Covid numbers vs deaths, interesting..........

Just sharing something I found really weird/interesting when I was looking a little closer at the covid numbers ............ Unless my math is wrong the Canadian death rate compared to the US is more than double............

As of today...................If these numbers are right........

US...... 4.54 million cases with 154,00 deaths put that at a 3.4% death rate....

Canada...... 116,000 cases with 8,917 deaths puts that at a 7.6% death rate......

I wonder why/how that is..... Stats, (numbers) sometimes can be used to get in the way to the truth?

https://www.google.com/search?q=cana...hrome&ie=UTF-8

I heard that US hospitals get $3300 for each covid death. One woman said her son died of motorcycle accident massive head injury . Cause of death covid.

Any thing to make Trump look bad

They're testing more people, 172000 tests/million people in the US vs 110000 tests/million people in Canada. That wouldn't be enough to skew the numbers to that extent though. If you're identifying a bunch of positive cases in a low risk group, that would change things. We did a lot of testing in LTC homes, and we know how things went there.



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Canada has 38 mil people.USA has 330 mil people.
.116 mil VS 4.5 mil is
0.3% infected in Canada vs 1.4 % of population infected in the USA.
That is good for Canada

Death rate OF THE INFECTED is better for the USA.

WHO KNOWS ?

As someone mentioned-everything to make Trump look bad,everything can be PROVEN by Statistics,and HOW we can compare their testing(quality-frequency-detection-etc)vs Canadian testing.We can not.


Lots of murky waters around COVID.

One day in the future (if we live long enough) we may know the real truth about 2020.
Until then-i believe,COVID situation is very "fluid",everyone involved looks at it the way it suits their agenda/goals or fears.

It hit our elderly hard. A lot of the positive tests in the states are from younger people who have a higher survival rate.


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Originally Posted by Saskfly

It hit our elderly hard. A lot of the positive tests in the states are from younger people who have a higher survival rate.


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This could be......makes sense so far

News was saying today 83% of newly infected in Toronto are Blacks

from protests ?

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Originally Posted by js4fn

News was saying today 83% of newly infected in Toronto are Blacks

from protests ?

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Wouldn't surprise me along with the others that just have to party and get close like sardines.

I posted this same link in the mask thread. As of May 25, Long Term Care homes accounted for as much as 81% of Canadas fatalities

https://www.cihi.ca/en/new-analysis-...m-care-impacts

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Originally Posted by js4fn

I heard that US hospitals get $3300 for each covid death. One woman said her son died of motorcycle accident massive head injury . Cause of death covid.

Any thing to make Trump look bad

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The number I heard was $40,000 for a Covid related diagnosis under the DRG (Diagnosis Related Group). So I looked it up and for a Covid related diagnosis where a ventilator is required the lump sum payment to the hospital is actually $39,000. This from USA Today. "Hospital administrators might well want to see COVID-19 attached to a discharge summary or a death certificate. Why? Because if it's a straightforward, garden-variety pneumonia that a person is admitted to the hospital for – if they're Medicare – typically, the diagnosis-related group lump sum payment would be $5,000. But if it's COVID-19 pneumonia, then it's $13,000, and if that COVID-19 pneumonia patient ends up on a ventilator, it goes up to $39,000."
Prices are crazy in the states. I was talking to a local lady whose daughter lives in the states. Her husband is in the military so costs are covered but they still receive the invoice. She just had a baby and the invoice from the hospital was $22,000.

As for any of the other numbers out there relating to cases, deaths etc I don't believe any of them at this point, far too many numbers being skewed to suit their agenda of fear.

I read a story on this topic a few weeks ago, it was reported that Canada’s high Covid death rate was due to the better health care here and as a result many elderly people were hanging on where elsewhere in the world they would died before Covid

Who gets sick does play a huge role but the US has been adding 60000 cases a day for the last month or so as their numbers exploded. Deaths lag the infection rate. Of course you have to also take the politics of the numbers into consideration as well.

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Originally Posted by fratri

Just sharing something I found really weird/interesting when I was looking a little closer at the covid numbers ............ Unless my math is wrong the Canadian death rate compared to the US is more than double............

As of today...................If these numbers are right........

US...... 4.54 million cases with 154,00 deaths put that at a 3.4% death rate....

Canada...... 116,000 cases with 8,917 deaths puts that at a 7.6% death rate......

I wonder why/how that is..... Stats, (numbers) sometimes can be used to get in the way to the truth?

https://www.google.com/search?q=cana...hrome&ie=UTF-8

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From these numbers, I see 2x more deaths per capita in the US then Canada when you just go with total population vs total deaths.
John

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Originally Posted by 73hunter

I read a story on this topic a few weeks ago, it was reported that Canada’s high Covid death rate was due to the better health care here and as a result many elderly people were hanging on where elsewhere in the world they would died before Covid

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Sorry,not challenging,but the number of infected is way less in Canada,but the death rate in the infected is way higher then in the USA.So how that support the claim of our superior health system(as they claim).
Look at Italy for comparison of living long life too.Whole lot of elderly died there-how did they survived that long ,to die from COVID?

How some reports come up with conclusion like that is beyond me.Either they have an agenda ,or they are clueless.

This may be the result of Canadians reducing the community transmission by actually taking COVID-19 seriously and not acting like a gang of star-spangled goofs.

Deaths per 1 million people
Canada: 236
USA: 469

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

The numbers being referred from are reported cases. There's now over 4 million south of the border. The real number of infected is far greater.

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Originally Posted by canadaman30

The numbers being referred from are reported cases. There's now over 4 million south of the border. The real number of infected is far greater.

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Yep. Here's an interesting study that was just done in Alberta. It suggests the real infection numbers there were about 4x what was reported.

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...sting-suggests




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Originally Posted by canadaman30

The numbers being referred from are reported cases. There's now over 4 million south of the border. The real number of infected is far greater.

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Right on

If you want to calculate a true mortality rate you would have to take into account everyone that has had or currently has COVID. That includes everyone who has recovered as well as all the asymptomatic people that were never tested or known.

The death rates in the OP are very far from reality and the true mortality rate is actually much lower. If you then take out all the the shady COVID deaths then the mortality rate drops even more.

COVID is not out of control, but the media's reporting of it is.

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Originally Posted by Jakezilla

Right on

If you want to calculate a true mortality rate you would have to take into account everyone that has had or currently has COVID. That includes everyone who has recovered as well as all the asymptomatic people that were never tested or known.

The death rates in the OP are very far from reality and the true mortality rate is actually much lower. If you then take out all the the shady COVID deaths then the mortality rate drops even more.

COVID is not out of control, but the media's reporting of it is.

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Yes the true number of positive cases is definitely higher....... But............It would be the same for any illness, (or past pandemic) not all cases get documented.
Going with these current numbers available, covid is worse than the common flu and the Canadian death rate (percent) seems high....

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Originally Posted by GW11

Yep. Here's an interesting study that was just done in Alberta. It suggests the real infection numbers there were about 4x what was reported.

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...sting-suggests




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Yes 3-4X more sounds about right. Sadly the younger generation are not going to help, the young party goers are going to spread it around with their lack of respect for any kind of distancing and gatherings...

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Originally Posted by fratri

Yes the true number of positive cases is definitely higher....... But............It would be the same for any illness, (or past pandemic) not all cases get documented.
Going with these current numbers available, covid is worse than the common flu and the Canadian death rate (percent) seems high....

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The Canadian death rate seem high compared to what? You can't compare it to the US or any other population unless you have an equal percentage of the population tested in each country.

Raise the testing rate in Canada and that death rate will drop like a stone.

Lets compare apples to apples and look at the FLU using the same method as the COVID numbers.

I couldn't find the flu deaths for this year but the flu cases for 2019-2020 season are 42537 based on laboratory testing (IPAC Infection Prevention and Control Canada) https://ipac-canada.org/influenza-resources.php. Average flu deaths per year in Canada as per Public Health Agency of Canada are 3500. https://www.myhealthunit.ca/en/healt...llet-2-eng.pdf

This gives a mortality of 8.22%

COVID - Canada...... 116,000 cases with 8,917 deaths puts that at a 7.6% death rate......
Flu Canada 42537 cases with 3500 deaths equals 8.22% death rate.

By this metric the Flu is deadlier than COVID

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Originally Posted by Jakezilla

The Canadian death rate seem high compared to what? You can't compare it to the US or any other population unless you have an equal percentage of the population tested in each country.

Raise the testing rate in Canada and that death rate will drop like a stone.

Lets compare apples to apples and look at the FLU using the same method as the COVID numbers.

I couldn't find the flu deaths for this year but the flu cases for 2019-2020 season are 42537 based on laboratory testing (IPAC Infection Prevention and Control Canada) https://ipac-canada.org/influenza-resources.php. Average flu deaths per year in Canada as per Public Health Agency of Canada are 3500. https://www.myhealthunit.ca/en/healt...llet-2-eng.pdf

This gives a mortality of 8.22%

COVID - Canada...... 116,000 cases with 8,917 deaths puts that at a 7.6% death rate......
Flu Canada 42537 cases with 3500 deaths equals 8.22% death rate.

By this metric the Flu is deadlier than COVID

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Stats, you got to love them.......

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Originally Posted by fratri

Stats, you got to love them.......

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Yep....figures fool when fools figure.

If the public and the politicians would stop eating up the fear the media is peddling we could put this behind us and get on with our lives.

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Originally Posted by Jakezilla

.

If the public and the politicians would stop eating up the fear the media is peddling we could put this behind us and get on with our lives.

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No wiser words said about COVID for a very LONG time.....thank You for that.

Like the Americans did in May?

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Originally Posted by js4fn

News was saying today 83% of newly infected in Toronto are Blacks

from protests ?

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There is a prevailing theory that people with a deficiency of Vitamin D are more susceptible. That doesn’t mean vitamin D prevents infection but that it reduces the symptoms.

Black people in Northern climates have a significantly higher risk of vitamin D deficiency because we normally use sunlight to make it. Light skin can make it easier than dark skin.

In the UK when adjusted for socio-economic factors black people were twice as likely to become sick with Covid19 so it seems to be that vitamin D is key.

But currently this is a hypothesis that is being studied.


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Well this is the time to move outta the city if you choose too. The calm before the storm if anyone thinks the first lockdown was bad ,the second wave will be much worse. This is the safest we have been since December and anyone who may of had it in December is almost due again to catch it.

September will be bad when the kids go back to school. We will be keeping our kids home for the first month to see how it goes first.

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Another lockdown could spell disaster for some countries and governments could fall. Or we may have a bunch of vaccines available soon, all use at own risk...lol

They are twisting the numbers on the liberal news.. The number of cases per 100,000 is in fact lowest in the states.

They all point to Sweden as a glowing example on how to do things, but they have a rate of 56 per 100,000 and the US is only 48 per 100,000. The number of cases in the states is higher, but they have a population many times larger then Sweden...but don't let fact get in the way.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

They are twisting the numbers on the liberal news.. The number of cases per 100,000 is in fact lowest in the states.


They all point to Sweden as a glowing example on how to do things, but they have a rate of 56 per 100,000 and the US is only 48 per 100,000. The number of cases in the states is higher, but they have a population many times larger then Sweden...but don't let fact get in the way.

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Absolute crap. The US numbers are some of the worst in the world per capita period, and for a first world country with access to some of the best research and medical facilities their numbers are downright criminal. No one with any intelligence has pointed to Sweden as a glowing example (sure, compared to the other dumpster fires in the Europe it may not look as bad, but it's not glowing). Single source information will make you look like a fool every time.

Africa is get hit hard right now I think I heard yesterday that is the new epicenter .

Even Australia is getting hit hard now they were good, many places are going back into lockdown and curfews

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Originally Posted by kickingfrog

Absolute crap. The US numbers are some of the worst in the world per capita period, and for a first world country with access to some of the best research and medical facilities their numbers are downright criminal. No one with any intelligence has pointed to Sweden as a glowing example (sure, compared to the other dumpster fires in the Europe it may not look as bad, but it's not glowing). Single source information will make you look like a fool every time.

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Name your sources..

I hear Democrats politicians and reports on outlets like CNN, CBS, and others talking about how great Sweden is doing...

Name your sources...

Kicking frog....here is an example of how you can use Stats...

The Average University Student walks 900 Miles a year on Campus.

The Average University Student drinks 22 gallons of beer a year. ( About 8 beer a week ).

That means that the Average University Student gets 40.9 MPG.....meaning they are pretty fuel efficient .

My brother was telling me how the calculated death rate is ridiculous.....He was telling me that even though the cause of death was unrelated to covid but the individual did have covid, covid was ruled as the cause of death even if it wasn't the actual cause of death.... I took what my brother was so adamant about with a grain of salt until I seen this..... How Accurate is Covid-19 Data? It is an Ontario Covid briefing.... pay attention to the answer from our Health Minister... starts are 1:30 mark....

https://www.facebook.com/FearlessOnt...ref=nf&__xts__

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

As of today:

USA
Cases per million: 14,584
Deaths per million: 479
New cases: 16,339

Sweden:
Cases per million: 8,017
Deaths per million: 568
New cases: 43

The U.S.A's population is 33 times larger than Sweden but America's new case increase is 380 times that of Sweden's.

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Originally Posted by Snowwalker

Name your sources..

I hear Democrats politicians and reports on outlets like CNN, CBS, and others talking about how great Sweden is doing...

Name your sources...

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You don't "hear" anything and certainly haven't learned anything.

Source your bat crap crazy info.

You aren't interested in facts and sources and I've long since stopped. I'll only bother to occasionally point out lies and dung on the off chance someone else reading thinks there is a shred of truth in it.

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

As of today:

USA
Cases per million: 14,584
Deaths per million: 479
New cases: 16,339

Sweden:
Cases per million: 8,017
Deaths per million: 568
New cases: 43

The U.S.A's population is 33 times larger than Sweden but America's new case increase is 380 times that of Sweden's.

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Well at least you have some stats..
The death rate is lower in your example.
There is also two question ..
1) How many died with vs died from?

2) Is the daily esting rate similar?

One thing is sure it will take years if not decades to fully understand the events of 2020.

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Originally Posted by kickingfrog

You don't "hear" anything and certainly haven't learned anything.

Source your bat crap crazy info.

You aren't interested in facts and sources and I've long since stopped. I'll only bother to occasionally point out lies and dung on the off chance someone else reading thinks there is a shred of truth in it.

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You are saying your only purpose is to posy a message and shout lier lier.

Go away Kyle.

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Originally Posted by kickingfrog

Absolute crap. The US numbers are some of the worst in the world per capita period, and for a first world country with access to some of the best research and medical facilities their numbers are downright criminal. No one with any intelligence has pointed to Sweden as a glowing example (sure, compared to the other dumpster fires in the Europe it may not look as bad, but it's not glowing). Single source information will make you look like a fool every time.

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If you want to have an honest discussion you need to provide sources to counter information you don't agree with.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

As of today:

USA
Cases per million: 14,584
Deaths per million: 479
New cases: 16,339

Sweden:
Cases per million: 8,017
Deaths per million: 568
New cases: 43

The U.S.A's population is 33 times larger than Sweden but America's new case increase is 380 times that of Sweden's.

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So the US has a higher case rate than Sweden but fewer deaths per million. Are you trying to say that Covid isn't as bad as the media and politicians would have us believe?

What is the difference in percentage of population tested between Sweden and the US? More tests equal more cases.

US population 329,227,746
Sweden population 10,343,403

Covid Tests
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ies-worldwide/
Sweden 810,356
US 59,935,508

The US has performed 73x more tests. More tests = more cases

Percentage of population tested

Sweden 7.8%
US 18.2%

If you look at Fratri's post above and consider how they code Covid deaths, the same goes for tests. If the same person is tested 5 times and is positive each time that is counted as 5 cases. Also remember that when the hospitials opened back up for elective surgeries everyone that came in was tested - more tests = more cases.

As for the 380x increase in new cases. If the US has upped its testing and Sweden has lowered it than the US would definitely have more new cases.

US tests for Aug 2 2020 725,902
https://covidtracking.com/data/us-daily

I couldn't find the daily testing rate for Sweden an equviliant number of tests in Sweden would be 22,805.

As far as new cases in sweden go Aug 1st 297 new cases, Aug 2nd 37 new cases
https://www.worldometers.info/corona...ountry/sweden/

The 297 is more indicative of the last week in Sweden so lets us it.

US 725,902 tests 14,458 new cases = 2% positive

Sweden 22,805 tests 297 new cases = 1.3% positive

Not that big of a difference.

Comparing Sweden and America's COVID performance is an argument over which dung pile smells worse.

What is relevant however is that Sweden and most of the developed world is getting better while America is getting worse.

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

Comparing Sweden and America's COVID performance is an argument over which dung pile smells worse.

What is relevant however is that Sweden and most of the developed world is getting better while America is getting worse.

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Prove it....show us some numbers.

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Originally Posted by Jakezilla

Prove it....show us some numbers.

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Right here. Americas cases and deaths are increasing compared to other developed countries.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

I think we can discuss and show numbers and studies till the cows have been home for hours. There will not likely be much truth and way too much Bias in anything seen for a long time.

People that research and prepare the statistical data for us, can shape and mold the numbers like a potter does clay.

Just look at my statistical data on the fuel economy of the average university student..

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

Right here. Americas cases and deaths are increasing compared to other developed countries.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

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BRAZIL and India have higher death rates then the states. ALSO the states has done just under 61 MILLION tests, were as BRAZIL in second had done just over 12 million.

Lots of variables.

On a side note...I still have Antibodies and they are still collecting my plasma. I hope they can use it to help people..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

Right here. Americas cases and deaths are increasing compared to other developed countries.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

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America's cases and new deaths are higher than other developed countries but you can't separate these numbers from the testing rate. The US is testing much more than anyone else (China doesn't count) more testing = more cases = more recorded COVID deaths.

Lets take a look at deaths/million which is probably a better look at how the US is doing overall compared to other countries

Lets look at G7 countries ranked by deaths/million population

UK 680/million
Italy 582/million
US 480/million
France 464/million
Canada 237/million
Germany 110/million
Japan 8/million

The US is not the worst by this metric it's in the middle with France

Lets look at other first world nations that are doing worse than the US

Belgium 849/million
Spain 609/million
Sweden 568/million

Other countries doing worse than the US

Peru 613/million
Chile 513/million

This is assuming that all countries are coding the Covid deaths the same. There is plenty of information available showing that the US is padding their death count.

Lets also look at death rate. This is number of confirmed cases divided by number of deaths per country.

The linked graph has UK, Italy, France, Belgium at #2,3,4, Canada at #10 and the US at #46.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...tes-worldwide/

I would argue that the new cases and new deaths may be rising but it is partially a function of the testing and overall the US is not doing that bad when compared to other developed countries using various metrics.

At the end of the day the numbers can be put together to support any narrative you wish but the large majority of evidence will show this is overblown. There is plenty of evidence out there that this is not something that young healthy people should be worried about. We should be protecting the vulnerable, going about our lives and building herd immunity. There is a cure for this, hydroxychloroquine and the accompanying drugs, we don't need a vaccine to go back to normal life. Stop buying into the media fear and BS.

Quote:

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Lets look at other first world nations that are doing worse than the US

Belgium 849/million
Spain 609/million
Sweden 568/million

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They were doing worse but are getting better. The stats show America is moving in the other direction.

The thing whit the COVID is that they can throw lots of dirt on Trump.Statistics is an easy way to show how bad it is-even when it is not.

He is by far not the vises statesman USA ever had(at least Public speaking/Public relations wise)but the media and politics make the world believe he is the worst of the worst.............

Compare total population stats against deaths - that is the number. It is more like .002% death.

South Africa has a bit bigger of a population than Canada. A few weeks ago they were seeing 8 to 12 thousand new cases a day . Their population is 58 million.

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And probably fuelled by poverty. Which is a very significant factor when considering the effectiveness of a countrys reaction to Covid.

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Originally Posted by sawbill

And probably fuelled by poverty. Which is a very significant factor when considering the effectiveness of a countrys reaction to Covid.

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Yep the us has about 40 million in poverty

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by js4fn

I heard that US hospitals get $3300 for each covid death. One woman said her son died of motorcycle accident massive head injury . Cause of death covid.

Any thing to make Trump look bad

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That doesn't make sense ... that would mean the US deaths would be double the Canadian deaths ... it's the other way around.

I believe the real reason is the US is testing like crazy, and they are reporting the true infection amount. Whereas Canada had a REALLY SLOW start (remember Ontario was only testing like 1000 people a day in the beginning?), and so the number of COVID cases in Canada is much higher than what we reported (many people had it but were not diagnosed).

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Originally Posted by MarkB

That doesn't make sense ... that would mean the US deaths would be double the Canadian deaths ... it's the other way around.

I believe the real reason is the US is testing like crazy, and they are reporting the true infection amount. Whereas Canada had a REALLY SLOW start (remember Ontario was only testing like 1000 people a day in the beginning?), and so the number of COVID cases in Canada is much higher than what we reported (many people had it but were not diagnosed).

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It was stated in an article I read that Canada is about 4 to 5 times higher than the original count.

Cant rule out the possibility of the December bug being covid that has never really been talked about. From my experience I maybe a long hauler my symptoms persisted for months. I went to the hospital on the 16th of December I still felt it the beginning of March. I found some photos from 7th of December of the kids snowmobiling I was to sick to even care for a sled ride I didn't have the power to even get on the sled never mind ride it. I love the first snowfall and I should of been all over the sleds they are new and fast on fresh snow lol. It messed up my first ice time and I never miss these opportunities.

Ps I dont ever go to the hospital unless I may die or bleed to death [emoji1787]. Anything under 3 or 4 stitches can be fixed from home [emoji106]

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I was in hospital yesterday to get 3 stitches. Why didn’t you tell me your a medic. Made me get for X-ray told them it wasn’t broke. Nurse answer We don’t care what you think

Sat for two hours asked for stapler. Doc showed right up

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Originally Posted by fishfood

It was stated in an article I read that Canada is about 4 to 5 times higher than the original count.

Cant rule out the possibility of the December bug being covid that has never really been talked about. From my experience I maybe a long hauler my symptoms persisted for months. I went to the hospital on the 16th of December I still felt it the beginning of March. I found some photos from 7th of December of the kids snowmobiling I was to sick to even care for a sled ride I didn't have the power to even get on the sled never mind ride it. I love the first snowfall and I should of been all over the sleds they are new and fast on fresh snow lol. It messed up my first ice time and I never miss these opportunities.

Ps I dont ever go to the hospital unless I may die or bleed to death [emoji1787]. Anything under 3 or 4 stitches can be fixed from home [emoji106]

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Yup, I know a few people that were pretty sick in Jan ... my son was ... he was wiped out. Didn't go to the hospital ... but was it COVID. He was tested a month ago because he freaked out due to a sneeze that was persistent ... he was negative ... but I don't think that means he didn't have it in Jan and is now immune.

In the US,government funding is predicated on the number of tests being done.....more tests=more funding. That's the way their system works. Without positive results,tests are deemed to be not needed which leads to a decrease in funding. It's not rocket science to figure out that negative tests cause loss of funding,therefore,there's a tremendous impetus to make sure there's lots of positive tests. It's also not rocket science to understand how numbers will get "fudged" to further an agenda,but,no matter what,it always comes back to the money. It's the American way. That,too,is how the system works. People aren't stupid and can figure this out themselves. Is it really any wonder why people aren't trusting the stats?