Triple7 FFG vs FFFG with 28 inch barrel

[Big Tuna]

Do you have any preference with Triple7 powder FFG vs FFFG in a 28-30 inch barrel?

I got 2 pounds of FFG (since available) to test in late August to see how much crud shows and how far up the barrel it forms.
Based if crud ring show's in bottom half, upper half of barrel, or no crud ring will determine if good or if need to change to FFFG.
To see if it getting full burn or still burning after exit (so would want a slightly faster burn to get max results).

Can't find Blackhorn 209 other than from Cabela's Canada online.
Cabela's wanted $79.99 plus tax, had to make that double to save $18.95 for shipping.
Even saving their standard shipping cost, they still wanted and extra $16.95 for special ground delivery plus $181.45 for special ground explosive ground delivery.

Triple7 FFG - $44.95 x 2 = $89.90 plus tax = $101.59.
Blackhorn 209 - $79.99 x 2 = $159.98 plus tax = $180.79 + $16.95 + $181.45 = $379.19 total
$277.60 savings and was able to walk out with product instead of waiting 10 days.

Was an easy choice to change over.

[MikePal]

The wisdom is that FFFg is for smaller caliburs (.32-.50) ...often used in BP Pistols etc. FFg is for .50 cal and above and Fg for large bore .60 and higher.

Since .50 sits on the line, it then depends on which bullet/sabot, conical or ball you are using. Accuracy is then determined by which and how much powder will give you the best performance based on weights etc.

I'm on the range tomorrow with 55gr of FFFg in my .58 Musketoon because I read an article that it tested as best loads. That goes against the Manufacturer's recommendations of 60 gr of Fg, and what I found to be 65gr of FFg. Go figure

I like Goex in my percussion caps MLs', it's messy but easy to clean. I have also been using using 'P' Pyrdoex this spring with good success.

I use T7 loose in my Traditions In-line. Still get crud rings, but if you run a spit patch thru after each shot, it keeps it clean and consistent.

I did a thread on Blackhorn 209 a few years back...

https://www.oodmag.com/community/sho...=Blackhorn+209

[Big Tuna]

Follow up question:
To speed up my research, do you know the conversion rate for Triple7 FFG for Grains per Volume to get the equal in Grains per Weight?

Blackhorn was in a 150 gr charge max muzzleloader = 120 gr by volume max load of Blackhorn = 84 gr by weight of Blackhorn.
(multiply grains volume by .7 to get equal grains weight)

For Triple7 FFG, in a 150 grain max muzzleloader, the max FFG is 130 grains by volume allowed as equivalent.

What would be the grains per weight for FFG to match the 130 grain by volume?

[MikePal]

Triple 7 gets it's name from being the .777 , by volume of Goex.

You'll find that most guys with the 28" in-lines will have the best accuracy with saboted 45/50 bullets of around 85 grs of T7

Some guys will sacrifice a bit of accuracy for convenience and just use the 100 gr pellets.

Hogdens 'warning' is to never use more than 120 gr (volume) of T7.

[MikePal]

What would be the grains per weight for FFG to match the 130 grain by volume?

I will have my scales etc out in the morning and I can answer that then....

edit add: here is a conversion chart.

https://www.curtrich.com/BPConversionSheet2005.htm

[Big Tuna]

"Triple 7 gets it's name from being the .777 , by volume of Goex."

Excellent piece of trivia. Thanks MikePal.

[Big Tuna]

Still doing research on this, and some experimenting.
Triple7 from research is known for being the exception to the standard rules.
For comparison to traditional black powder, you need to reduce by 15% to get equal pressures, for FFG. 20% for FFFG.
You multiple by .15 to know how much to reduce, or another way to say is multiply by .85 to get total equivalent.

Still working on a formula to covert grains volume to grains weight.
I measured 120 grains by volume. It gave me 102 grains by weight on the scale.

Will continue to work out the conversion formula.

(grains by weight) = (desired grains by volume) x (.unknown multiplier)

[MikePal]

It's really a moot point, almost all BP measures are by volume. All the accessories tools for pouring powder are measured by volume.

In the 20 some years I've never used a 'weight' measurement, as BP doesn't require that level of accuracy like smokeless powders do.

Back in the day most BP measures used 'rule of thumb'.. measures to start....a .45 you used 45 gr, 50 you used 50 gr, etc. Then adjusted up or down to get the accuracy you need.

Even the 15% for T7 really isn't that critical unless you plan to reach out beyond 200 yrds.....if you start low and ladder up you'll find most guns like about 85 +/- gr.

Trail and error is part of the fun of making smoke...!!!

[Fox]

It's really a moot point, almost all BP measures are by volume. All the accessories tools for pouring powder are measured by volume.

In the 20 some years I've never used a 'weight' measurement, as BP doesn't require that level of accuracy like smokeless powders do.

Back in the day most BP measures used 'rule of thumb'.. measures to start....a .45 you used 45 gr, 50 you used 50 gr, etc. Then adjusted up or down to get the accuracy you need.

Even the 15% for T7 really isn't that critical unless you plan to reach out beyond 200 yrds.....if you start low and ladder up you'll find most guns like about 85 +/- gr.

Trail and error is part of the fun of making smoke...!!!

Yep, dead on with the loads.

The term "Loaded for bear" actually came out of the muzzleloader loads when they went west. They would take their deer guns and run a double charge, which would be 90gr for 45, 100gr for 50, etc., this would give more penetration for protection.