Gerald Stanley Trial

[Fox]

I think you're mistaken in your post? I believe most Canadians do in fact feel the need to have a way to protect themselves. Unfortunately for us, the law prevents it. There's a difference?

Do you honestly feel that you need a loaded gun beside your bed because someone will come through the door?

I want honesty here, do you NEED a LOADED gun beside your bed because someone WILL come through the door?

If you do then maybe you need to find a new place to live. I have lived in some sketchy areas in Ottawa and never once felt that I had to worry about a home invasion. I was never involved in any criminal activity and never had any inkling that someone was going to come into my home in the dark to hurt me and my family.

I have family in the US and the Canadians are not in fear but the Americans they married or are friends with seem to live in fear 100% of the time, similar to Joe's opinion. The suburbs of small town Florida is no more dangerous than the suburbs in any SW Ontario town.

[anonymoose]

So I will chime now. The simple fact is causation, if they had not trespassed on the property, tried to steal, and endanger the family members Stanley would have no defence. Defence of property is illegal in CANADA, SC ruled on this in 1985. The weighted value of life, was more than property possessions. Now in this case because his wife was there one minute and after he came out with the pistol, she was gone and they had smashed into the family car and thought his wife was trapped. That raised the issue of self-defence and justified the "accidental" shooting when he reached into the car.

Joe PA, is correct and absolutely right about Property and the relation to property crimes since 1985. Since 1985, because of the SC ruling it has become illegal (SC Ruling), to defend or protect property in Canada, now what did this do over the next 2.5 generations since then, it signalled property owners have no rights to stop criminals from taking your property. The kids know there is no consequences for property crimes. It is also down the point where your whole house can be cleaned...all you get is a police report #...no investigation. Heck most of you are thinking this is OK, but, have posted on stolen cameras, tree stands and frustrations with trespassers. It's those same people that trespass who know little or nothing can be done and they know the courts have almost chance to prosecute these crimes, or those that are caught have little effect.

The other point that came from this ruling, it also allowed criminals to then sue homeowners over excessive force when protecting property. Happens all the time, and is legal because if you defend your (property), you are breaking the law and SC ruling. You know what I am saying, because you all have seen and commented on these cases.

This is the problem with perception of property crimes in the eyes of criminals and lawyers.

Property owners have no rights. You only have limited rights to self-defence, and only with certain limits you must comply law during any events that occur and it must be reasonable, which are usually fast moving and reactionary in nature. Anyone fighting for your life, does not take the time to think what is reasonable in these situations.

All these rights we think we have, and those that say….just try and steal my TV..I will beat the #### out them. If you do, you will go to jail, and more than likely be sued as well.

So, Yes Joe Pa, I agree 100% with your view. Why, because of how limited or non-existent our rights are in Canada. Yes I believe we should have the right to defend up to and including deadly force to protect your property and life. Does that mean any single one of you in Canada on this forum...would pull out a gun and shoot someone for stepping on your property..NO. I believe 100% would not and neither would I. However, if you pull out a gun and do this now...good chance you will be charged if no "threat to life" is present and you admit to police you did bye-bye guns. Even if the criminal states this...you could be in trouble as a licenced firearms owner.

I had more rights to self-defence in actions overseas, then I do at home. What the heck was defending..when we don't have the same rights at home..we are sent to defend..Freedoms...Democracy.

If the laws changed overnight and people had this right, the overnight perceptions would over property crimes and it would have an impact..if the criminals believed everyone had a legal right to defend property.

Mark, it sounds like you have made a very good case for emigration.

I live in Canada where life is more valuable than property. Those that believe otherwise are welcome to find jurisdiction better suited to their beliefs!

If you think its worth it to kill someone for trying to take your stuff, you should google "insurance". Lots of peace of mind without all the trouble and court costs. Sure, you pay up front, but knowing I don't have to get in a gun fight if someone wants my stuff is a lot of peace of mind. Look into it - you'll be surprised what you learn. Lots of people already have it!

[jaycee]

Do you honestly feel that you need a loaded gun beside your bed because someone will come through the door?

I want honesty here, do you NEED a LOADED gun beside your bed because someone WILL come through the door?

If you do then maybe you need to find a new place to live. I have lived in some sketchy areas in Ottawa and never once felt that I had to worry about a home invasion. I was never involved in any criminal activity and never had any inkling that someone was going to come into my home in the dark to hurt me and my family.

I have family in the US and the Canadians are not in fear but the Americans they married or are friends with seem to live in fear 100% of the time, similar to Joe's opinion. The suburbs of small town Florida is no more dangerous than the suburbs in any SW Ontario town.

I guess things must be different in Manitoba , The Gerald Stanley Trial , which is the original Topic of Discussion , they are also "Canadians "

[Bushmoose]

Do you honestly feel that you need a loaded gun beside your bed because someone will come through the door?

I want honesty here, do you NEED a LOADED gun beside your bed because someone WILL come through the door?

If you do then maybe you need to find a new place to live. I have lived in some sketchy areas in Ottawa and never once felt that I had to worry about a home invasion. I was never involved in any criminal activity and never had any inkling that someone was going to come into my home in the dark to hurt me and my family.

I have family in the US and the Canadians are not in fear but the Americans they married or are friends with seem to live in fear 100% of the time, similar to Joe's opinion. The suburbs of small town Florida is no more dangerous than the suburbs in any SW Ontario town.

Fox, in my post I mentioned nothing about a "loaded firearm" beside the bed? I merely pointed out that I believe most Canadians would prefer to have the option to defend themselves, but are unable to legally? You're jumping to conclusions of what I said.

[Fox]

Fox, in my post I mentioned nothing about a "loaded firearm" beside the bed? I merely pointed out that I believe most Canadians would prefer to have the option to defend themselves, but are unable to legally? You're jumping to conclusions of what I said.

You always have the option to defend yourself.

It is the consequences of your actions that you have to deal with, as with every decision in life.

If you are at the point where you actually feel that you need to kill someone to save your life or someone in your family then going to court is now minimal.

I hate that comment about right to defend, you look at places like Florida and they kill old men standing on their lawn unarmed and it is considered justified.

Bushmoose, you never answered my question, do you NEED a LOADED gun beside your bed because someone WILL come through the door?

This is what I have been told in the US where they have these types of laws.

If you just say that Canadians would prefer to have the option to defend themselves, what in your opinion does this actually entail? Are you allowed to go and get your gun and shoot someone coming into your home with a gun? Are you allowed to go get your gun and shoot someone breaking into your truck? Are you allowed to go get your gun and shoot someone standing in your yard?

I love that I do not fear for my life on a daily basis.

[mpsmyth6]

I like the quote "Everybody is scared of being called a racist, but we don’t have a race problem — we have a crime problem here."
http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/...men-enter-land

[Bluebulldog]

Even in 2016, the witnesses for the Crown couldn't get their stories straight....

Any wonder why he was acquitted? The lies, and perjury went far worse from there.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskat...rald-1.4520214

[JoePa]

Fox maybe you have lived a sheltered life and that is why you think the way you do - if it was that safe up there why do cops and game wardens carry firearms - a lot depends where you live and how much you travel around - I'm sure most people go through life and never experience an incident where they need a gun but some have - it only takes that one time - I would much rather carry a gun and never need it than to need one and not have one - in my lifetime I have had two occasions when I was glad that I had a gun - what is the big deal of letting law abiding citizens from carry a gun anyway -

[Bushmoose]

Bushmoose, you never answered my question, do you NEED a LOADED gun beside your bed because someone WILL come through the door?

Nope, I didn't. My original post didn't bring that up, you did. Besides, you didn't pay the $10 to have the argument, so I'm not going argue?😆

[trimmer21]

Fox, in my post I mentioned nothing about a "loaded firearm" beside the bed? I merely pointed out that I believe most Canadians would prefer to have the option to defend themselves, but are unable to legally? You're jumping to conclusions of what I said.

Just to be clear,it is NOT illegal to defend yourself or loved ones. Canadians are absolutely justified in using deadly force to do so,too. The only difference is that all responses to aggression must be proportional to the threat level. Positions that self-defense is illegal is extremely inaccurate.