Carbon Tax increases NOT put on hold

[fishermccann]

Best post of the month, Congrats

From two victims of Dunning- Kruger. That’s priceless.

[fishfood]

It's ok we are heading for a great crash everything is going to come tumbling down.

Hold on its going to be a very bumpy ride .

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[Gilroy]

What portion of infrastructure does small town Ontario pay?

I have a daughter who just built a home on Brant Street north of Dundas Street in Burlington.

Dundas Street is the original military trial from Toronto to Niagara. So a mile north of the OLDEST road in Ontario and they still
do not have a natural gas line. LOL

They ran natural gas from Belleville to Madoc over a decade ago, stopped in Madoc with a population of 2076.

Bancroft with double that population and more than triple in the summer is still on Propane?

Infrastructure is a joke, they have been trying to re build a bridge over the Crowe River south of Glen Alda for over 2 years,
detour in place all that time and no work done on it for over year. Nothing.

[JBen]

You don't get it do you?

Who paid for the Welland Canal Gilroy? And as a result, what did that lead to?
Who paid for Pearson Intl.....and as a result.........
Who paid to fill in the "Harbour" lands about 100 years ago...And what did that lead to. Aside from terra firma for the Sky dome and CN tower....
Who paid for the busiest highway in N. America and all the commerce that today, paid for your high paying job...
and on
and on
and on

[MarkB]

I saw a graph yesterday showing the top 10 percent pollute way more then the poor.

The top ten percent usually have more cars bigger houses to heat ,take trips travel more frequently .






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That's likely true ... although the rich will use the best materials in their houses, and those houses will be WAY more efficient than middle class houses. One of our previous directors had a house so air tight, he had to pump air into their home for risk of low oxygen. He also had a large hydroponic facility in his basement to convert CO2 back to O2 ... so the house was far, far, far more sustainable and environmentally friendly than any other one I know.

The other issue is, that top 10% is contributing heavily to the economy. Should we tell them to live in smaller homes, buy fewer houses, and stop travelling? What happens to GDP then, if they don't spend their money? I personally think there's a lot of people on the "let's fix the environment" bandwagon, who will quickly change their tune when they are threatened with losing their job/livelihood as a result. In the end, I agree that the principle of environmental sustainability is important ... but we do have to balance it with other important issues. The fact is, being human and living on this planet will leave our mark on the environment ... no way around that ... you just want to get rid of the areas of insane wastage. For instance, burning fossil fuels to make power is just WRONG. No need for it with today's technology.

[JBen]

I would widen that to the top 20%. And again the law of averages. Some in the top 20% will be extremely green, with geo thermal heat and solar rooves, some will be gluttons and slobs. The majority likely drive trucks and hummers, have six 60 inch TVs, half a dozen tablets, and stereos, industrial size fridges and stoves. Some will eat left overs, most wont. Some will compost, some wont. etc, etc, etc,

[JBen]

With respect to "the city". And food for thought.
Would it not have made more sense for Kingston Ont......Or even Montreal....
Back in the late eighties I was doing FX for TD bank. The exodus of corporate headquarters and people out of Mtl/Que was fairly large. Meach Lake and separation......
If I recall my history lessons correctly, was a time Upper and Lower Canada fought for......

If you build it, they will come....
/looks around the rest of Ontario.....
*********************************************

Mark, with respect to GDP and what not.
How's our economy doing today? treading water ( the top 10% spending oodles, I doubt their spending habits have changed a heck of a lot), or hemorraging because the 60-70% are getting kicking in the gonads.

Worded differently.
1 person spends $10
10 people spend $1
??????

is the economy today treading water because the all big companies are having banner years, or doing ok.
or is it hemorrhaging because sooooooooooooooooo many small companies are going under?

[MarkB]

https://youtu.be/wjomWSjU2PM


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He's 100% right. But here's what I think ... this is a way for the Liberals to stay in power. You see the Conservative platform is to grow business and increase that revenue via GDP growth. If Liberals make it uncompetitive for business, so they pack up and leave, and also just don't invest here anymore ... you have to switch to a socialist platform (which will end up in disaster) ... because jobs will eventually dry up ... and so, they know more and more people will need support, and then support Liberal (Socialist) platforms.

[JBen]

"yep"
Think Meach Lake and what occurred during the late 80s. There was a massive exodus out of Quebec......
Back then it was a toss up for the financial centers. The Montreal exchange was a bustling place. Bell Canada, Air Canada, soooooooooooo many.....

Look at what occurred to Ontario between say 2006 and 2012
Look at what's been happening to Alberta since 2012.

The "flight of Capital" out of Canada since around 2011 is sickening. FFS even Magna Itnl would rather spend billions, expanding outside Ontario, then inside Ontario.......

Carbon Taxes.
Read that article I linked about the impact to farmers, be they Ag or meat.....

Another way to look at it.
What is an "economy" if not an Ecosystem.....If there's not enough Bees.....or too many X, or......not enough food/jobs...

[fishermccann]

JBEN,

I have both a rural and city property so I pay at both end's, yes I subsidize my local schools in Coe Hill and the Police and the Fire.

I get to do the same in Mississauga pay all over again.

The most I get in the country for my own use is snow ploughing which actually I do not need because I am gone before the snow, but for general road maintenance I am ok paying that.

But should I still be paying taxes as a full time resident when I am there only half the year?

Where do you get the crazy idea that " small town Ontario just pays for it." That is simply fiction.

So for home heating I know plenty of people up north who heat almost entirely by wood, that is how my place is heated.

They say that this is carbon neutral. Tons of wood available for free if one takes the time to look for it and willing to work.

Your hydro up north is obviously going to be more expensive "economy of scale", cost of line loss ,maintenance of line's, high cost of labor and equipment.(take a look at all the equipment sitting in hydro yards never moving).

Up my way Democracy has been hijacked by a bunch of folk's in a trailer park. Mr Harris gave them all a couple of VOTES for each trailer site in order to impose MPAC taxes on them. The result the biggest land owners paying the MOST getting the least say in what goes on in the township, as the two trailer parks have enough votes to sponsor any candidate.

So your land taxes are basically "coffee money" as far as Ontario is concerned and on a personal basis I am paying land taxes
for a trailer park to run the township and get there way.

I will not mention gas is almost always 10-12cents a liter up north LESS than what it is in the City.

You have it good Gil. I pay taxes at my property up north, but because we are on an island , we get no snow plowing , no garbage pick up , no fire dept. as no fire boat in Kawartha lakes. And no vote on area developments. That is taxation without representation. Just want our money, with no say whatsoever, on how it is spent. Is that fair, not on your life.