. That isn't stupid. Nice try though.

Get this through your brain: how a woman acts, dresses or goes does not invalidate her basic safety or her expectation of safety.

Mercy Joe. I could wear my bikini to a hunting banquet and that wouldn't give you permission/ nor an excuse to touch me .

I kind of feel sorry for some of these accused old guys. Back in that day , touching women uninvited was pretty acceptable behaviour. I remember a dog judge speaking to me very inappropriately, and chasing my friend around his trailer. Why didn't we say anything ? Because we didn't think anyone would care, or do anything about it.

For me , what all this recent legal action has shown is that women have finally come a long way in feeling free to speak up, and demand respect if necessary .

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Originally Posted by Dythbringer

I have identified as much in another thread. I am having issues turning off my signature.

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You then understand some may also have a health suspicion about the timing of events.

You can have both a strong dislike for abusers, and suspicion when people are accused at the exact moment it would do the most damage.

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Originally Posted by Sharon

Mercy Joe. I could wear my bikini to a hunting banquet and that wouldn't give you permission/ nor an excuse to touch me.

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I Agree with you on that. But I hope you can look at it from this point of view. I having known you from the board and having met and chatted with you once would not mind if you hugged me at the banquet. With that in mind my comfort level would be much higher if you are wearing a blouse and pants/skirt, then if you are in a bikini.

Sharon - why would you want to wear a bikini to a hunters' party - some guys might have a few beers too many and take that as a hint - you wouldn't do that would you - tell me you wouldn't

Times have changed. I read somewhere the other day that years ago if I offered up my seat on a bus or opened a door for a lady I was being polite. Today, those same actions would make me a sexist.

It may be hard, but you guys have gotta stop taking Joe's bait.

I can see him now, sitting back in his rocking chair, feeding his woodstove, and cackling to himself.

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Originally Posted by sawbill

Times have changed. I read somewhere the other day that years ago if I offered up my seat on a bus or opened a door for a lady I was being polite. Today, those same actions would make me a sexist.

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Times have changed for sure.....and not for the better!

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Originally Posted by 73hunter

It may be hard, but you guys have gotta stop taking Joe's bait.

I can see him now, sitting back in his rocking chair, feeding his woodstove, and cackling to himself.

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I was just about to post the same. I've been around a few internet forums and Joe is the best troll I've seen. Knows how to push buttons, but resonates with enough people to gather some support. Never crosses the lines however, but can walk right along it. Seriously, how many 80+ year old men do you know that post regularly on the internet, long, well worded sentences, with proper punctuation and links? Oh yeah, and Joe never posts anything that contributes to the forum. Ever seen a pictures or tails of Joe on his trips to 'North of the Border'?

Just stop responding, he'll go away. Joe is most likely a 41 year old, single, white guy.....and I could go on, but that isn't likely productive.

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Originally Posted by sawbill

Times have changed. I read somewhere the other day that years ago if I offered up my seat on a bus or opened a door for a lady I was being polite. Today, those same actions would make me a sexist.

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Gave my wife a hug/squeeze and a kiss on the forehead in public. Over heard two young girls commenting how I was treating her like a play thing.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

I Agree with you on that. But I hope you can look at it from this point of view. I having known you from the board and having met and chatted with you once would not mind if you hugged me at the banquet. With that in mind my comfort level would be much higher if you are wearing a blouse and pants/skirt, then if you are in a bikini.

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LOL It was an hyperbole - exaggeration to make a point. Relax , it isn't going to happen . :)

C'mon Guys, leave Joe alone. He's livening up the joint.

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Sharon - why would you want to wear a bikini to a hunters' party - some guys might have a few beers too many and take that as a hint - you wouldn't do that would you - tell me you wouldn't

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I don't know Joe. I'm 71 now. If I don't do it now, when I am I going to do it ? :) :silly:

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Originally Posted by sawbill

C'mon Guys, leave Joe alone. He's livening up the joint.

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Yes, that's right. Although in mid-November you'd think we'd all be talking about HUNTING on the OOD forum. I guess it takes a Joe to keep conversation interesting. And he's not wrong about everything.

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Originally Posted by Sharon

LOL It was an hyperbole - exaggeration to make a point. Relax , it isn't going to happen . :)

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Originally Posted by Sharon

I don't know Joe. I'm 71 now. If I don't do it now, when I am I going to do it ? :) :silly:

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Don't be so hard on yourself. You carry yourself with Grace and would make very pleasant dinner company.
:)

who needs a bowl???https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...6353ed06cb.gif

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Originally Posted by Deer Wrastler

who needs a bowl???https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...6353ed06cb.gif

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Hahaha!!! Now that’s funny !

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Originally Posted by sawbill

Times have changed. I read somewhere the other day that years ago if I offered up my seat on a bus or opened a door for a lady I was being polite. Today, those same actions would make me a sexist.

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I do that on a regular bases opening doors or offering my seat at a meeting. Never have I been called sexist and always receive a thank you. I think it depends on the individual.

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Originally Posted by 73hunter

It may be hard, but you guys have gotta stop taking Joe's bait.

I can see him now, sitting back in his rocking chair, feeding his woodstove, and cackling to himself.

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Wrong - I don't start up my wood stove until the end of November - right before buck season - once I start it I keep it going until Spring - don't want to start and stop cause it ain't good for the stove - the reason for most of my posts is to show you that there are other ways to look at things - not the accepted political correct way - and that comes out whenever I say something because right away it is considered a troll - it is not the accepted way to look at things then it is a troll - also want to show you how things are going down the tubes when compared with the way things were in the good old days - I will be 84 next week and I'll tell you something - I've been around a lot and seen a lot of things - things that a lot of you guys only read about - so instead of complaining why don't you make use of the opportunity and learn some thing - from a wise old man - and Capt' look at some of the pictures that I posted on the fishing forum - there are a lot of guys that met me at some of the tournaments we had in the past -

In the mean time hang in there and hope the ice starts forming on the water so you can go ice fishing - we had another shooting down here so things aren't that quiet on the southern front - as my deceased father-in-law used to say - "Helen, get me a beer"

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Wrong - I don't start up my wood stove until the end of November - right before buck season - once I start it I keep it going until Spring - don't want to start and stop cause it ain't good for the stove - the reason for most of my posts is to show you that there are other ways to look at things - not the accepted political correct way - and that comes out whenever I say something because right away it is considered a troll - it is not the accepted way to look at things then it is a troll - also want to show you how things are going down the tubes when compared with the way things were in the good old days - I will be 84 next week and I'll tell you something - I've been around a lot and seen a lot of things - things that a lot of you guys only read about - so instead of complaining why don't you make use of the opportunity and learn some thing - from a wise old man - and Capt' look at some of the pictures that I posted on the fishing forum - there are a lot of guys that met me at some of the tournaments we had in the past -

In the mean time hang in there and hope the ice starts forming on the water so you can go ice fishing - we had another shooting down here so things aren't that quiet on the southern front - as my deceased father-in-law used to say - "Helen, get me a beer"

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The good old days, when slaver was a thing and women were not allowed to leave the house, right Joe?

'Good old days', for whom? Just white guys I think.

Yes the good old days - when mom stayed home and took care of the kids and have a good meal ready when pop came home from work - when the kids showed respect to their elders and authority - when there was no dope - when you could leave the keys in the ignition - when you didn't have to lock your doors - when as a kid you could carry a pocket knife to school in your pocket - when most women acted like ladies - and most men acted like men - wimps were few - when you could tell a joke without offending anyone - when gas was 7 cents a gallon and they cleaned your windshield and checked your oil - when divorce was rare - when the immigrants that came were thankful for the opportunity to work hard and raise a family - when welfare was looked at as something you did your best to avoid - when the government didn't control everything you did - when you could say "Merry Christmas" without needing to think twice - when God was part of just about everyone's life - when politicians like
bill clinton who raped and mistreated women were thrown out of office and not reelected - when my country was respected and looked to as a shining light on a hill - wow I could go on but I'm running out of breath - so yes the good old days - see you guys didn't live then so you have nothing to compared today with - I lived during that time and I see how things have changed

I was born in 57 so I became a senior this year. I too have seen our country-world try to become more compassionate, and inclusive, but some folks did not get the memo and are resistant. No everything that changes is not always for the better, but every generation since the dawn of time has thought that there generation is- was the best.

The good old days when people actually talked to a person face to face, when kids played outside til dark, you could take a shotgun to school for bird hunting after class and no swat team showed up, you hitchhiked to go fishing or hunting, when you could tell the make of one car from another by the tailfins, or you could leave the door to your house unlocked, music was something you could dance to, or if your screwed up your parents supported the police instead of their rotten kid.
You know.......the days that todays me generation have no idea about.

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Originally Posted by sawbill

The good old days when people actually talked to a person face to face, when kids played outside til dark, you could take a shotgun to school for bird hunting after class and no swat team showed up, you hitchhiked to go fishing or hunting, when you could tell the make of one car from another by the tailfins, or you could leave the door to your house unlocked, music was something you could dance to, or if your screwed up your parents supported the police instead of their rotten kid.
You know.......the days that todays me generation have no idea about.

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Simpler times, gone for good ! The scary part is, according to Carly Simon, These are the good old days !!!!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PDJ_Mz8ftqI

Being a naturally suspicious person,I can't shake the feeling that all this female angst against Republican candidates and politicians is merely the political opportunism of dirty politics. I have a big issue with sudden revelations,crocodile tears and ambulance-chasing,feminist lawyers with tearless boo-hooing from women 40 years after the fact with scandalous,unprovable allegations just before an election or appointment. Every time this crap happens,I think of the hundreds of thousands of actual victims that endured brutal treatment at the hands of misogynistic boors that are guilty as sin and because of this BS,must endure further victimization from a legal system that's tainted by such conduct that's literally stacked the deck against any chance of receiving even a modicum of justice.

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Originally Posted by rick_iles

Same place the women report.....the police!

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No I mean somewhere they would think that if a man can't touch a woman's hand, a woman should not be pawing a guy.

If a 30ish year old woman walks up and gives a 14 year old boy a hug and a kiss on the cheek it's ok.

If a 14 year old girl walks up and talks to a 30ish year old man, he's a pedophile in some people's eyes.

Don't believe me? They did field trials in Holland( I think it was Holland) on public streets and researchers gauged people reaction to both. Generally they found nothing wrong with the physical contact between the older woman and young boy. But a large number of people felt that the man should not be talking to the young girl.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

No I mean somewhere they would think that if a man can't touch a woman's hand, a woman should not be pawing a guy.

If a 30ish year old woman walks up and gives a 14 year old boy a hug and a kiss on the cheek it's ok.

If a 14 year old girl walks up and talks to a 30ish year old man, he's a pedophile in some people's eyes.

Don't believe me? They did field trials in Holland( I think it was Holland) on public streets and researchers gauged people reaction to both. Generally they found nothing wrong with the physical contact between the older woman and young boy. But a large number of people felt that the man should not be talking to the young girl.

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Keep in mind, in Europe a hug and kiss on both cheeks is very common. Another strange topic posted by JoePa. lol

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Originally Posted by yellow dog

Keep in mind, in Europe a hug and kiss on both cheeks is very common. Another strange topic posted by JoePa. lol

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The results of the experiment show people's reaction are based on a social bias that men are pedophiles, rapists, or molesters.

There was a case in the UK where a father ( a widower) took his daughter to an amusement park on Holiday. The police where called because the staff saw a grown man with a teenage girl, which means he had to be a pedophile.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

The results of the experiment show people's reaction are based on a social bias that men are pedophiles, rapists, or molesters.

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The social bias that exists, exists for a good reason. The vast majority of sex offenders are in fact male. Not to say that the majority of men are sexual predators but the unfortunate truth is based on a balance of probabilities more men are deviants than women.

In our paranoid safety first culture this translates into assume the worst where a man's intentions are concerned.

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Originally Posted by Species8472

The vast majority of sex offenders are in fact male. Not to say that the majority of men are sexual predators but the unfortunate truth is based on a balance of probabilities more men are deviants than women.

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That is changing as more and more women are charged with abusing teenagers.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

The results of the experiment show people's reaction are based on a social bias that men are pedophiles, rapists, or molesters.

There was a case in the UK where a father ( a widower) took his daughter to an amusement park on Holiday. The police where called because the staff saw a grown man with a teenage girl, which means he had to be a pedophile.

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There is an amusement park located in the UK that is well known as place where pedophiles hang out to try and pick up young children. The majority of these pedophiles are elderly men at this particular amusement park. A friend of mine was visiting relatives a few years ago in the UK and went to this amusement park with her young daughter. She couldn't believe how many elderly men approached her daughter to try and strike up a conversation. It was a very creepy disturbing experience for the both of them.

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Yes the good old days - when mom stayed home and took care of the kids and have a good meal ready when pop came home from work - when the kids showed respect to their elders and authority - when there was no dope - when you could leave the keys in the ignition - when you didn't have to lock your doors - when as a kid you could carry a pocket knife to school in your pocket - when most women acted like ladies - and most men acted like men - wimps were few - when you could tell a joke without offending anyone - when gas was 7 cents a gallon and they cleaned your windshield and checked your oil - when divorce was rare - when the immigrants that came were thankful for the opportunity to work hard and raise a family - when welfare was looked at as something you did your best to avoid - when the government didn't control everything you did - when you could say "Merry Christmas" without needing to think twice - when God was part of just about everyone's life - when politicians like
bill clinton who raped and mistreated women were thrown out of office and not reelected - when my country was respected and looked to as a shining light on a hill - wow I could go on but I'm running out of breath - so yes the good old days - see you guys didn't live then so you have nothing to compared today with - I lived during that time and I see how things have changed

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Right on Joe. Good on ya brother. Why is it younger people can get smarter as they gain experience but refuse to listen to an older person who already has that same experience? Also - I agree with you - political correctness is a huge problem these days. You can't have an opposing opinion without the political correct sheep calling you a nazi, a homophobe, a troll etc. I dread the day we all think the same. Stepford wives.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

That is changing as more and more women are charged with abusing teenagers.

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Funny thing is that you will not hear the teen boys complain but the parents will.....lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M4_Ommfvv0

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Originally Posted by impact

Funny thing is that you will not hear the teen boys complain but the parents will.....lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M4_Ommfvv0

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Oh yes I remember well..:tongue::rolleyes::shy:

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Originally Posted by Roper

Right on Joe. Good on ya brother. Why is it younger people can get smarter as they gain experience but refuse to listen to an older person who already has that same experience? Also - I agree with you - political correctness is a huge problem these days. You can't have an opposing opinion without the political correct sheep calling you a nazi, a homophobe, a troll etc. I dread the day we all think the same. Stepford wives.

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X2. Politically correct liberalism is, beyond a shadow of a doubt,the worst threats to freedom and democracy since the rise of Communism and Nazism.:sad:

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

That is changing as more and more women are charged with abusing teenagers.

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We see this just this year and the media doesn't seem to want to do more than a quick mention ... that and just look at how they treated Benjamin Levin.
https://globalnews.ca/news/2750921/m...lving-student/

With Macleans talking about it a few years ago and
http://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/f...-one-suspects/

what I read out of here
http://ir.lib.uwo.ca/cgi/viewcontent...04&context=etd

It looks like elementary students suffer about 25% of the abuse and it seems to be alot more woman abusers than I would have thought.

Perpetrator Group/Number with one victim n (%) / Number with multiple victimsn (%)/ Average number of victims M (SD) /Length of offending(months)
M (SD)

Male elementary / 5 (27.8) / 13 (72.2) / 4.3 (2.8) / 50.8 (62.4)
Female elementary / 17 (53.1)/ 15 (46.9)/ 3.4 (5.5)/ 23.8 (37.4)
Male secondary / 8 (50.0) / 8 (50.0) / 2 (2.0) 11.8 (14.3)
Female secondary / 61 (71.8) / 24 (28.2)/ 1.8 (2.4)/ 14.8 (16.1)

So 85 female secondary teachers by 1.8 victims = 153 victims and for the male secondary perpetrators 16* times 2 = 32?

* that sounds off to me another part talks (Table 2) about over 116 victims of which 50 are male so these may be sums over multiple years

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

X2. Politically correct liberalism is, beyond a shadow of a doubt,the worst threats to freedom and democracy since the rise of Communism and Nazism.:sad:

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Looking at ANTIFA, M-103, admiration of the Communist dictatorship and what we see in the Media, the idiots we see with the Guevera shirts (a trainer of terrorists/guerillas and murder) .... it is probably best described as the resurgence of a mix of the National Socialist of 1930's Germany and Stalin's Russia and some Saudi Arabia or Iran mixed in.



P.S.
I go to read the news and who is in it .... Benjamin Levin ... now out on parole!


Depraved world view of Ben Levin continues on parole
http://torontosun.com/news/local-new...nues-on-parole

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Originally Posted by mosquito

what I read out of here
http://ir.lib.uwo.ca/cgi/viewcontent...04&context=etd

It looks like elementary students suffer about 25% of the abuse and it seems to be alot more woman abusers than I woul...

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I met and talked with one of the researchers for that paper. She was at St Joseph's Hospitial looking at how the staff would always be looking for young girls and Grown women that show signed of abuse, but none every thought that a male could be abused or raped. We talked about a 14 year old boy that was being held down and stripped by two 15 and 16 year girls. One of the girl's mothers walked in and caught them, but the boy still got charged with attempt rape. After about two years and a few court appearances and lots of interviews with police the charges against him were dropped. The girls were never charged with anything.

He later killed himself.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

I met and talked with one of the researchers for that paper. She was at St Joseph's Hospitial looking at how the staff would always be looking for young girls and Grown women that show signed of abuse, but no one every thought that a male could be abused or raped. We talked about a 14 year old boy that was being held down and stripped by two 15 and 16 year girls. One of the girl's mothers walked in and caught them, but the boy still got charged with attempt rape. After about two years and a few court appearances and lots of interviews with police the charges against him were dropped. The girls were never charged with anything.

He later killed himself.

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Exactly. I'm sure no one will agree with me, but I have sympathy for those Menendez brothers who shot their parents dead.. The boy was raped by his Dad daily for many years ; Mom knew about it and looked the other way. The boys are now in prison for life.
I was raised in a violent , abusive home.... no details , but I can fully understand how they just couldn't take it any more. I used to think , "Now if I just take that gun..............". Yes. Boys get raped!

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Originally Posted by Sharon

Exactly. I'm sure no one will agree with me, but I have sympathy for those Menendez brothers who shot their parents dead.. The boy was raped by his Dad daily for many years ; Mom knew about it and looked the other way. They are now in prison for life.
I was raised in a violent , abusive home.... no details , but I can fully understand how they just couldn't take it any more. I used to think , "Now if I just take that gun..............". Yes. Boys get raped!

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Looking at the one table in that report about 1/3 of the victims of the male perpetrators were boys (50) and I didn't notice how many of the female perpetrators victims were boys but it seem to be the largest majority so in that report the numbers suggest well over 150 IDENTIFIED boys that were victims. I couldn't find an exact break down I would have like but given...

Female elementary / 17 (53.1)/ 15 (46.9)/ 3.4 (5.5)/ 23.8 (37.4)

(17 + 15 ) * 3.4 avg victims = 109 ELEMENTARY AGE KIDS being assaulted by a female teacher.... and then add the 153 victims from Female Secondary teachers and it gets to be the equivalent of 10 or 11 classrooms ... that total of the FEMALE perpetrators ONLY would equal what many small schools have!

The article did a good job when it talks about how kids are lured/tricked/threatened etc. into it but I found some of the tables and numbers contradicting on each other totals and it lacked a totals table that laid out the female victims by sex and the number of male and female perpetrators in same sex assaults. The number seemed ALOT higher than I thought they would be (homosexuals around 2% but 30% of the assaults) and the usual view that there is no harm in same sex friendships there may be a need for those that should be watching to perhaps look a bit closer in some cases given what I read.

But reading that and then reading the news that Benjamin Levin was out and what he was up to I was *******censored**** pi***** at our "liberal" courts and judges!!!!!!!! There was a protest that include the boy rape group (man boy "Love" (rape) Association (NAMBLA) that had the motto of something like a boy before 8 or it was to late) about a month ago in the news and the ages that some of Wynnes changes on sex ed. start really make me wonder, especially in the light of Wynne's buddy!

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Originally Posted by Sharon

Exactly. I'm sure no one will agree with me, but I have sympathy for those Menendez brothers who shot their parents dead.. The boy was raped by his Dad daily for many years ; Mom knew about it and looked the other way. The boys are now in prison for life.
I was raised in a violent , abusive home.... no details , but I can fully understand how they just couldn't take it any more. I used to think , "Now if I just take that gun..............". Yes. Boys get raped!

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Sharon - Was the Menendez claim of father sexual abuse a proven fact or a claim by the brothers? Didn't they murder the mother also? I'm sceptical of their claim of sexual abuse. When in jail for murdering their parents, they came up with the sexual abuse claim. That's my recolection. I'm thinking the only evidence of sexual abuse came from the brothers themselves. I hope I'm not stating incorrect facts because I dislike that in others.

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Originally Posted by Roper

Sharon - Was the Menendez claim of father sexual abuse a proven fact or a claim by the brothers? Didn't they murder the mother also? I'm sceptical of their claim of sexual abuse. When in jail for murdering their parents, they came up with the sexual abuse claim. That's my recolection. I'm thinking the only evidence of sexual abuse came from the brothers themselves. I hope I'm not stating incorrect facts because I dislike that in others.

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Exactly correct. Leslie Abrahamson made the self-serving allegation but was never able to prove it. The jury wasn't buyin' it,either (obviously). I'm quite sure they're where they belong.

As said, I knew nobody would agree with me. :) I believe the boys.

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Originally Posted by Sharon

As said, I knew nobody would agree with me. :) I believe the boys.

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???????
If it was sexual abuse by the father, why did they murder their mother, big ?. just because she looked the other way , that's a very poor excuse for murder.
I believe they are where they belong!

Unless you've been in that boat , people don't understand the anger that builds over the years until it explodes.

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Yes the good old days - when mom stayed home and took care of the kids and have a good meal ready when pop came home from work - when the kids showed respect to their elders and authority - when there was no dope - when you could leave the keys in the ignition - when you didn't have to lock your doors - when as a kid you could carry a pocket knife to school in your pocket - when most women acted like ladies - and most men acted like men - wimps were few - when you could tell a joke without offending anyone - when gas was 7 cents a gallon and they cleaned your windshield and checked your oil - when divorce was rare - when the immigrants that came were thankful for the opportunity to work hard and raise a family - when welfare was looked at as something you did your best to avoid - when the government didn't control everything you did - when you could say "Merry Christmas" without needing to think twice - when God was part of just about everyone's life - when politicians like
bill clinton who raped and mistreated women were thrown out of office and not reelected - when my country was respected and looked to as a shining light on a hill - wow I could go on but I'm running out of breath - so yes the good old days - see you guys didn't live then so you have nothing to compared today with - I lived during that time and I see how things have changed

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I find this quote very interesting.
You claim the good old days or leaving your home unlocked and your keys in your car ignition.
I have to ask, if someone stole your car, or walked into your home and robbed it, would you blame yourself, or them?
By your reasoning, you are to blame.
It is not the deviants fault for stealing what is not theirs, it is your fault ENTIRELY, for enticing this behavior??

Food for thought.

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Originally Posted by puc911

I find this quote very interesting.
You claim the good old days or leaving your home unlocked and your keys in your car ignition.
I have to ask, if someone stole your car, or walked into your home and robbed it, would you blame yourself, or them?
By your reasoning, you are to blame.
It is not the deviants fault for stealing what is not theirs, it is your fault ENTIRELY, for enticing this behavior.

Food for thought.

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That is where you are most definitely WRONG!
If that was the case, the police should be /would be charging the home owner and he would be the one going to jail.
That line of thinking is absolutely absurd!

@jaycee

To clarify, I agree.
I was saying that was Joepa's reasoning when he was blaming women for being assaulted due to the way they were dressed.
I was not saying that was my opinion.
The second last sentence should have ended with a question mark.
Sorry for my mistype.

I just find it amazing it takes victims so long to report it and after the first one comes out it's a deluge.

As a woman I don't find that hard to understand at all. Takes great courage to report sexual abuse and if someone leads the way that makes it so much easier. Especially hard when you are young as opposed to 50,60,70.

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Originally Posted by Sharon

As a woman I don't find that hard to understand at all. Takes great courage to report sexual abuse and if someone leads the way that makes it so much easier. Especially hard when you are young as opposed to 50,60,70.

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I know that you're absolutely right,Sharon,but,I find the timing of all this highly suspect given the over-the-top smear campaign against the Trump administration and now,Judge Moore by Democrats that just can't get their heads around the fact that they got (and are still getting) their a*ses handed to them.

It’s not harassment if they get their own handed to them.
If these people did wrong 30 years ago why did they stop.

I can see a young aspiring actress/entertainer/musician being reluctant to report sexual abuse or harassment. If she reports an incident any chance she has of her career taking off will certainly be on the blocks.
Was it Dionne Warwick who said, regarding Ray Charles, "you don't play with Ray unless you lay with Ray" and her career was fairly well established.

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I know that you're absolutely right,Sharon,but,I find the timing of all this highly suspect given the over-the-top smear campaign against the Trump administration and now,Judge Moore by Democrats that just can't get their heads around the fact that they got (and are still getting) their a*ses handed to them.

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I thought of that too. If anything turns out to be false/made up for a purpose, that woman/women will have greatly hurt women generally. Hard enough for the abused to get believed without fake reports being publicized.

Yes, often unfortunately, " Lies travel around the world , while the truth is getting its pants on."

https://academicmatters.ca/2011/10/f...and-realities/

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I know that you're absolutely right,Sharon,but,I find the timing of all this highly suspect given the over-the-top smear campaign against the Trump administration and now,Judge Moore by Democrats that just can't get their heads around the fact that they got (and are still getting) their a*ses handed to them.

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A whole bunch of woman and men are coming out against democrats too, look at who was first on the list, a card carrying democrat praised until now by democrats.

One woman came out and said something and now a whole pile are coming out as I am sure they feel like they will not be told they are just lying anymore.

Look at Moore, these things happened 20+ years ago, I am wondering what "good old days" Joe refers, it seems to me like the good old days involved district attorneys sexually harassing teenage girls.

Come on Fox - you always pick some isolated cases and then apply that to the whole topic being debated - did sexual harassment happen in the old days - sure but not to the extent that it is happening today - pornography was outlawed then - movies didn't contain all of the sex you see now - women dressed modestly - these issues are the reason things are the way they are today - in those days men in general respected women and showed it by removing their hats when a women entered an elevator - gave them a seat in a crowded bus and opened the door for them - yesterday I happened to tune into a UFC channel - there were two women fighting and beating each other up - I thought to myself - boy you women have sure come a long way - stupid to say the least -

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Originally Posted by Fox

, I am wondering what "good old days" Joe refers, it seems to me like the good old days involved district attorneys sexually harassing teenage girls.

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If you dig around you will find lots of "Films" that got shown in school. A good number are cautionary tales for both Boys and Girls, and they all talked about proper conduct between Boys, Girls, women and men. Manners, respect and a common sense way of acting. That is that good old days he is talking about. He also knows they didn't get it right every time. How do you know Joe didn't march and fight for civil rights in the 50's and 60's? Joe Served in Korea, and lots of the ones that came home, didn't like how black veterans were treated. It was a real slap in the face of many to be told the man they fought beside was trash or less then human.

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Originally Posted by Sharon

Unless you've been in that boat , people don't understand the anger that builds over the years until it explodes.

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I don't doubt being sexually abused would be enough fuel to kill someone. I just don't believe the Mendez boys. I see them as rich, entitled, and highly manipulative.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sharon

As a woman I don't find that hard to understand at all. Takes great courage to report sexual abuse and if someone leads the way that makes it so much easier. Especially hard when you are young as opposed to 50,60,70.

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I agree. You see it all the time, people are more likely to ignore something that is wrong because they think it's easier or the idea of outing an abuser makes them uncomfortable. However, there is power in numbers and when one person is brave enough to say something, it usually encourages others to voice their concerns. This isn't specific to sexual abuse. Even in an office, someone may see something that should be addressed or changed but they feel it isn't their place to bring it up. As soon as one person addresses it, the ice is broken and people tend to chime in. So while I'm not surprised when this happens in, for example, an office and discussing policy, equipment, etc. , I am always disappointed when people have the knee-jerk reaction to judge or have disbelief concerning the topic of sexual misconduct, with the argument being, "well, what took you so long to say something? Why are you coming forward now?" There shouldn't be an expiration date on the truth.

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Originally Posted by BurlyGirl

I agree. You see it all the time, people are more likely to ignore something that is wrong because they think it's easier or the idea of outing an abuser makes them uncomfortable. However, there is power in numbers and when one person is brave enough to say something, it usually encourages others to voice their concerns. This isn't specific to sexual abuse. Even in an office, someone may see something that should be addressed or changed but they feel it isn't their place to bring it up. As soon as one person addresses it, the ice is broken and people tend to chime in. So while I'm not surprised when this happens in, for example, an office and discussing policy, equipment, etc. , I am always disappointed when people have the knee-jerk reaction to judge or have disbelief concerning the topic of sexual misconduct, with the argument being, "well, what took you so long to say something? Why are you coming forward now?" There shouldn't be an expiration date on the truth.

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No,there certainly shouldn't be an "expiration date on the truth,but,after all that time ,how the heck do you prove the allegations? As it stands,right now,other than a "she said,he said",there simply isn't any concrete evidence . The only trial taking place is by an extremely biased media whipping up public sentiment which in and of itself is very troubling.
The one fundamental truth is that when someone makes an accusation that can alter the course of someone's life (or history,for that matter),they bloody well better be able to back up the claim with solid evidence and if they can't,must be prepared to assume the consequences. If they get sued into oblivion,oh,well.

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

No,there certainly shouldn't be an "expiration date on the truth,but,after all that time ,how the heck do you prove the allegations? As it stands,right now,other than a "she said,he said",there simply isn't any concrete evidence . The only trial taking place is by an extremely biased media whipping up public sentiment which in and of itself is very troubling.
The one fundamental truth is that when someone makes an accusation that can alter the course of someone's life (or history,for that matter),they bloody well better be able to back up the claim with solid evidence and if they can't,must be prepared to assume the consequences. If they get sued into oblivion,oh,well.

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When there are several complainants coming forward and making accusations about a person along the same lines , then there has to be truth in the matter, it would then be up to the accused to disprove the accusations.
There is also the matter of others knowing about the accused persons behavior but staying silent about it till some one brave enough comes forward and says we have had enough, it has to stop, there are then enough people around that will come forward [not necessarily of their own volition ] to give evidence of the fact.
Some of these would be part of "the old boys club" that knew about it, but kept quiet, now that the news is out, they see that this old boy is no longer of any use to them , they will turn on him, happens all the time.

Just finally reading this and you hit the NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD. I think last year someone commented that he had made 2 or 3 posts somewhere else on the forum. Probably the fishing section. # 1 Shift Disturber on the forum.

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Originally Posted by CptSydor

I was just about to post the same. I've been around a few internet forums and Joe is the best troll I've seen. Knows how to push buttons, but resonates with enough people to gather some support. Never crosses the lines however, but can walk right along it. Seriously, how many 80+ year old men do you know that post regularly on the internet, long, well worded sentences, with proper punctuation and links? Oh yeah, and Joe never posts anything that contributes to the forum. Ever seen a pictures or tails of Joe on his trips to 'North of the Border'?

Just stop responding, he'll go away. Joe is most likely a 41 year old, single, white guy.....and I could go on, but that isn't likely productive.

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Originally Posted by BIG MAC

Just finally reading this and you hit the NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD. I think last year someone commented that he had made 2 or 3 posts somewhere else on the forum. Probably the fishing section. # 1 Shift Disturber on the forum.

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When he does post in other places, the "wild boars shot in Naven" comes to mind he went off accusing them of having the wrong type of pets and wasting good bacon, just to stir the pot.

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Originally Posted by Fox

When he does post in other places, the "wild boars shot in Naven" comes to mind he went off accusing them of having the wrong type of pets and wasting good bacon, just to stir the pot.

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Yes he is good at getting under "your" skin fox...:thumbup:.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

Yes he is good at getting under "your" skin fox...:thumbup:.

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I am not the only one, I am just done sitting back and reading the crap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

............. it would then be up to the accused to disprove the accusations.

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Back on topic......that's not the way it works,though,jaycee. It's never up to the accused to prove their innocence. It's up to the accusers to prove guilt beyond a shadow of a doubt. That's not happening,here,because time (in this case 40 years) has clouded memories,evidence has been lost (if there ever was any in the first place) and trial is taking place by allegations and innuendo in the media.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

Back on topic......that's not the way it works,though,jaycee. It's never up to the accused to prove their innocence. It's up to the accusers to prove guilt beyond a shadow of a doubt. That's not happening,here,because time (in this case 40 years) has clouded memories,evidence has been lost (if there ever was any in the first place) and trial is taking place by allegations and innuendo in the media.

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The statute of limitations in many cases would keep these from being taken to court. We need to make sure that our kids do not live in fear of talking, this is the only way these people will stop getting away with what they are doing. Sure, it is hard to trust someone when the accused is a trusted professional and the accuser is an unknown but this is how so many of these people get away with it. The issues within the Catholic church are prime examples of what can happen when people speak up and do it on mass, things can and will change even though charges may not be possible.

The right to say no and the obligation to respect the word no should be chapter 1 of any sex ed class for children. Unfortunately you'd be hard pressed to find that language anywhere in the sex ed program.

And you know this how? The new sex ed program is ALL about respect for others, and their choices. No means no has been around for years.

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Originally Posted by Fox

The statute of limitations in many cases would keep these from being taken to court. We need to make sure that our kids do not live in fear of talking, this is the only way these people will stop getting away with what they are doing. Sure, it is hard to trust someone when the accused is a trusted professional and the accuser is an unknown but this is how so many of these people get away with it. The issues within the Catholic church are prime examples of what can happen when people speak up and do it on mass, things can and will change even though charges may not be possible.

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I'm well aware of the "statue of limitations" in US law. That,in and of itself,has stopped criminal and civil prosecutions which is unfortunate. It's a wonder that section of US law hasn't been repealed. Without doubt,some terrible criminals are still walking the streets to continue their activities,unabated,or at least,until,they're finally caught. It also doesn't stop victims from fear of being sued into silence. We must avoid,at all costs,taking complainants accusations at face value which seems to be what's happening,now. There needs to be system of checks and balances to prevent accusations from being used against someone simply to exact revenge for some real or imagined slight or as a political tool to discredit an opponent. That's where a very vigorous libel and/or defamation law suit comes in and I can't understand if all these allegations are false,why they haven't been launched. I sure know that if I was accused of something like this,I'd go after them with a vengence.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I'm well aware of the "statue of limitations" in US law. That,in and of itself,has stopped criminal and civil prosecutions which is unfortunate. It's a wonder that section of US law hasn't been repealed. Without doubt,some terrible criminals are still walking the streets to continue their activities,unabated,or at least,until,they're finally caught. It also doesn't stop victims from fear of being sued into silence. We must avoid,at all costs,taking complainants accusations at face value which seems to be what's happening,now. There needs to be system of checks and balances to prevent accusations from being used against someone simply to exact revenge for some real or imagined slight or as a political tool to discredit an opponent. That's where a very vigorous libel and/or defamation law suit comes in and I can't understand if all these allegations are false,why they haven't been launched. I sure know that if I was accused of something like this,I'd go after them with a vengence.

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A civil trial would prove as difficult as a criminal complaint, to a degree. If a criminal complaint can’t be proven due to the time element, a civil hearing would have the same issues.
The difference would be that evidence in a civil trial does not have to meet the same “beyond reasonable doubt” requirements. Ask OJ !!!!!

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

And you know this how? The new sex ed program is ALL about respect for others, and their choices. No means no has been around for years.

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Just my opinion from what I've read in the curriculum. You're right, there's lots of talk of respect for others and their choices. but little to none on respecting the word no.
Given that its a sex ed course, I think it should have a place in there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by onelessarrow

Just my opinion from what I've read in the curriculum. You're right, there's lots of talk of respect for others and their choices. but little to none on respecting the word no.
Given that its a sex ed course, I think it should have a place in there.

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This needs to be done at the home from day one, if we want for the schools to teach our kids how to respect others we will have a really poor generation. Make sure your sons and daughters know boundaries and know that nobody is allowed to cross them without their ok, not a teacher, not a friend, not a parent or step parent, nobody.

Let's stop blaming those who are assaulted.

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Originally Posted by Fox

I am not the only one, I am just done sitting back and reading the crap.

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No Kidding, I can relate.LOL

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I'm well aware of the "statue of limitations" in US law. That,in and of itself,has stopped criminal and civil prosecutions which is unfortunate. It's a wonder that section of US law hasn't been repealed. Without doubt,some terrible criminals are still walking the streets to continue their activities,unabated,or at least,until,they're finally caught. It also doesn't stop victims from fear of being sued into silence. We must avoid,at all costs,taking complainants accusations at face value which seems to be what's happening,now. There needs to be system of checks and balances to prevent accusations from being used against someone simply to exact revenge for some real or imagined slight or as a political tool to discredit an opponent. That's where a very vigorous libel and/or defamation law suit comes in and I can't understand if all these allegations are false,why they haven't been launched. I sure know that if I was accused of something like this,I'd go after them with a vengence.

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Well said. I believe in innocent until PROVEN guilty. The media has a tremendous effect on all that. Imagine being raked over the coals publicly like some of these guys and you are actually innocent? Just watched the Scott Peterson documentary again. Not saying he was innocent, but he was done before he ever hit the court room.

I hate to cloud the issue here. But some radio stations are reporting the ladies that are accusing Moore of assault, are receiving financial compensation for coming forward and doing it at this moment. If that was true, it casts even more doubt on their stories. If it turns out to be a politically motivated attempt to hurt Moore, it well back fire on the ladies. If is true they get what they deserve, and I say bury them deep.

Because not only have they damaged a man's reputation, but it will make it even harder for anyone to believe the next person that says they were assaulted or harrassed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

I hate to cloud the issue here. But some radio stations are reporting the ladies that are accusing Moore of assault, are receiving financial compensation for coming forward and doing it at this moment. If that was true, it casts even more doubt on their stories. If it turns out to be a politically motivated attempt to hurt Moore, it well back fire on the ladies. If is true they get what they deserve, and I say bury them deep.

Because not only have they damaged a man's reputation, but it will make it even harder for anyone to believe the next person that says they were assaulted or harrassed.

---

Some radio stations also claim that the earth is flat.

Here's a CNN link since so many seem to believe their reports:

Alabama Rep. Mo Brooks: Roy Moore accuser forged yearbook inscription, is 'clearly a liar'

(CNN)Alabama Rep. Mo Brooks said Tuesday that a woman who accused Republican nominee for US Senate Roy Moore of sexually assaulting her when she was 16 is "clearly a liar."

The woman, Beverly Young Nelson, now 56, showed reporters at a news conference earlier this month what she said was Moore's inscription in her yearbook in 1977, which read, "To a sweeter more beautiful girl, I could not say, 'Merry Christmas.' Love, Roy Moore DA, 12-22-77,

[COLOR=#262626]"What you have is the mainstream leftwing socialist Democrat news media trying to distort the evidence to cause people to reach the conclusion that Roy Moore engaged in unlawful conduct with a minor and my analysis of the evidence is that is not the case," Brooks said on "The Dale Jackson Show" on WVNN Alabama radio. "Most importantly, the media likes to say 'well, there are nine complainers.' Seven of them aren't complainers. In fact, I would be calling seven of those ladies as witnesses on behalf of Roy Moore on the issue of whether he is engaged in any kind of unlawful conduct."
[COLOR=#262626]He continued, "There are only two that have asserted that Roy Moore engaged in unlawful conduct. One of those is clearly a liar because that one forged the 'love, Roy Moore' part of a yearbook in order to try to for whatever reason get at Roy Moore and win this seat for the Democrats and there's a lot more to it as to why I believe that the evidence is almost incontrovertible about whether the yearbook was forged."


http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/29/politi...ore/index.html

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Originally Posted by Fox

Some radio stations also claim that the earth is flat.

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Which ones?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by terrym

Which ones?

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Would you believe that it is being reported on "BOTH" CNN & Fox News. :scream: Two more politically opposed, biased against each other station may never have existed.:confused: If both Extreme Left and Extreme Right are reporting the same story and with the same option and facts( as they believe them to be), you need to pay attention. :sad:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fox

Some radio stations also claim that the earth is flat.

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I know of an Astronomy Professor that has an assignment that asks his students to explain how the a person living on the moon could prove that the Earth orbits the moon, using Scientific observations. He says the ones that learn the most are that ones that fail because they can't figure out how.
It has to do with the point of reference the observer has.

There are sexual predators that need to be caught and punished. It's getting alittle out of hand.
I could care less if you's want to flame me go ahead. For every woman who has been harassed in the film industry, there's 500 more lined up willing to do what ever it takes to get what they want. I believe some of these claims are coming from some women who figured they would give sexual pleasures to get a role, job, what ever they were after, and then when turned down, they turn on the person.
Gomeshi is a prime example. Two female friends tried to get into his world and after they put out to get a piece of the pie, they were sent packing, only to cry sexual assault, which were false. Now the CBC is paying out a enormous settlement to a man the two women try to ruin.
Can't always be so quick to make judgment as not all people are truthful when it comes to money and sex.

Sex predators deserve to be exposed and punished. No brainer. But let's not kid ourselves the way business is run in Hollywood is no secret and for the 10% who were victimized I would say the other 90% knowingly and willingly hit the casting couch. Hollywood is a LaLa land of self entitled egomaniacs and narcissists who feed on those who want to join the club.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by canadaman30

There are sexual predators that need to be caught and punished. It's getting alittle out of hand.
I could care less if you's want to flame me go ahead. For every woman who has been harassed in the film industry, there's 500 more lined up willing to do what ever it takes to get what they want. I believe some of these claims are coming from some women who figured they would give sexual pleasures to get a role, job, what ever they were after, and then when turned down, they turn on the person.
Gomeshi is a prime example. Two female friends tried to get into his world and after they put out to get a piece of the pie, they were sent packing, only to cry sexual assault, which were false. Now the CBC is paying out a enormous settlement to a man the two women try to ruin.
Can't always be so quick to make judgment as not all people are truthful when it comes to money and sex.

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After working many years (after law enforcement) in the auto industry,I've seen enough BS harassment charges to fill a large bucket. Many times,both supervisors and regular male employees were hauled to the "tribunal" by female employees who tried to flirt/screw their way to the top on seniority-based positions or "get even" with someone for some real or imagined slight,becoming bitter and angry. Most (although,a few were not) were unfounded,but,the damage was done and supervisor's careers came to a screaming halt. Even scarier,though,was how complaints could be laid by "third party" information after a conversation happened to be overheard by someone else who then laid the complaint to Union reps or supervision. They were,then, duty-bound and required by Ontario labor law to start the investigation process regardless of whether or not information was verifiably true or face severe sanctions,themselves. I kept all my interactions with fellow employees and upper management on an a cordial "arm's length" basis even if it meant being viewed as a bit of a "stick-in-the-mud",also,being very careful to keep work and personal life distinctly separate. In a mine-field world of the politically correct union/management work environment,it was the only way to survive unscathed. I'd worked too long and hard with too much to lose to let some miscreant destroy it all. Thank God I retired when I did.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by last5oh_302

Here's a CNN link since so many seem to believe their reports:

Alabama Rep. Mo Brooks: Roy Moore accuser forged yearbook inscription, is 'clearly a liar'

(CNN)Alabama Rep. Mo Brooks said Tuesday that a woman who accused Republican nominee for US Senate Roy Moore of sexually assaulting her when she was 16 is "clearly a liar."

The woman, Beverly Young Nelson, now 56, showed reporters at a news conference earlier this month what she said was Moore's inscription in her yearbook in 1977, which read, "To a sweeter more beautiful girl, I could not say, 'Merry Christmas.' Love, Roy Moore DA, 12-22-77,

[COLOR=#262626]"What you have is the mainstream leftwing socialist Democrat news media trying to distort the evidence to cause people to reach the conclusion that Roy Moore engaged in unlawful conduct with a minor and my analysis of the evidence is that is not the case," Brooks said on "The Dale Jackson Show" on WVNN Alabama radio. "Most importantly, the media likes to say 'well, there are nine complainers.' Seven of them aren't complainers. In fact, I would be calling seven of those ladies as witnesses on behalf of Roy Moore on the issue of whether he is engaged in any kind of unlawful conduct."
[COLOR=#262626]He continued, "There are only two that have asserted that Roy Moore engaged in unlawful conduct. One of those is clearly a liar because that one forged the 'love, Roy Moore' part of a yearbook in order to try to for whatever reason get at Roy Moore and win this seat for the Democrats and there's a lot more to it as to why I believe that the evidence is almost incontrovertible about whether the yearbook was forged."


http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/29/politi...ore/index.html

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Just to be clear. CNN is not reporting those facts, they are quoting Mo Brooks, who recently lost his bid for Senate and is now endorsing Roy Moore.

The last I read on the subject, Beverly Nelson had admitted to adding the date and restaurant name to the yearbook entry - for context.

EDIT - Fun Fact: Apparently Mo Brooks used to be a talk-radio host for that same radio station, right before Sean Hannity took over the job. Small world

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

Back on topic......that's not the way it works,though,jaycee. It's never up to the accused to prove their innocence. It's up to the accusers to prove guilt beyond a shadow of a doubt. That's not happening,here,because time (in this case 40 years) has clouded memories,evidence has been lost (if there ever was any in the first place) and trial is taking place by allegations and innuendo in the media.

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If that is not how it works , then how/why do those that are accused by what they did 20/25/40 years ago wind up in court ? this has happened to many , hockey coaches, scout leaders, priests/ministers, teachers, these have all been reported on in the newspapers , with the accused going to court, convicted and are now serving time .
I can't think of his name but the one that comes to mind is the hockey coach that molested a now famous hockey player who was in his teens at the time .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fox

The statute of limitations in many cases would keep these from being taken to court. We need to make sure that our kids do not live in fear of talking, this is the only way these people will stop getting away with what they are doing. Sure, it is hard to trust someone when the accused is a trusted professional and the accuser is an unknown but this is how so many of these people get away with it. The issues within the Catholic church are prime examples of what can happen when people speak up and do it on mass, things can and will change even though charges may not be possible.

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The statute of limitations , does not apply to sexual harassment or molestation .

The statue of limitations is different in each state down here - the length of time depends in what state the crime was committed - I think if someone is molested he or she should immediately bring it to light and not wait to do that years later - if it is something that is important enough then they should not worry about the fall out - do what is right and the heck if your job or whatever is threatened - coming out 40 years later is a joke -

Many women are looked at as sex objects - I wonder why - they dress in such a way that makes them look sexy - they wear skirts up around their butts and blouses where their boobs hang out and touch the ground - after all guys are attracted to women and when they dress and act this way things happen - I am not condoning sexual harassment but I can see why it happens - women have to take some of the blame at times

What is going to happen is when someone runs for public office the opposing party only needs to pay a couple dingbags to claim that the other guy molested them years ago even if it is not true and public opinion will crush the innocent guy - a sad state of affairs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JoePa

The statue of limitations is different in each state down here - the length of time depends in what state the crime was committed - I think if someone is molested he or she should immediately bring it to light and not wait to do that years later - if it is something that is important enough then they should not worry about the fall out - do what is right and the heck if your job or whatever is threatened - coming out 40 years later is a joke -

Many women are looked at as sex objects - I wonder why - they dress in such a way that makes them look sexy - they wear skirts up around their butts and blouses where their boobs hang out and touch the ground - after all guys are attracted to women and when they dress and act this way things happen - I am not condoning sexual harassment but I can see why it happens - women have to take some of the blame at times

What is going to happen is when someone runs for public office the opposing party only needs to pay a couple dingbags to claim that the other guy molested them years ago even if it is not true and public opinion will crush the innocent guy - a sad state of affairs

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You need to stop blaming the victim for what she was wearing, in the Moore case they were 14-16 years old and it was the 1970s, were they really dressing inappropriately for Moore to allegedly go after them? You know, there was a time when showing ones ankles was considered "ty", showing ones hair is still taboo in the Amish community but yet there is a massive problem with Sexual abuse in the Amish community, must be their dress.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=316371&page=1

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

The statute of limitations , does not apply to sexual harassment or molestation .

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It depends on the state and to what degree, here is a list of the laws, crazy that if you are 16 and sexually assaulted in a felony way in Alabama you have 3 years for charges.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fox

You need to stop blaming the victim for what she was wearing, in the Moore case they were 14-16 years old and it was the 1970s, were they really dressing inappropriately for Moore to allegedly go after them? You know, there was a time when showing ones ankles was considered "ty", showing ones hair is still taboo in the Amish community but yet there is a massive problem with Sexual abuse in the Amish community, must be their dress.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=316371&page=1



It depends on the state and to what degree, here is a list of the laws, crazy that if you are 16 and sexually assaulted in a felony way in Alabama you have 3 years for charges.

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Everyone is forgetting that in 1970,the age of consent in Alabama was 14 years old. Parents could consent for a child to marry at age 13. The same was true in Canada until the Harper Conservatives changed it to what we have,now,in an effort to stop young people being recruited into the sex trade. In Canada,there's no statute of limitations for criminal code offenses. If the same situation with a politician existed here,there'd be charges laid in a heartbeat no matter how long ago the offenses occurred as long as evidence still existed and there was a reasonable expectation of a conviction.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JoePa

The statue of limitations is different in each state down here - the length of time depends in what state the crime was committed - I think if someone is molested he or she should immediately bring it to light and not wait to do that years later - if it is something that is important enough then they should not worry about the fall out - do what is right and the heck if your job or whatever is threatened - coming out 40 years later is a joke -

Many women are looked at as sex objects - I wonder why - they dress in such a way that makes them look sexy - they wear skirts up around their butts and blouses where their boobs hang out and touch the ground - after all guys are attracted to women and when they dress and act this way things happen - I am not condoning sexual harassment but I can see why it happens - women have to take some of the blame at times

What is going to happen is when someone runs for public office the opposing party only needs to pay a couple dingbags to claim that the other guy molested them years ago even if it is not true and public opinion will crush the innocent guy - a sad state of affairs

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Joepa!
You are always blaming women, but there are many sexual predators that prey on young men and boys, do these young men and boys dress in a sexually provocative manner to have these deviants harass or molest them ?
Why have priests, bishops and even cardinals been accused of molestation of alter boys, you know this has happened many times , what drives these men to becoming such deviants? , this is not something new as it has been happening for ages.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

Joepa!
You are always blaming women, but there are many sexual predators that prey on young men and boys, do these young men and boys dress in a sexually provocative manner to have these deviants harass or molest them ?
Why have priests, bishops and even cardinals been accused of molestation of alter boys, you know this has happened many times , what drives these men to becoming such deviants? , this is not something new as it has been happening for ages.

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You must be talking about Ben Levin. The hand picked guy Wynne chose to write her sex Ed curriculum. Turned out to be a child molester.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

Everyone is forgetting that in 1970,the age of consent in Alabama was 14 years old.

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It looks to be 16 at least as early as 1975 in Alabama, everywhere I have read. Where did you find 14?

Sorry Jay' I can only relate to what a man thinks - I ain't a fruitcup - those priests were all homosexuals who became priests because they did not have a desire to marry - if you have kids you have to be very careful who they are around - I read that up to 35% of priests are homosexuals - not that they all do anything wrong but it should put you on guard -

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mooboy76

It looks to be 16 at least as early as 1975 in Alabama, everywhere I have read. Where did you find 14?

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From relatives that live here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JoePa

Sorry Jay' I can only relate to what a man thinks - I ain't a fruitcup - those priests were all homosexuals who became priests because they did not have a desire to marry - if you have kids you have to be very careful who they are around - I read that up to 35% of priests are homosexuals - not that they all do anything wrong but it should put you on guard -

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How do you know what a man thinks?

That still does not explain why YOU are always blaming women for what happens to them .
I personally appreciate seeing a woman with a great figure and legs , why should that woman dress like a " frump " so that any sexual pervert doesn't attack her for looking good, being proud of the fact and showing off a bit.
There are also men that dress to show off their physique because again thy are proud/happy about the way they look , yet you do not see women jumping them on the street and dragging them into allies to sexually molest them .

Joe.! I have to ask this , are you misogynistic !

I bet JoePa would blame his wife and daughter if they were raped, molested or sexually assulted. Joe would have loved it if his wife back in the day went out with Bill Cosby or his young daughter got into the car of Roy Moore. He would be alright if his daughter then went for an interview with Harvey Weinstein. If anything happened to them. It's their fault, they had it coming

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

How do you know what a man thinks?

That still does not explain why YOU are always blaming women for what happens to them .
I personally appreciate seeing a woman with a great figure and legs , why should that woman dress like a " frump " so that any sexual pervert doesn't attack her for looking good, being proud of the fact and showing off a bit.
There are also men that dress to show off their physique because again thy are proud/happy about the way they look , yet you do not see women jumping them on the street and dragging them into allies to sexually molest them .

Joe.! I have to ask this , are you misogynistic !

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What? Come on,that's just a touch over-the-top,jaycee. You're starting to sound like a liberal snow flake. All this will bite the feminists in the butt (no pun intended). The "glass ceiling" just dropped about 5 floors from the "don't hire females" back lash.

misogynistic - never heard of her - what team does she play on ? - my wife and daughters always dressed modestly and always acted like ladies - they didn't go around showing their wares - and I'll tell you something if any guy ever molested either of them they would have to deal with me and that would the end of them

I remember years ago I ordered a truck load of sand delivered to the house for some concrete work I was doing - the truck driver was a fat guy who my wife said looked kinda creepy - after unloading the stone he knocked on the back door and wanted to know with my wife was interested in buying shoes - she said no but was somewhat concerned from the way the guy acted - we lived in the country so there wasn't anyone else around - the guy left but called the next day about buying shoes - then he called a second time - well I called up the guy and asked if he was the one who delivered the sand to my house - yes he was - well I told him if he called again or showed his fat around my place I was gonna go looking for him and put some holes in his fat belly - never heard from him again - so you see if any pervert would have ever hurt my family they would regret it big time -

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

From relatives that live here.

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I dug a little deeper just to be sure.

Age of consent for girls has been 16 in Alabama since 1923, unless the boy was also under 16. It was an offence to have, or abuse to attempt to gain, carnal knowledge of a girl 12-16 (Alabama Code 1923, § 5411) There was a separate, concurrent, offence when the girls were under 12, but with relic provisions for 10-14 (Alabama Code 1923, § 5410). Both were valid offences on the books.

Under 16 was reaffirmed in the Code of Alabama 1975 under the new title and chapter that it is listed under today. § 13A-6-70

Maybe the relatives were thinking of the one offence, but were not aware of the other.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

There are also men that dress to show off their physique because again thy are proud/happy about the way they look , yet you do not see women jumping them on the street and dragging them into allies to sexually molest them .

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Then you are not paying attention. Well I will admit they do normally jump then " out on the " street, they do jump them. I don't know of many that drag men to their Allies, normally they like to keep them to their self.

"LONELY WOMEN" make good lovers. Ignored women are easly charmed by a few kind words, and a friendly smooth talking friend.

Maybe the worst form of abuse you will ever see is the guy that ignore his wife or girlfriend, just taking her for granted.
Then can not understand why she finds confort else where.

You mean to tell us( all the people on here) you have never been approached?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

.................................................. ..............
There are also men that dress to show off their physique because again thy are proud/happy about the way they look , yet you do not see women jumping them on the street and dragging them into allies to sexually molest them ......................................

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I've thought about it though. ( Just kidding gentlemen.) :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mooboy76

I dug a little deeper just to be sure.

Age of consent for girls has been 16 in Alabama since 1923, unless the boy was also under 16. It was an offence to have, or abuse to attempt to gain, carnal knowledge of a girl 12-16 (Alabama Code 1923, § 5411) There was a separate, concurrent, offence when the girls were under 12, but with relic provisions for 10-14 (Alabama Code 1923, § 5410). Both were valid offences on the books.

Under 16 was reaffirmed in the Code of Alabama 1975 under the new title and chapter that it is listed under today. § 13A-6-70

Maybe the relatives were thinking of the one offence, but were not aware of the other.

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They live on the Ala-Ga line,so anything's possible. LOL

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sharon

I've thought about it though. ( Just kidding gentlemen.) :)

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Just have an attractive lady look your way is a compliment.

The thing that gets me the most friendly smiles is not how I dress( it helps I guess), but the way I treat and respect my wife/girlfriend. 9 years of marrage this November and I still and working on winning her heart. I had it 11 years ago, but there is no reason to stop courting her.

What a croc of crap. Confront the perp in a timely manner or put it in the past. In my State the SOL for rape is 9 years. Think about that... one cannot "crucify" a person for rape, per the law, after 9 years, yet one can destroy lives for much lesser "evil actions" for life? At the very most, some of the accusation would be simple assault or maybe sexual assault. Regardless, let the accused/defendant face their accuser in a reasonable/timely manner as per law and not per the court of public opinion.

Today it seems accusations are enough to ruin lives/careers. No longer is there a presumption of innocence wrt ANY special interest group's accusation.

Sexual assault is unacceptable. Full stop.
The problem now is it's beginning to be used as a weapon to ruin careers. Could very well be justified in many cases no argument. But, not always. The flip side is the women who are out with an agenda might regret it. If a guy like Trump who is a billionaire and arguably the most powerful man in the world decides to use a fraction of his resources he could sue you into poverty. It will also make employers rethink about possibly exposing them to lawsuits and complaints which unfortunately will have the reverse effect of advancing equality.

I agree . And now one of my favourite interviewers has been suspended- Tavis Smiley. Thank goodness we all don't see the sins of our past on the front page of the newspaper.

edited : Tavis not Travis

Quote:

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Originally Posted by terrym

Sexual assault is unacceptable. Full stop.
The problem now is it's beginning to be used as a weapon to ruin careers. Could very well be justified in many cases no argument. But, not always. The flip side is the women who are out with an agenda might regret it. If a guy like Trump who is a billionaire and arguably the most powerful man in the world decides to use a fraction of his resources he could sue you into poverty. It will also make employers rethink about possibly exposing them to lawsuits and complaints which unfortunately will have the reverse effect of advancing equality.

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Putin is the most powerful man in the world by a huge margin...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by canadaman30

Putin is the most powerful man in the world by a huge margin...

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Yep,and we all know what happens to people that accuse him of anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sharon

I agree . And now one of my favourite interviewers has been suspended- Travis Smiley. Thank goodness we all don't see the sins of our past on the front page of the newspaper.

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That's the scary thing,though,right? There's absolutely nothing stopping any man's former lover,business associate or co-worker from making the accusation of sexual harassment/assault. She can make the claim and simply walk away laughing,content in the knowledge that his life will be destroyed. If your a man in Ontario in this political climate and politically motivated process,you're guilty no matter what,convicted in the court of public opinion by a leftist,politically correct main stream media,not to mention if one is actually hauled before the Human Rights Tribunal (kangaroo court),well,he might as well join the French Foreign Legion. All of this seems to be "de rigeur" for people seeking their "fifteen minutes of fame",feminist organizations and ambulance-chasing lawyers in the short term,but,in the long term,the damage done to women's rights and all the advances women have made in the last 30 years may be completely destroyed. For some who may have legitimate complaints,coming forward may be cathartic,but,for the others,when suddenly they can't get jobs or appointments to high office because they're regarded as a liability,I hope it was worth it. Talk about being hoisted on their own petard................

Not a single, normal, heterosexual male in North America could deny any accusation of sexual forwardness. Remember High School?

As Terry mentioned, unwanted is unwanted. By the same consideration the BS, dated, decades old accusations, for the only purpose of ruining a career, a political opponent or simply enriching an ambulance chasing lawyer is more evil and diabolical that the "alleged" original sin.

Either confront the person or have police charge the named, in a timely manner as per common lawful standards or forget it. In fact, it should be an automatic libel/slander verdict if brought out in public in anyway outside of any existing statute of limitations. The so called victim had their time to take action but didn't. Why?

It is crystal clear what the real agenda is by the special interest groups. Take Kirsten Gillibrand. You couldn't whip her azz and make her scream rape, sexual assault, etc when she was Bill Clinton's lacky. Now SHE is the Champion of "abused" women, give me a break........

Exactly , except that is where the problem arises. Most sexual abuse occurs at home from a family member. It may take many years for the women/man to have the courage to say, " Dad........" or "My brother......." , or "My uncle......." or My babysitter....." We want to make it okay for those abused kids to speak up later in life - even much later.

That's my point. Some of these accusations are pretty dated with likely no way of proving it anymore. Yet the man is assumed guilty. If I was Trump I would hire the best lawyers in the land and crush one. The others might rethink thier motives.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sharon

Exactly , except that is where the problem arises. Most sexual abuse occurs at home from a family member. It may take many years for the women/man to have the courage to say, " Dad........" or "My brother......." , or "My uncle......." or My babysitter....." We want to make it okay for those abused kids to speak up later in life - even much later.

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And these are legitimate victims who's aggressors are usually nobodys. Now it seems any male celebrity or politician who ever made a pass at a women is a rapist.

I listened to a radio program with Libby Znaimer on A.M. 740 a couple of days ago , and there where a few women that themselves said "they could not understand why it takes 20 to 40 years to bring out these accusations , and that some of those accusations are for merely touching , not groping ", a couple of them said that they, the accusers should merely forget it and get on with their lives after all this time that has elapsed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jaycee

I listened to a radio program with Libby Znaimer on A.M. 740 a couple of days ago , and there where a few women that themselves said "they could not understand why it takes 20 to 40 years to bring out these accusations , and that some of those accusations are for merely touching , not groping ", a couple of them said that they, the accusers should merely forget it and get on with their lives after all this time that has elapsed.

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I really wonder about some of the touching they are talking about too, some are obvious jerks or worse BUT there is alot of cultures where touching is just part of the culture. We have a family friend from Egypt that if she walked in the house I would get a big hug and there are others like her that while you are talking to them they are holding onto your hand or arm like you are trying to escape etc. There are so many differences in culture and even within the culture some of it is getting ridiculous or attention seeking it seems.

There are cultures and areas where rape is approved (re: Qu'ran and Hadith) for various reasons involving control and terror but these barbaric practices are completely unacceptable and should be punished far more seriously than they often are. Violence against women, female genital mutilation and harassment are serious issues, BUT in the "harassment" part .... how do you define it? There are women (AND men) that if you don't give them a hug they feel slighted and others if you gave them a hug they would be shocked and feel uncomfortable. Was the touch a person feeling friendly, just being touchy, cultural or even just them feeling like they needed to touch someone..... it is such a grey zone and I don't see some trying to figure it out.

I'm not talking about grabbing like this....
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4M8EY_UcAAPdUe.jpg:large

BUT she is a leftie so it doesn't count it seems.... and Justin seems to like it https://i.imgur.com/P2Hqcdp.jpg

and Justin does alot of hugging too...
http://stateofthenation2012.com/wp-c...justein2-2.jpg

Think he will press charges against Justin?
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/...7622106440.jpg

The bible approves of rape as well, Deuteronomy 20:10-14 or how about, Numbers 31:7-18 , and lots more evidence if you need them. I think most rational people can tell the difference between just being touched, and a 'sexual touch'.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

The bible approves of rape as well, Deuteronomy 20:10-14 or how about, Numbers 31:7-18 , and lots more evidence if you need them. I think most rational people can tell the difference between just being touched, and a 'sexual touch'.

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Your ignorance is still showing ... it talks about the taking of slaves when they were clearing the land during the judgment of the nations there... or is it you think they should kill the little girls too? The Bible is clear about sexual immorality, they even brought the woman who was willing participating to Jesus to try and get him to say stone her.... always wondered where the man went... Deuteronomy even a few verses later says that the man should die for rape.

Deuteronomy 22:25
25 But if the man encounters an engaged woman in the open country, and he seizes and rapes her, only the man who raped her must die.





Most can, but as usual you seem ignorant of the fact there are huge differences in what cultures expect is what I am pointing out.