Could changes to the Hullet pheasant hunt bring out it’s potential?

Hunted Hullet today, hunted hard for 3 hours with the dog, didn’t see or hear a single pheasant. This has been the story for a few years now, I make the 3 hour trip up, no action. Seems like it’s an opening day thing unless you get a tip on the release dates.

This is an amazing property and we are lucky to be able to hunt pheasant on it period..... but could there be improvements?

Would charging for a special Hullet pheasant licence improve the frequency and quantity of birds?

Would charging for specific weeks, improve the experience?
(Ex. Pelee Island.....1st Main Hunt, 2nd Main hunt, clean up)


Any suggestions?
I understand that this is run by mostly volunteers, money and sponsorship is very limited.
We are lucky to have it, but could it improve and bring in more revenue for the facility and for the town of Clinton?

The property was so well groomed, truly amazing....but, no birds.

I believe the best way to ensure you see birds would be the ability to release your own birds. Ever since they switched to a several interval release format its been feast or famine. I'd love the ability to purchase a couple of birds from a game farm and release them myself. Heck even chucker or if you can find 'em Hungarian partridge.
Paying someone else to do it for me doesn't sit all too well.

Anyone else have suggestions or feedback to offer?

Back when most of the townships had pheasant hunts/release programs birds were released at an earlier age so they had time to get used to the environment before they were hunted. This made the hunting tougher but the availability of birds after opening day was far better.
Then most districts went to weekly release programs and then to the shooting preserve style of release for individual hunters before most shut down.
Financing is the main issue as well as complaints from the surrounding population as the urban sprawl takes over the country.

ditto on what Tim has said. Your township licence help pay for birds along with the province matching the funds the township put up. Townships were also supported by local anglers and hunters groups that raised funds for the programs. Bird were released in most cases as pouts, became adjusted to the environment. Back then we did not have trespass problems as most rural folks knew the neighbor that was hunting.

We have been incorporated for over 20 years managing the business, property infrastructure, habitat etc. The pheasant program is a small part of what Hullett is but has a long standing tradition at the Hullett Provincial Wildlife Area (HPWA). As an organization realizing the importance of this program we are trying to keep it going.

FOH has visited the option of charging hunters for pheasant hunting many times but the MNRF will not allow us to do so. Therefore the "Pheasant Challenge" ticket raffle started as a means to fund the program. We spend over $11,000 a year of our annual budget releasing the birds. The Challenge brings in about $3000 profit each year and direct donations to the program from individuals about $800, this leaves a large shortfall on funds available to continue the program.

We do not spend that kind of money on other user groups such as waterfowl hunters, small game hunters, hikers, photo groups, deer hunters, school groups etc.

As finsfurfeathers has stated in this thread the hunting can be feast or famine with five 200 bird releases during the hunting season. We do not have the ability to release smaller amounts more frequently. Our workload with only 2 staff, many programs and a large property is overwhelming.

We are open to change in the program and perhaps the Hullett pheasant hunters could form a volunteer group that could address their concerns with the program?? This would take some effort planning and starting a new program or a variation of the current one.

As an example we have many hikers that help with the trails and waterfowl hunters that help with work in Zone A.

We have very few pheasant hunters that volunteer their time at the HPWA when compared to other user groups.

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Originally Posted by FOH

We have been incorporated for over 20 years managing the business, property infrastructure, habitat etc. The pheasant program is a small part of what Hullett is but has a long standing tradition at the Hullett Provincial Wildlife Area (HPWA). As an organization realizing the importance of this program we are trying to keep it going.

FOH has visited the option of charging hunters for pheasant hunting many times but the MNRF will not allow us to do so. Therefore the "Pheasant Challenge" ticket raffle started as a means to fund the program. We spend over $11,000 a year of our annual budget releasing the birds. The Challenge brings in about $3000 profit each year and direct donations to the program from individuals about $800, this leaves a large shortfall on funds available to continue the program.

We do not spend that kind of money on other user groups such as waterfowl hunters, small game hunters, hikers, photo groups, deer hunters, school groups etc.

As finsfurfeathers has stated in this thread the hunting can be feast or famine with five 200 bird releases during the hunting season. We do not have the ability to release smaller amounts more frequently. Our workload with only 2 staff, many programs and a large property is overwhelming.

We are open to change in the program and perhaps the Hullett pheasant hunters could form a volunteer group that could address their concerns with the program?? This would take some effort planning and starting a new program or a variation of the current one.

As an example we have many hikers that help with the trails and waterfowl hunters that help with work in Zone A.

We have very few pheasant hunters that volunteer their time at the HPWA when compared to other user groups.

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So if you are open to pheasant hunters helping themselves how about my suggestion of allowing hunters to release their own procured birds?
Granted those hunters would have to follow current hunting regulations.

What if the 5 release dates were scheduled and available to hunters if they purchased a Pheasant Challenge ticket? The purchase could be done online and the schedule would be sent in return. The cost of the Pheasant Challenge tickets could be raised, even doubled.
Less birds could be banded, for example 1 banded bird per release on a big rooster and the prizes could be slightly more substantial.
This way hunters could plan ahead and even schedule a few days off work to enjoy the hunt.
It could even boost the local economy in Clinton/Goderich etc....hunters could stay overnight a day or two at the local hotels.

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Originally Posted by finsfurfeathers

So if you are open to pheasant hunters helping themselves how about my suggestion of allowing hunters to release their own procured birds?
Granted those hunters would have to follow current hunting regulations.

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We are not law enforcement but do think that individuals are allowed to release their own birds (10 bird limit?) for training and hunting purposes...is this a fact?

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Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness

What if the 5 release dates were scheduled and available to hunters if they purchased a Pheasant Challenge ticket? The purchase could be done online and the schedule would be sent in return. The cost of the Pheasant Challenge tickets could be raised, even doubled.
Less birds could be banded, for example 1 banded bird per release on a big rooster and the prizes could be slightly more substantial.
This way hunters could plan ahead and even schedule a few days off work to enjoy the hunt.
It could even boost the local economy in Clinton/Goderich etc....hunters could stay overnight a day or two at the local hotels.

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It is nice to see some new ideas coming to the table!

Perhaps Hullett pheasant hunters could email us formal proposals that staff can present to the Board of Directors for discussion or present themselves in person at a monthly meeting.

One Pheasant Challenge Ticket could be $20, $30, even $50.
This would qualify the hunter to receive the committed release schedule.

Five roosters total for the season could be banded.
All five successful hunters receive a decent prize donated by a local sponsor.

At seasons end all five hunters names go into a draw for a substantial prize such as a mid grade shotgun and a guided waterfowl hunt.....for example.

Bird Quality could be a focus, less focus on quantity at first until funding improves.
Nice mature birds raised elsewhere that act wild, fly strong and naturally run and hide.
The result is more use out of each bird. A wary bird from good stock raised properly will flush strong often from a distance and run hard....offering a greater number of hunter encounters.
Hullet has the habitat to support smart birds throughout the hunting season.

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Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness

What if the 5 release dates were scheduled and available to hunters if they purchased a Pheasant Challenge ticket? The purchase could be done online and the schedule would be sent in return. The cost of the Pheasant Challenge tickets could be raised, even doubled.
Less birds could be banded, for example 1 banded bird per release on a big rooster and the prizes could be slightly more substantial.
This way hunters could plan ahead and even schedule a few days off work to enjoy the hunt.
It could even boost the local economy in Clinton/Goderich etc....hunters could stay overnight a day or two at the local hotels.

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Strongly not in favor with this as it'll turn it back into the mad rush to out do the other guy competition brings out the worst in people. Seems what you want is a private pheasant release and their already exist that think Exeter is a close one.

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Originally Posted by FOH

We are not law enforcement but do think that individuals are allowed to release their own birds (10 bird limit?) for training and hunting purposes...is this a fact?

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Trying to get confirmation on this. Private no problem can release up to 10 chucker or 10 pheasants without MNR permits but have to follow local hunting regulations. Contacted MNR vineland requesting permission/permit/ to release at Hullet they said it was up to Manager at Hullet tried to get confirmation from Hullet and they said it was up to MNR and around and around it went. Would be great if MNR and Hullet could get together and resolve this issue. That way nothing really has to change and there would be no increased cost administering any other option.
Basically those that measure a good hunt by the number of birds can release their own otherwise leave as.

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Originally Posted by finsfurfeathers

Strongly not in favor with this as it'll turn it back into the mad rush to out do the other guy competition brings out the worst in people. Seems what you want is a private pheasant release and their already exist that think Exeter is a close one.



Trying to get confirmation on this. Private no problem can release up to 10 chucker or 10 pheasants without MNR permits but have to follow local hunting regulations. Contacted MNR vineland requesting permission/permit/ to release at Hullet they said it was up to Manager at Hullet tried to get confirmation from Hullet and they said it was up to MNR and around and around it went. Would be great if MNR and Hullet could get together and resolve this issue. That way nothing really has to change and there would be no increased cost administering any other option.
Basically those that measure a good hunt by the number of birds can release their own otherwise leave as.

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Most pheasant hunters are very grateful to have an opportunity to hunt our large grassland landscape. What we hear all the time from them is that getting a bird or 2 is just a bonus but working their dogs is what they cherish at Hullett. As for quantity, Exeter Game farm is a good local place to hunt.

Maybe contacting a CO to find out if you can release your own birds (up to 10) at Hullett as in a private land situation will answer this question. We are reluctant to advise as as we are not law enforcement. We have also had trouble getting answers from Vineland in the past. If it is legal FOH would not have a problem with this. We often see chukars on the property but do not release any.

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Originally Posted by FOH

Most pheasant hunters are very grateful to have an opportunity to hunt our large grassland landscape. What we hear all the time from them is that getting a bird or 2 is just a bonus but working their dogs is what they cherish at Hullett.
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That's the reason I get up to Hullet dogs have enough room to work all day. Hard to get the same landscape hunting private.

That's why hey call it "hunting" if you want a guarantee go to a game farm. If it isn't broke don't mess with it.

We all love the pheasant hunting at Hullet, it’s an incredible landscape, dreamy pheasant habitat and so well groomed, we are Very appreciative.
Appreciation can only go so far.
We need to be responsible and look at improvements.
Specifically improvements that will bring better Funding.

Every year we hear that the pheasant release program is severely underfunded.

If it ain’t broke, don’t mess with it.
The current system is broke.
Broke by $7000 annually.

I have listed a few suggestions.
What are your suggestions?

Financial Report:Ryan reported that revenue is up, though we have a decrease in grants.Expenses are also up at this time.Our surplus is less this year, but healthy.There have been no major purchases.We are looking at some replacement of equipment. We expect an $8,000 -$9,000 deficit reduction.

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Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness

One Pheasant Challenge Ticket could be $20, $30, even $50.
This would qualify the hunter to receive the committed release schedule..

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So now someone knows the release schedule how are you going to keep him from telling 2 friends and they tell 2 friends and now you got A crush of people trying to beat the next guy to the released birds. How have you improved the experience? I just see over crowding issues.


[QUOTE=Five roosters total for the season could be banded.
All five successful hunters receive a decent prize donated by a local sponsor.

At seasons end all five hunters names go into a draw for a substantial prize such as a mid grade shotgun and a guided waterfowl hunt.....for example..[/QUOTE]

I don't hunt Hullet for prizes really do we want it to be a game show? Bottom line a ticket purchased is a pheasant released rather see the sponsors donate more pheasants and keep the prizes

[QUOTE=Bird Quality could be a focus, less focus on quantity at first until funding improves.
Nice mature birds raised elsewhere that act wild, fly strong and naturally run and hide.
The result is more use out of each bird. A wary bird from good stock raised properly will flush strong often from a distance and run hard....offering a greater number of hunter encounters.
Hullet has the habitat to support smart birds throughout the hunting season.[/QUOTE]

This one I really don't get your initial complaint was you didn't find pheasants when you were out so you want to put fewer birds?
Now if you said maybe a 2 limit on rooster and 0 hens that way you can spread out the birds amongst the hunters while still having hens to provide bird contacts, problem is administrative cost just sky rocketed
Again most cost effective way to guarantee bird contact big old sign posted BYOP...Bring your own pheasants or buy your tickets.

Open to all suggestions.
Not looking to agrue or be ridiculed.
Trying to brainstorm some ideas, if you have some ideas please post them. Thanks

How much does it cost to buy a farm raised bird? Lets say it's legal to release at hullett. How long between release and when you start your hunt? How about when your finishing a coffee before your hunt and another guy walks into the field and starts shooting "your" birds? Not his fault, it's public hunting.

Donations yes, personally releasing birds.....no!

Now if I could release rabbits, different story.. You can produce a lot more rabbits a year then Pheasants.

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Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness

Open to all suggestions.
Not looking to agrue or be ridiculed.
Trying to brainstorm some ideas, if you have some ideas please post them. Thanks

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Our suggestion would be for active Hullett pheasant hunters to volunteer some time organizing their ideas together to present to the Board of Directors for discussion.

Our Annual General Meeting (AGM) on Sunday May 24 2020 would be ideal situation to voice your ideas and allow the pheasant group over 6 months to prepare. You do not have to be a FOH member to attend this meeting as it is open to the public.

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Originally Posted by Mount Sweetness

Open to all suggestions.
Not looking to agrue or be ridiculed.
Trying to brainstorm some ideas, if you have some ideas please post them. Thanks

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Never meant for you to feel ridiculed however proposed changes need to be assessed for both pros and cons.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

How much does it cost to buy a farm raised bird? Lets say it's legal to release at hullett. How long between release and when you start your hunt? How about when your finishing a coffee before your hunt and another guy walks into the field and starts shooting "your" birds? Not his fault, it's public hunting.

Donations yes, personally releasing birds.....no!
.

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Its not one or the other but both. Hullet already has a no monopolization policy in the rules. Cost of the birds is irrelevant as all birds released are purchased.
In essence you have already paid for the birds as either you have purchased tickets or the actual bird. No different if you arrive at a lot have a coffee someone else enters lot and goes out in front of you.

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Originally Posted by finsfurfeathers

Its not one or the other but both. Hullet already has a no monopolization policy in the rules. Cost of the birds is irrelevant as all birds released are purchased.
In essence you have already paid for the birds as either you have purchased tickets or the actual bird. No different if you arrive at a lot have a coffee someone else enters lot and goes out in front of you.

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Not talking about rules, just asking how a person would feel if he and buddies put $200 in to birds( looked up price. About $25 a bird). They have just drove a few hours to Hullett, and now are watching someone else shooting the birds.
There may be a few "Hard Feeling". It's better to donate some dollars and no one "OWNS" any of the birds.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

Not talking about rules, just asking how a person would feel if he and buddies put $200 in to birds( looked up price. About $25 a bird). They have just drove a few hours to Hullett, and now are watching someone else shooting the birds.
There may be a few "Hard Feeling". It's better to donate some dollars and no one "OWNS" any of the birds.

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If one were to organize their own hunt I'm sure they would pick a midweek day when Hullet is a ghost town. Put out their birds and at least they know they hit a fresh release. For those that don't measure the quality of the hunt by the number of birds taken donate to the cause.

here's a thought release all pheasants prior too the 1st control deer season......lake effect snow shuts down the place by November

I think everyone is missing the point.
In the states money is available for the release of pheasants in Hullet like places.Here,the government would rather flush money down the toilet than see it used for hunting opportunities.Thats the point.No money,no funny. So enough with hitting your head against the proverbial wall ideas which require more support.
For Hullet to be a fun place to hunt rather than a good walk spoiled it must have pheasants.Pheasants come from dollars,and dollars will only come from people who are willing to trade those dollars for hunting opportunities. Which unfortunately for most, means that places like Hullet will be either be restricted to those willing to pay or close up and die. There is no middle ground.Hullet,tiny,conestoga ,luther etc.
Charge for a season permit to hunt all places ,put them all under the same umbrella.Use the money to raise and release pheasants.Those who are willing to pay will have fun,those who won't will not.The cost will be determined by three things
1.the amount of participants
2 The cost of raising and releasing the required amount of birds so people will encounter birds
3 the pitiful sum the government kicks in
I too have been to Hullet a few times over the years .Ate wild apples.Contrary to some have said,I dont need to drive to Hullett to have my dog run.

The business model for Hullet makes no sense any more. Unless they go to a user pay either a season pass or daily walk on fee it will gradually die. Nobody should be allowed to kill pheasants without paying. Being crown land people could still hunt grouse, wc , rabbits and waterfowl but a pheasant hunt is basically a put & take game farm scenario. It would be interesting to see credible stats of how many hunters or what proportion actually contribute to funding the birds. Nobody hunts pheasant on Pelee, or Conestoga or Tiny without paying.

I am not sure guys, but I think there is an historical charter agreement at Hullett that is unique that says they may not charge membership money for the pheasant program. That’s why the challenge tickets and dinner fundraiser/auction are so important. Problem is, lots of people don’t contribute, they just consume.

The cover there is fantastic. Scott has spelled it out diplomatically above. He needs more volunteers and more ways to stream in money. If the NWTF can raise tons of bucks from those dinners, why not us?

FWIW, I think they do a pretty good job given what they have to work with and the pheasant program, which is important to me, is just a fraction of what goes on up there.

I haven’t really looked into how they do it. But the province of Alberta releases 28,000 pheasants yearly on public lands for hunting.

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Originally Posted by finsfurfeathers

In essence you have already paid for the birds as either you have purchased tickets or the actual bird. No different if you arrive at a lot have a coffee someone else enters lot and goes out in front of you.

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What if the guy who goes in the lot before you takes the coffee you just bought without paying for it?

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Originally Posted by dilly

What if the guy who goes in the lot before you takes the coffee you just bought without paying for it?

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Unfortunately, I guess some people find that to be acceptable.

to hunt pheasants in today's era in Ontario one must pay to play, simple fact. The days of the fifties and sixty's are long gone when a township licences were required to hunt, monies from the township licences , plus monies from local hunting clubs (most non existent today) would be match dollar for dollar by the province to put pheasants in that township. That was also the day when a farmer could trust a hunter, one could hunt on his land with a simple asking and a hand shake. There is still one area in Ontario that releases pheasants by purchasing county licence. Even that program has struggled with reduced hunters purchasing licences , increased cost of purchasing pheasants, reducing the annual amount of birds being released. That program works on volunteers releasing birds, and many thanks to them.
I chuckled at the statement about Alberta and pheasants. It is not generally know but the Calgary Chapter of Pheasants Forever is the largest fund raising chapter within Pheasants Forever. Oil , ranchers and business talk. Brooks Alberta is a flagship habitat restoration of Pheasants Forever. It is misfortune that Pheasants Forever chapters in Ontario and for that the balance of Canada have failed. The Ruff Grouse Chapters that exist will have the same fatality without government support. Any program today will need to be a pay to play.