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Thread: fishing/hunting economics

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikePal View Post
    Being generous with those numbers, the Hunting/Fishing/Sport Shooting community ( knowing there is a lot of overlap) amount to about 3% of the population from coast to coast. Our voices are 'whispers' in the grander scheme.



    The money generated by our activities are equally spread from coast to coast and amounts to peanuts generated for the operations of the Ministry's across the country.

    Hunters especially have very little meaningful public support by the general population so our demands/needs go largely ignored outside the MNR activities.
    Quote Originally Posted by MikePal View Post
    From Government stats...

    So if we look at firearm ownership as a common thread between Hunters/Trappers and Sportshooters and that most of these same people are also Fisherman.... 3 million civilians that own firearms amount to only 3% of the population (37 million) of Canada.

    The GunBlog suggest that civilian firearm ownership is over 2.2 million, or 6% of the population of Canada...

    https://thegunblog.ca/facts-stats/
    I understand what you are saying now but twice 3% was used as a reference for 3 million of 37 million and then others were working with it.

    What is a city in your example? If it is 3% of city dwellers, what is it for rural? There are what 5-6 million people in the gta. Three percent of 4.4 million (adult pop) is 132 thousand. The study lists Ontario with 369,430 sport shooters.
    Make sure you have finished speaking before your audience has finished listening.

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  3. #22
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    [QUOTE=MikePal;1091992]Like Fox is driving at....the largest voting base that decides who wins are in the cities....and as the government stats indicate, only 2.8 % of the population inside major centers own firearms. Few under the age of 18 own firearms, so the number is still 3%. MP-5:30 pm,today/QUOTE]
    Being generous with those numbers, the Hunting/Fishing/Sport Shooting community ( knowing there is a lot of overlap) amount to about 3% of the population from coast to coast. Our voices are 'whispers' in the grander scheme.(MP-3:27 am,today)


    Hi MikePal-not challenging but the numbers seems to migrate from coast to coast(from morning today til few hrs ago)to "inside major centers"......not that it actually changes our status,just saying........sure way to loose is, to loose hope in victory(NAH,we can not make it ,it is too few of us-so why try???).
    Why look and present the numbers in a way to loose hope???
    Last edited by gbk; September 13th, 2019 at 10:14 PM.

  4. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampsinger View Post
    . Its time we changed our ways, we should be able to punch above our weight, if we have the will to do so. Its time for the OFAH and local clubs like Grenville Fish and Game to take a more active role in influencing government policy makers. Why not make "politics 101" or how to approach your mp or mpp part of the hunters education course.
    If we don't speak up for or actively promote ourselves, there are some who will happily do it for us and our privileges will disappear bit by bit guaranteed.
    Mike Pal-this!!!

  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickingfrog View Post
    I understand what you are saying now but twice 3% was used as a reference for 3 million of 37 million and then others were working with it.

    What is a city in your example? If it is 3% of city dwellers, what is it for rural? There are what 5-6 million people in the gta. Three percent of 4.4 million (adult pop) is 132 thousand. The study lists Ontario with 369,430 sport shooters.
    You are getting lost in the numbers....the quote from the government statistic that I posted earlier is clear...

    Overall, surveys suggest that more people in rural areas own firearms than in urban locations. For example, 37.3 percent of respondents from small towns own a firearm compared to 2.8 percent in communities with populations over one million
    The smallest representation is in the centers with the greatest voting block.
    Arte et marte (By Skill and by Fighting)...The RCEME motto

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampsinger View Post
    Ok spin the numbers, do we out number the hard core antis? Can we do a much better job of influencing the general public and policy makers?
    I think the last time Firearms banded together to show our strength was the rally on Parliament Hill back in Sept 98. It garnered in the neighbourhood of 10,000 people. It didn't stop the Gun Registry from being put in place by the knee jerk actions of the Liberal government back then. But it did show politicians there was anger over it and the Conservatives used that garner votes in the next election. Was it ultimately a successful protest ? Hard to say....the main issue that seemed to sway the general public against the registry was the cost overruns not the act itself.

    Our strength lies within the Ministry of Natural resources. Getting more involved in the EBR process and letting them know what we want. We have had some success controlling what becomes law, but for the most part our voices go unheard even there..ie the moose hunt.

    The fact that we can get our voices heard at all thru the various organizations that speak for us (CCFR,NFA OFAH) is largely because there are few, if any, organized groups opposing us. The general population is rather apathetic when it comes to issues that affect as, neither support or oppose.

    Sunday Hunting is a good example, when the OFAH goes in to fight for the right to hunt on Sundays a township there is often only a handfull of locals, (in one case only 6 people showed up) to oppose the motion. So we have pretty good success in those cases.
    Last edited by MikePal; September 14th, 2019 at 04:25 AM.
    Arte et marte (By Skill and by Fighting)...The RCEME motto

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbk View Post
    Why look and present the numbers in a way to loose hope???
    It's hard to accept that what we have as a passion goes almost unnoticed by the general public. Our actions however do often come under scrutiny. A great deal of us are tone deaf to how they will be received by the general public when pictures and videos get posted, especially on social media. We are our our own worst enemies at times.

    That picture of the dentist that shot Cycle the lion is etched in the minds of a lot of people who would otherwise have not given us a second thought.

    Or the numbnuts that posted the video of the grizzly rolling down the side of the mountain staining the snow red. That garnered the attention of the general pubic, so much so, that it was instrumental in the bear hunt being cancelled in that province.

    We may not need the acceptance of the general public, but we most assuredly don't need their wrath.
    Last edited by MikePal; September 14th, 2019 at 04:26 AM.
    Arte et marte (By Skill and by Fighting)...The RCEME motto

  8. #27
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    The "small game" EBR from a couple of years ago and its subsequent implementation into the regulations is a typical example of how the antis mopped the floor with us. That ebr brought big changes to small game hunters under the guise of streamlining. Part of that ebr had changes that included the elimination of the harvesting of snapping turtles. The antis were all over the turtle angle much like shooting lions and grizzly bears.
    I investigated the numbers pertaining to the responses and the actual responses that I had access too. Thru the ebr process I had access to over 12,000 responses. 11,000 of the responses were against the the harvesting of snapping turtles the majority of those were anonymous form letters from you know who. The remaining responses had various concerns regarding reduced hunting opportunities, but no focused objections. I will tip my hat to the bird dog gang, from what I could determine they had a coherent response to the ebr, with aprox. 300 responses. That garnered them modest concessions.
    At the end of the process the MNRF can proudly say the vast majority of the public are in favor of the ebr.

    This also is a double edged sword because we as hunters did not respond, the MNRF will assume we did not object or didn't care. They will use that as justification to further their agenda. Quietly going about business and trying not to bother any one is no longer good enough.

  9. #28
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    In retrospect should amend my earlier comment; the general public used to be apathetic towards us as a group, but the recent firearms related events have sure put, at least Sports shooters (Hand gun and AR 15 owners etc), in an unfavorable light. Not sure how strong it is in Canada,I guess we'll see if it is a 'hot' topic raised during the election.
    Arte et marte (By Skill and by Fighting)...The RCEME motto

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