Scrapping Reg 274 - Aligning teachers unions to reality

Finally......we have a government (Conservative) that has stood up to the teachers union and has scrapped their long time policy to hire teachers by tenure vs by merit. By doing this we are ensuring we are getting the best, brightest and most up to date teaching professionals in front of our children. This will also reward those teachers that go above and beyond on the job by coaching sports, mentor clubs/activities or extra curricular activities.

So if you thought you were tired of the teachers union attack ad's just hold on to your hat.....you have seen nothing yet - LOL.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...-274-1.5763203

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Originally Posted by 410001661

Finally......we have a government (Conservative) that has stood up to the teachers union and has scrapped their long time policy to hire teachers by tenure vs by merit. By doing this we are ensuring we are getting the best, brightest and most up to date teaching professionals in front of our children. This will also reward those teachers that go above and beyond on the job by coaching sports, mentor clubs/activities or extra curricular activities.

So if you thought you were tired of the teachers union attack ad's just hold on to your hat.....you have seen nothing yet - LOL.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...-274-1.5763203

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I have to agree with you this move was long overdue,some of these teachers have been double dipping for years and leaving no room for newly qualified teachers.My daughter got a double major at York with Deans Honours and wanted to get into teaching,closed shop.
Doug Ford has really pleasantly surprised me and has been doing a pretty good job with the Covid response and his daily briefings are great.

Have the unions said anything yet? So far it doesn't seem so. My guess is these are the "small movements by both sides behind closed doors" that I mentioned in the other thread.

Im thinking the unions have agreed to not make a fuss over the removal of regulation 274 and in the meantime the Ford government will quietly hire more teachers, seeing as they can now hire by merit.

Just a guess, but silence from the unions would indicate they got something in the deal. An attack on seniority is something the unions would be quite vocal about in a hurry, and so far not a thing has been said.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

The way I read it is........................... Principals can now override the system and give jobs to their friends, family members and "yes" people without any blowback..

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass, unless you are standing on the other side.... everyone has a take on it, and this one of them....

Seniority losses, friends win

Was it not long ago that the provincial government was asking - pleading ,retirees to return to the classroom? I will guess that most retired teachers had many years of seniority. Should that fact be ignored by the board and the teachers? Why would any teacher come back when the board says ,that your seniority doesn’t count, we alone will decide where you go to teach.

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Originally Posted by fratri

The way I read it is........................... Principals can now override the system and give jobs to their friends, family members and "yes" people without any blowback..

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass, unless you are standing on the other side.... everyone has a take on it, and this one of them....

Seniority losses, friends win

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Or because of their colour. That is how they are going to make the teachers at a particular school, reflect the makeup of the students. The government itself , has said that is part of the plan. Teachers will be moved from one school to another, because of the colour of their skin. ' We need 6 more black teachers at school X, so we have to move 6 white teachers somewhere else'. No matter their seniority..... Fair?

I see that happen more often in Union shops. For example Moose Head Breweries in Saint John NB, Unless you have family in the union there is not a chance you can get in.

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Originally Posted by fratri

The way I read it is........................... Principals can now override the system and give jobs to their friends, family members and "yes" people without any blowback..

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass, unless you are standing on the other side.... everyone has a take on it, and this one of them....

Seniority losses, friends win

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Because many teachers were refusing to work as they think their so special over anyone else.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Was it not long ago that the provincial government was asking - pleading ,retirees to return to the classroom? I will guess that most retired teachers had many years of seniority. Should that fact be ignored by the board and the teachers? Why would any teacher come back when the board says ,that your seniority doesn’t count, we alone will decide where you go to teach.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Was it not long ago that the provincial government was asking - pleading ,retirees to return to the classroom? I will guess that most retired teachers had many years of seniority. Should that fact be ignored by the board and the teachers? Why would any teacher come back when the board says ,that your seniority doesn’t count, we alone will decide where you go to teach.

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With everything going on (COVID and the new on-line/classroom learning curriculum) on why would the principal want a bunch of dinosaurs back in the system? One of the intrinsic benefits of a long tenure should be knowledge. If someone has been teaching for 20 years and cannot out perform someone that has been teaching for 5 then shame on them............that is the merit system.

You want teachers that are there outside of the classroom to coach sports, organize clubs, and take part in extra curricular activities because we all know there is more to the education experience than the classroom.

Teachers that have not kept up with technology are effectively rendered obsolete. If they cannot set up and run an effective lesson via Zoom, MS Teams or manage lessons and homework via the cloud they are obsolete. Just like in the private sector, why do you want to hire people that are there to do the bare min and just get by and collect a pay cheque. Do you know what happens to people like that? They get severed from the herd and get packaged out to make way for more productive people and/or more knowledgeable people.

GW. You keep saying the same things over and over. Both of your statements are wrong.. Without tangible proof of such , it is only your opinion.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Or because of their colour. That is how they are going to make the teachers at a particular school, reflect the makeup of the students. The government itself , has said that is part of the plan. Teachers will be moved from one school to another, because of the colour of their skin. ' We need 6 more black teachers at school X, so we have to move 6 white teachers somewhere else'. No matter their seniority..... Fair?

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LOL........coming from you that is rich! You tell me......that is a Liberal doctrine

41... How or why, would you expect someone retired from their profession for numerous years, ( my wife is friends with a teacher, that retired 14 years ago, who got the call requesting her return to class, my wife has only been retired for 7 years so that call was expected.), to have kept up with todays teaching methods or computer learning , no matter their seniority?

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Originally Posted by 410001661

LOL........coming from you that is rich! You tell me......that is a Liberal doctrine

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Yet it is being pushed by the provincial conservative government. Please explain.

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Originally Posted by fratri

The way I read it is........................... Principals can now override the system and give jobs to their friends, family members and "yes" people without any blowback..

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass, unless you are standing on the other side.... everyone has a take on it, and this one of them....

Seniority losses, friends win

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The union will still be there..any hanky panky in the hiring will draw grievances...Principles don't hire persay (maybe final word) but the selection process involves others.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

GW. You keep saying the same things over and over. Both of your statements are wrong.. Without tangible proof of such , it is only your opinion.

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Lmao most on here would make the exact same comment about you fish. Keep trying.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

41... How or why, would you expect someone retired from their profession for numerous years, ( my wife is friends with a teacher, that retired 14 years ago, who got the call requesting her return to class, my wife has only been retired for 7 years so that call was expected.), to have kept up with todays teaching methods or computer learning , no matter their seniority?

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I'm not saying she has to keep up.........but if she wants to keep teaching she needs to show her value. I could care less if she taught for 40 years, if she does not know what the cloud is or how to do a Zoom call she is obsolete and now will be able to enjoy her retirement while giving someone else that chance to show their merit.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Yet it is being pushed by the provincial conservative government. Please explain.

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I can explain it to you but I can't make you understand.......let that rattle around a bit - LOL

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Originally Posted by fratri

The way I read it is........................... Principals can now override the system and give jobs to their friends, family members and "yes" people without any blowback..

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass, unless you are standing on the other side.... everyone has a take on it, and this one of them....

Seniority losses, friends win

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I agree.
Regulation 274 was created for a reason.

So is yours. By the way do you think you will ever ever contribute something useful to this forum. Like usual your Trolling. Pretty much everyone on here agrees with that.

I lived in NB I know what is required to get in there.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

GW. You keep saying the same things over and over. Both of your statements are wrong.. Without tangible proof of such , it is only your opinion.

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Originally Posted by greatwhite

Because many teachers were refusing to work as they think their so special over anyone else.

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The teachers in my family all went to work ....no one refusing anything.....working every day! Where do you keep finding this BS....no one thinks they're special....other than perhaps you

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

41... How or why, would you expect someone retired from their profession for numerous years, ( my wife is friends with a teacher, that retired 14 years ago, who got the call requesting her return to class, my wife has only been retired for 7 years so that call was expected.), to have kept up with todays teaching methods or computer learning , no matter their seniority?

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There is an old saying, "those than can do, those that can't teach".........I am not saying that there is any truth to it but there is a reason why it is an old saying?

From the news

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Originally Posted by krakadawn

The teachers in my family all went to work ....no one refusing anything.....working every day! Where do you keep finding this BS....no one thinks they're special....other than perhaps you

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Or because of their colour. That is how they are going to make the teachers at a particular school, reflect the makeup of the students. The government itself , has said that is part of the plan. Teachers will be moved from one school to another, because of the colour of their skin. ' We need 6 more black teachers at school X, so we have to move 6 white teachers somewhere else'. No matter their seniority..... Fair?

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I don't think that theory would work why are we going to divide them when there is already so much race ?
They should be mixed in amongst all the school's not seperate them by color that's so racist lol.

That's why the century old battle continues to this day .



Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

So only unions can do the Job??? That is a Laugh. Good One.

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Originally Posted by fishermccann

Or because of their colour. That is how they are going to make the teachers at a particular school, reflect the makeup of the students. The government itself , has said that is part of the plan. Teachers will be moved from one school to another, because of the colour of their skin. ' We need 6 more black teachers at school X, so we have to move 6 white teachers somewhere else'. No matter their seniority..... Fair?

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Originally Posted by 410001661

I'm not saying she has to keep up.........but if she wants to keep teaching she needs to show her value. I could care less if she taught for 40 years, if she does not know what the cloud is or how to do a Zoom call she is obsolete and now will be able to enjoy her retirement while giving someone else that chance to show their merit.

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41, that's a reasonable assessment of the situation. This situation would apply to a retiree of any occupation.....correct? If you wish to return to the work place be sure you are current.

Glad to see you felt it was ok for her to stay retired and enjoy her retirement. I mention that because in the previous thread a number of posts berated those who were retired for not answering the call and returning to work.

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Originally Posted by MikePal

The union will still be there..any hanky panky in the hiring will draw grievances...Principles don't hire persay (maybe final word) but the selection process involves others.

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Unions are there for their Members. Unless teachers unions differ from others and retirees still pay dues and are members while retired, your no longer a member and only working members get represented. You can't grieve squat when your not a member..

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Originally Posted by fratri

I guess it's always greener on the other side of the grass

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Not sure what you mean by that. There's dirt on the other side of the grass.

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Originally Posted by TroutSlayer

Not sure what you mean by that. There's dirt on the other side of the grass.

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Ya, my bad, it should have read, greener on the other side of the fence :)

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Originally Posted by krakadawn

41, that's a reasonable assessment of the situation. This situation would apply to a retiree of any occupation.....correct? If you wish to return to the work place be sure you are current.

Glad to see you felt it was ok for her to stay retired and enjoy her retirement. I mention that because in the previous thread a number of posts berated those who were retired for not answering the call and returning to work.

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The issue with these topics is there is no absolutism - we all have friends or family that do not fit this mold or description. On the other hand we see something reported in the news that teachers do not want to go back to work because of COVID - it could be just a handful of teachers expressing these concerns but because of the deplorable quality of our news feeds we never know how the true facts behind that statement.

We need to understand that if something is said about a group of people there will always be those that do not reflect that statement. So when we discuss or debate a topic you cannot say I know a teacher that.....bla, bla, bla and your statement is incorrect. As with statistics you cannot use one data point, that is an outlier, to disprove a theory.