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Thread: Ottawa Eyes Tougher Screening of Gun Owners for Mental Health, Violence

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilroy View Post
    Having been a one of the first Provincially appointed local firearms officers I can tell you both this. An applicant can honestly apply for a PAL and self declare he/she has a history of mental illness. An applicant can apply and simply lie on this question and not declare a history.
    If an applicant lies and the firearms officer uncovers the lie either through an arrest under the mental health act or a reference tells the officer, that is where the problem,s begin.If you find the applicants Doctor or Psychiatrist and ask for the required information,your not going to get it and they will quote the privacy act.Medical records are private, so an investigator would then have to apply for a search warrant for the records.
    The bottom line is an investigator must prove the applicant is "a danger to themselves or others". There is no mandatory law in place right now that I am aware of that "compels a Doctor or Psychiatrist or Psychologist to reveal this concern to the police.

    What we need is this to be changed in such a way that the reporting is mandatory,but as most mental Health Act,s are Provincial I cannot see this happening.Do mentally unstable people apply for firearms licenses YES. Do they lie in applications YES.

    For an investigator a mentally ill person who has NOT been reported in an arrest,or other incident where the police are called,they are free right now to apply for firearms licenses and simply lie on the application. I think a lot of people over estimate how much power the police actually possess to get their job done.
    Exactly....and until a FIP hit was generated, these individuals were not detected. They have eliminated the AFO and PFO positions now, so a good start would be adequate funding to allow more and better investigations into applicants.

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  3. #22
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    Absolutely nothing to do with immigration. I mean, look at these lists. A more representative sampling of Ottawa's population you could never get. It's just as the Assistant RCMP Commissioner said about the Toronto 18: "They represent the broad strata of society." Indeed.

    http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-...list-of-the-24
    http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-...emain-unsolved
    I'm all for chopping government. I've even built a guillotine.

  4. #23
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    Nope, gang affiliation is not a race issue...

    Toronto police officials said about 40 percent of gang shootings in the city occur in the Toronto neighborhood where Somalis reside.

    “We have issues with regards to gang members, drug trade, poverty, lack of opportunity, lack of recreational facilities, inadequate … housing. We have issues with families themselves and the culture that is brought into the community,” Toronto police Superintendent Mario Di Tommaso told VOA.

    Di Tommaso said the gangs in Toronto, including those within the Somali community, are based on race, gender and ethnicity.
    https://www.voanews.com/a/canada-som...s/4111976.html
    Last edited by MikePal; March 8th, 2018 at 06:41 PM.

  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilroy View Post
    I agree and there are some Psychiatrists who will not write a letter for an investigator to use in court or give an opinion either way.
    There is also the fact, depression is not an automatic cause for a person to harm themself or others.

    One person only gets a 3.9 grade point and is depressed and no matter what people say that person loses it.
    The next person loses their whole family in one car crash, is very very upset, and has depression, but any idea of hurting themself is totally beyond them.

    How do you tell them apart. Do you send in the cops to take their guns? One you may save the other your just rubbing salt in the wound by treating them like a criminial.

    The dumbest question a medical person can ask is "Have you every thought about killing yourself?". Well not really till you asked that dumb question. They never ask what a person thinks/feels about suicide.
    Take the warning labels off. Darwin will solve the problem.

  6. #25
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    If your Dr knows you are a gun owner and feels you are a risk do to depression for example I believed they are required by law to notify the Police.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilroy View Post
    Having been a one of the first Provincially appointed local firearms officers I can tell you both this. An applicant can honestly apply for a PAL and self declare he/she has a history of mental illness. An applicant can apply and simply lie on this question and not declare a history.
    If an applicant lies and the firearms officer uncovers the lie either through an arrest under the mental health act or a reference tells the officer, that is where the problem,s begin.If you find the applicants Doctor or Psychiatrist and ask for the required information,your not going to get it and they will quote the privacy act.Medical records are private, so an investigator would then have to apply for a search warrant for the records.
    The bottom line is an investigator must prove the applicant is "a danger to themselves or others". There is no mandatory law in place right now that I am aware of that "compels a Doctor or Psychiatrist or Psychologist to reveal this concern to the police.

    What we need is this to be changed in such a way that the reporting is mandatory,but as most mental Health Act,s are Provincial I cannot see this happening.Do mentally unstable people apply for firearms licenses YES. Do they lie in applications YES.

    For an investigator a mentally ill person who has NOT been reported in an arrest,or other incident where the police are called,they are free right now to apply for firearms licenses and simply lie on the application. I think a lot of people over estimate how much power the police actually possess to get their job done.

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwhite View Post
    If your Dr knows you are a gun owner and feels you are a risk do to depression for example I believed they are required by law to notify the Police.
    No.

    Which is pretty amazing considering they are required to notify the MOT if you might have an issue with your driving.

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by welsh View Post
    Not sure who these people were who said the Liberals weren't going to do anything.

    Anyway, the Liberals are continuing to promise to do what they promised to do in 2015, with no action yet.

    The only change from their 2015 campaign promises is hinted at in a recent iPolitics report that said Goodale had indicated the upcoming legislation would not require dealers to keep point of sale records, as promised. But iPolitics has since updated that article, so whether they are still promising to do that is unclear.

    Incidentally, the claim that gang activity is an immigration problem is false. Gangs arise in marginalized communities, and immigrant communities tend to be marginalized. But we also see gangs in nonimmigrant marginalized communities. The lowest common denominator is marginalization.

    Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk
    Welsh,

    Where is the marginalization coming from?Who do you think is doing this?


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  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigTurk View Post
    Welsh,

    Where is the marginalization coming from?Who do you think is doing this?


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    Nobody is doing this, per se. Somebody is always going to be marginalized, which is why there have always been gangs.

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  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by welsh View Post
    Nobody is doing this, per se. Somebody is always going to be marginalized, which is why there have always been gangs.

    Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
    Typically, these are first generation Canadians. I would bet that these are children of those who fled Somalia in the 80s/90s. It has happened since the 1800s and is highly predictable. Those with the least resources and supports, are the most marginalized
    Last edited by Freeburn; March 15th, 2018 at 03:59 PM.

  11. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by mosquito View Post
    Liberal's defining mental health.... what can go wrong....
    https://i.cbc.ca/1.3668898.146791259...e-20160703.jpg

    and violence ...
    http://torontosun.com/2017/03/03/tru...7-5676e9736bc1
    https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle35581403/


    What could go wrong .... just look how well they manage the economy (tax increases), environment (Montreal sewage), deficit (over 3X more than they promised) and youth programs (excluding those that think the murder of unborn is a bad thing) ....etc. Maybe a correct thinking test... those that can balance a budget not allowed? .... or like their budget I wonder what else they will try and sneak in at the back of the document ...
    Those liberal idiots couldn't organize a one-car funeral and they're planning on mass discrimination against a segment of society violating their privacy rights on the off-chance someone might be depressed? You're absolutely right. What could possibly go wrong?
    Society needs to stop bending to the will of the delusional.

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