Ice out bassin'

[35wailin]

Are smallmouth invasive in zone 10 (north of hwy 17)? Is this why the MNR opened a year round season for them? If yes, then who cares if they are spawning. Target them and have some fun.

The MNR says they are invasive. I beg to differ in a lot of situations, but they make the rules. Most of the bass lakes in northern Ontario, east and west, are along the railway corridors. The Department of Lands and Forests, or whatever they called themselves 100 years ago, stocked them by transporting them by tanker cars and dumping the contents in whatever water they crossed. My understanding is that smallmouth are indigenous to the Great Lakes watershed and basically any lake in the watershed could hold natural populations, including the lake I plan on fishing next weekend. But, the MNR says they aren't protected with a closed season, then I will target them in the pre-spawn and leave them alone for the spawn. I will not harbour ill feelings towards those that do target them during the spawn IF there is a legal, open season at the same time, I choose not to. Individual ethics may differ.

i don't see any harm in fishing bass pre-spawn. The MNR endorses pre-spawn fishing for walleyes, closing the season here sometime in April. If it doesn't harm walleyes, it shouldn't harm the bass either.

[35wailin]

Hey 35wailin, if the temperature is in the mid 40's they are probably in the transition stages and didn't drop yet. Most of the lakes I am fishing here (southern ontario) have higher temperature and they are in different stages, a really great article that will help you target them and understand a bit of their biology is http://www.bassmaster.com/tips/spawn-time-smallmouth, cheers.

Thanks for the informative link, Roulus86.

[35wailin]

I think the answer is yes, basically, in fact I think the area to which they're non-native extends a lot farther south than that. But the limit of their natural range isn't completely clear, and in any case "invasive" is somewhat subjective... though I would say there's a strong case to call them invasive in many waters to which they've been introduced. For example I don't understand why in Algonquin Park, where lake-dwelling brook trout are a major conservation focus and non-native smallmouth bass their main threat, they don't open smallie season in late April when the sanctuary restriction ends on the park.

I agree with you about decreased protection of bass, where biology indicates such action is warranted. The lake I fished as a kid/teen had three top predators, lake trout, smallmouth and a few brook trout. The lakers and the bass did not compete directly with each other that I could tell. The Brookeis were basically stream fish that decided to live in the lake. There were/are good populations of Brookies in the feeder creeks. I never caught a bass in the feeder creeks, so I don't think the Brookies and bass were competing in this lake. Now the MNR decides they should be gone. I'd like to see the rock bass and brown bullheads that were introduced in the last twenty years gone.

[35wailin]

The bass are weeks off their spawn. Water temps are in the mid to high 40's now and SM won't start spawning till water hits 60's LM in the 70's. Look for SM on the first drop offs 15-20 feet feeding heavily after this long winter. I have fished open season SM on Lake Erie in the past and the action can be good with big fish caught. Just toss them back so they can finishing getting fat for the spawn.

I figured it would still be a little cold around here for them to spawn. Up in Kirkland. Lake, I threw back a nice fat 3 lb + pre-spawn female. My nephew was shocked, as there is a year-round open season there. I explained a little about biology and reproduction and when he caught a smaller male later, he didn't say a word and just tossed it back. I'm hoping to have a few fat fish come into the boat, but like you say, throw them back to spawn. I'll catch them later in the year after they have spawned a new generation.

[tweedwolfscream]

I agree with you about decreased protection of bass, where biology indicates such action is warranted. The lake I fished as a kid/teen had three top predators, lake trout, smallmouth and a few brook trout. The lakers and the bass did not compete directly with each other that I could tell. The Brookeis were basically stream fish that decided to live in the lake. There were/are good populations of Brookies in the feeder creeks. I never caught a bass in the feeder creeks, so I don't think the Brookies and bass were competing in this lake. Now the MNR decides they should be gone. I'd like to see the rock bass and brown bullheads that were introduced in the last twenty years gone.

My vague understanding is that rock bass compete with lake trout and smallies compete with brook trout, or at least lake-dwelling brook trout, not sure if the dynamics are the same in streams. I don't know anything about non-native bullheads, when/how were they introduced and what are their impacts?

In any case, rock bass and bullheads are certainly in season throughout their spawning period, so have at er.

For that matter, so are several popular game fishes, and they don't seem to be disappearing as far as I know, so I wonder what actual effect the change will have on bass viability up north.

[35wailin]

In this particular lake, the rock bass are competing directly with the smallmouth and the rockies are winning. I would suspect that the bullheads are competing with the suckers, which the lake trout are feeding on. I don't suspect the lakers will eat the bullheads, so they will depend more heavily on the ciscoes. Time will tell how this whole ecosystem change will play out.

[One_Tracc_Mind]

Walleye start producing spawn eggs mid-late fall and the season is wide open in almost every lake till spring. Combine that with the fact I never seen anyone toss back a legal walleye and we are in the situation we are in now.