Opinions on big bore levers wanted

Hi Folks

While I’ve owned a bunch of levers I have never owned a 45-70.

What is the best one out there for function and accuracy?

I am hoping for sub MOA.

I bought a Marlin 1895 in .45/70 Gov (Remington built 2016) that had topnotch workmanship for fit and finish. It worked flawlessly giving 2MOA @ 100M with open sights using Hornady LeveRevolution 325g ballistic tip. I lent it to a buddy that fell in love with it and ended up selling it to him. I've regretted it ever since,but,my rack is now full or I'd consider buying another in a heartbeat.

That’s helpful. Do you believe with a scope it could have achieved sub MOA?

It sounds picky but I detest inaccurate rifles.

The 24" tube MarlinXLR rifles with Ballard rifling have a reputation of excellent accuracy. Not sure they still produce them anymore though.

Big Jack, I have more or less the same rifle as Trimmer had but mine has a Williams peep and firesight front. I've shot 1.5 MOA with Remington 405 grain, but I haven't ever tried a scope on it. At 60 bucks a box for ammo, I'm just shooting to ensure hunting accuracy, not the smallest groups I can get. I'm pretty sure with some load tinkering and a good scope it would shoot MOA or less. You're welcome to try it out before you buy if you're interested. We're not far away from each other.

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Originally Posted by Big Jack

That’s helpful. Do you believe with a scope it could have achieved sub MOA?

It sounds picky but I detest inaccurate rifles.

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I didn't try it with a scope. That caliber comes with a bit of recoil swat much like a 12ga. I put a Bushnell TR-25 red dot on it just for shytes and giggles without adverse affects,but,I found the open sights worked just as well. Using the red dot made my sight line higher which made me lift my head accentuating the recoil,so,I took it off. I doubt pin-point accuracy can be achieved with that caliber because it's a big,heavy round with ballistics being a kissin' cousin to a 20 ga slug. Someone who's a crack shot might be able to come very close,though.

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I didn't try it with a scope. That caliber comes with a bit of recoil swat much like a 12ga. I put a Bushnell TR-25 red dot on it just for shytes and giggles without adverse affects,but,I found the open sights worked just as well. Using the red dot made my sight line higher which made me lift my head accentuating the recoil,so,I took it off. I doubt pin-point accuracy can be achieved with that caliber because it's a big,heavy round with ballistics being a kissin' cousin to a 20 ga slug. Someone who's a crack shot might be able to come very close,though.

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Hey Trimmer, the factory 405 grain Core Lokts have a similar recoil to a 30-30. I've shot Hornady and Federal factory loads as well (which indeed had stout recoil), but the 405's were the most accurate and the most comfortable.

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Originally Posted by GW11

Big Jack, I have more or less the same rifle as Trimmer had but mine has a Williams peep and firesight front. I've shot 1.5 MOA with Remington 405 grain, but I haven't ever tried a scope on it. At 60 bucks a box for ammo, I'm just shooting to ensure hunting accuracy, not the smallest groups I can get. I'm pretty sure with some load tinkering and a good scope it would shoot MOA or less. You're welcome to try it out before you buy if you're interested. We're not far away from each other.

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Thank you sir - the offer is appreciated. Have you saved your brass? I know it is expensive feeding it factory ammo but my plan is to load. I am a bit of a pill hoarder - I have hundreds of .458 laying around!

Let me know if you wish to hit the range and work up a load. Then we load all your empties and you are good for a while.

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

I didn't try it with a scope. That caliber comes with a bit of recoil swat much like a 12ga. I put a Bushnell TR-25 red dot on it just for shytes and giggles without adverse affects,but,I found the open sights worked just as well. Using the red dot made my sight line higher which made me lift my head accentuating the recoil,so,I took it off. I doubt pin-point accuracy can be achieved with that caliber because it's a big,heavy round with ballistics being a kissin' cousin to a 20 ga slug. Someone who's a crack shot might be able to come very close,though.

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I’m hoping it will be a cat compared to the 458 ML. I also have molds for 458.

Thanks for the info!

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Originally Posted by canadaman30

The 24" tube MarlinXLR rifles with Ballard rifling have a reputation of excellent accuracy. Not sure they still produce them anymore though.

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I wonder are these the JM stamped barrels?

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Originally Posted by Big Jack

Thank you sir - the offer is appreciated. Have you saved your brass? I know it is expensive feeding it factory ammo but my plan is to load. I am a bit of a pill hoarder - I have hundreds of .458 laying around!

Let me know if you wish to hit the range and work up a load. Then we load all your empties and you are good for a while.



I’m hoping it will be a cat compared to the 458 ML. I also have molds for 458.

Thanks for the info!

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I did save all my brass so far. My understanding is the Hornady is a little shorter than the rest though, so I'm not sure if it's usable. I'll PM you from here out and we'll figure out a range day.

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Originally Posted by Big Jack

I wonder are these the JM stamped barrels?

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I believe they are, but I do know the new factory makes or made the xlr in 30-30, not sure about the bigbores

I've got the 24" XLR .45-70. Only have open sights on it. It's got the ballard rifling and works well with 325 grain Hornady's. But I really bought it for the 405 grain loads and accuracy seems to be a problem with it.

These rifles come in both JM stamped and Remington junk versions. I have the Remington junk version and would recommend you avoid them. They are not very nice. Problems with poor fitting sights. The action is not very smooth. It seems to shoot okay though - with the 325's. Both the .444 and .45-70 XLR are out of production now.

Oh - and they are very very heavy. Not suited to a "carry in the bush all day" sort of hunting. I don't like slings, but have a sling on this one.

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Originally Posted by werner.reiche

Oh - and they are very very heavy. Not suited to a "carry in the bush all day" sort of hunting. I don't like slings, but have a sling on this one.

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A sling on a lever gun just seems wrong, I put one on my 30-30 due to sheer convenience when hiking a lot in big bush but it seems very wrong.

Well my new to me 45-70 JM stamped Marlin is home now. I will shoot FTX 325’s but have hard casted 323GN bullets from an LBT mold. Gas checks will be used along with powder coating.

I expect to achieve full power loads with these cast bullets but will see!

The fellow I bought the gun from has sold me his set up for the 45-70. I’ll post some results once I get to the range.

Thanks for everyone’s responses.

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Originally Posted by Big Jack

Well my new to me 45-70 JM stamped Marlin is home now. I will shoot FTX 325’s but have hard casted 323GN bullets from an LBT mold. Gas checks will be used along with powder coating.

I expect to achieve full power loads with these cast bullets but will see!

The fellow I bought the gun from has sold me his set up for the 45-70. I’ll post some results once I get to the range.

Thanks for everyone’s responses.

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Congrats! Did you end up with a Guide Gun or the 22" barrel?

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Thanks!
Ended up with the 22” on purpose.
Start powder coating the cast bullets tomorrow hopefully.

I have an 1895CB and it is capable of MOA off the bench.
Attachment 39465

Attachment 39466

The bullets were individually weighed out to 403 gn. The powder was individually weighed as well right down to the kernel.

Big Jack,

Welcome to the 45-70 family. I have a old Marlin 1895. It is a tack driver.

Do you have microgroove or ballard rifling in your new rifle?

I also have a Marlin in a 375 Win with microgroove rifling and I find cast bullets need to be way oversized for good accuracy. It does shoot them well though.

I

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Originally Posted by huntaway

I have an 1895CB and it is capable of MOA off the bench.
Attachment 39465


Attachment 39466

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That’s some good shooting!

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Originally Posted by Muskyhunter

Big Jack,

Welcome to the 45-70 family. I have a old Marlin 1895. It is a tack driver.

Do you have microgroove or ballard rifling in your new rifle?

I also have a Marlin in a 375 Win with microgroove rifling and I find cast bullets need to be way oversized for good accuracy. It does shoot them well though.

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Not sure - is there an easy way to tell?

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Originally Posted by Big Jack

I

That’s some good shooting!



Not sure - is there an easy way to tell?

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Easy peasy.
Just look at the muzzle end of the bore in good light. Does it look like there are a dozen rifling grooves? That's microgroove.
If it looks like 4 or 5 grooves, that's Ballard.

I've never owned a .45-70, but did own an older .444 that was likely MOA capable. I shot 1.5 MOA groups easily with a 2.5X scope.
Wish I still had that rifle, but the present owner wants to keep it, I think.

Thanks KC, I’ll take a look in the morning. Pretty sure it’s Ballard though.

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Originally Posted by Kilo Charlie

Easy peasy.
Just look at the muzzle end of the bore in good light. Does it look like there are a dozen rifling grooves? That's microgroove.
If it looks like 4 or 5 grooves, that's Ballard.

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Likely ballard rifling. My JM 1895 in 450 marlin was not a microgroove.

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Originally Posted by Kilo Charlie

I've never owned a .45-70, but did own an older .444 that was likely MOA capable. I shot 1.5 MOA groups easily with a 2.5X scope.
Wish I still had that rifle, but the present owner wants to keep it, I think.

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It has open sights on it now. My daughter got her license and will be using it this fall.
It is a very nice rifle.

45/70 Gov sure puts a smack down on 325 lb. Blackies. Just sayin'...........

Mine is a micro groove.

Any of you big bore guys shot 40-72 WCF ? I think it was a Winchester 1895 lever that was chambered for them.

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Any of you big bore guys shot 40-72 WCF ? I think it was a Winchester 1895 lever that was chambered for them.

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Haven't shot one, but yes, the .40-72 (and .38-72_ were 1895 Winchester chambering.
The .40-82 was a Model 1886 and Model 1885 chambering. An 1886 or Marlin 1895 in .40-82 is my most-wanted bucket-list rifle.

I wound up getting some 40-60 rounds on Switzers last auction. They had them listed as 45-70 but obviously made a mistake.
Weird looking round

Well the micro groove 45-70 did not disappoint. Hand loaded 325 FTX were just over an inch with the loads I made up. Some of my powder coated cast were about that as well.

Over all quite pleased!