Distress Call - What's happening to our moose? OOD Hunting Annual

[rockyboy]

When a species has to be reintroduced then I believe all people's and groups should have to follow the way of hunters having to put in for tags. One year going up for the moose hunt guy told us moose have been hard to get because one native fellow usually has 11 moose by now and only had 2 hanging now

A 5 year moratorium on native harvest would give very interesting results on population levels

[FishFrenzy]

The Native population in Ontario is growing at 5 times the rate of the non-native population (now 300,000+). This is multiplied by the fact that native population growth is in in areas with access to hunting whereby non-native population growth is almost entirely in urban/suburban areas.

If this trend continues we will almost certainly see a rapid acceleration of the decline of the moose population in Ontario.

We need better data, an immediate move to a temporary (3-5yr) mandatory reporting (to gather data) may make sense. I doubt it will happen but instituting this with a few (pilot) of the local native communities would also be helpful.

That population boom would mean that almost all of the 5x growth of the population (between 2006 and 2011, I read the census report as well) would now be represented by an age group of people that are less than 15yrs old (first nations between 0-24yrs old = nearly 50% of the entire population across Canada, 28% being 15 or less years of age). The current decline in moose populations wouldn't have a great deal to do with the boom in population as that age group (some obviously) aren't participating in full hunts as of yet. In the future, this may have an impact though.

As a First Nations person myself, I can tell you that I pay for my tags, and hunt like everyone else. Most all of the other members of the community that I know, or have spent time with in the outdoors also buy tags and hunt / fish within season. Despite the very broad brush that people like to paint with, not all members of the native community take 11 moose before the season opens. Like all demographics, there are always going to be a group of people that make others look bad.

Only 1 in 5 natives live on the reserve, so your notion that the population booms are happening in areas outside of city centres would be wrong. Just like the vast majority of Canadians, I live where there is work (the GTA) and an opportunity to provide for my family.

You can feel however you would like, but keep in mind not even biologists have a grasp on what factors are contributing to the decline. Pointing fingers at one group (natives, cross-bow hunters, lazy people not retrieving dead animals, ect....) isn't going to solve the issue. If you're concerned, write your MPP, the OFAH, and the MNR; have your voice heard. Only once people understand the issue can we begin to solve it. All groups within Ontario have a vested interest in the preservation of our heritage and culture - despite what many think, the Native community cares a great deal about wild game and the environment.

FishFrenzy

[rockyboy]

I agree that not every Native hunter would harvest 11 moose in a season. But the problem is that they can if they want. It's the lack of regulations that allows abuses. A single hunter who takes 11 moose, is sufficient to skew the population in an entire WMU.

[FishFrenzy]

I agree that not every Native hunter would harvest 11 moose in a season. But the problem is that they can if they want. It's the lack of regulations that allows abuses. A single hunter who takes 11 moose, is sufficient to skew the population in an entire WMU.

The same could be said about any poacher; the native community doesn't endorse mass killings. This one hunter may have also been providing meat to an entire community. Without first hand facts, it's very difficult to make a solid argument.

FishFrenzy

[warningshot]

poachers!!! they get their moose everyyear!!!

[Nontypical]

Just go down to the tribs down at quinte there in the spring and you'll understand what rocky boy is sayin just on a smaller scale. They have the right to take what they want, when they want , and however much of it. Just the way it is and will be

[Tman]

I must say that all factors must be looked at and managed when or even if the ministry changes anything. It will be pointless if the ministry doesn't attempt to monitor native harvesting of moose especially from a numbers research stand point. I'm not blaming natives but the ministry this year targeted only non native, tax paying, licence purchasing hunters. So to me it appears they are pointing they finger at us alone when if there really needs to be a change all factors affecting moose numbers must be managed and that includes natives. Now if natives understand the moose numbers are dropping isn't it within their best interest to contribute to the research and help manage the heard rather then sit back and watch from the comfy entitlement chair?? Again not harping on native rights but I just don't understand why natives would not voluntarily enter the effort the save this valuable resource. Another note on our way back from archery last season we had seen 2 bulls and 1 cow, no calves. No chance for shots as moose were either not open or close enough. Not even our poacher crossbow partner could get off a wounding 200 yard shot....lol ( I had to) We stopped in wawa for gas and seen a couple of bull racks in a trailer driven by 2 guys. We had a chat and turns out they were American natives coming up to shoot our moose with rifles during the archery season... just because they can and they were quite arrogant about it almost laughing at our laws. Like most natives I have seen hunting they had 4 wheelers, large trucks and trailers etc... I don't see how we can allow that??!!! Like I said my hope is that all necessary changes need to be addressed and hopefully the native one will be as well and I know our government is too chicken to go there so I'm hoping the natives can open up that conversation

[outdoorlife]

what measures do we take in Ontario to protect sensitive/critically important calving grounds? Other provinces close highways, fishing and water traffic if they have to. What sort of inconveniences are Ontarians willing to put up with to improve calving. The answer to this question, currently, is none.

[trimmer21]

Just go down to the tribs down at quinte there in the spring and you'll understand what rocky boy is sayin just on a smaller scale. They have the right to take what they want, when they want , and however much of it. Just the way it is and will be

I must say that all factors must be looked at and managed when or even if the ministry changes anything. It will be pointless if the ministry doesn't attempt to monitor native harvesting of moose especially from a numbers research stand point. I'm not blaming natives but the ministry this year targeted only non native, tax paying, licence purchasing hunters. So to me it appears they are pointing they finger at us alone when if there really needs to be a change all factors affecting moose numbers must be managed and that includes natives. Now if natives understand the moose numbers are dropping isn't it within their best interest to contribute to the research and help manage the heard rather then sit back and watch from the comfy entitlement chair?? Again not harping on native rights but I just don't understand why natives would not voluntarily enter the effort the save this valuable resource. Another note on our way back from archery last season we had seen 2 bulls and 1 cow, no calves. No chance for shots as moose were either not open or close enough. Not even our poacher crossbow partner could get off a wounding 200 yard shot....lol ( I had to) We stopped in wawa for gas and seen a couple of bull racks in a trailer driven by 2 guys. We had a chat and turns out they were American natives coming up to shoot our moose with rifles during the archery season... just because they can and they were quite arrogant about it almost laughing at our laws. Like most natives I have seen hunting they had 4 wheelers, large trucks and trailers etc... I don't see how we can allow that??!!! Like I said my hope is that all necessary changes need to be addressed and hopefully the native one will be as well and I know our government is too chicken to go there so I'm hoping the natives can open up that conversation

Unfortunately,these posts are spot-on. First Nations treaties guarantees their right to hunt and fish when,where and how they deem necessary under the federal Indian Act. The provinces are totally impotent to intervene (Caledonia). There is,in effect,no such thing as an international border between Canada and The US when it comes to First Nations. The rights are guaranteed under The Charter of Rights and amendments to the US Constitution. Until our governments "grow a pair",recognize the position of the United Nations in declaring First Nations legislation as demeaning,racist and an effectual Apparthied Policy much like the former policies of South Africa,there will never be any hope for the First Nations of either country to eliminate poverty and despair.

[werner.reiche]

what measures do we take in Ontario to protect sensitive/critically important calving grounds? Other provinces close highways, fishing and water traffic if they have to. What sort of inconveniences are Ontarians willing to put up with to improve calving. The answer to this question, currently, is none.

Moose don't really have 'calving grounds'...they calve where they live all year. I think you're confusing migrating caribou issues with moose issues - two totally different sets of problems.

..Unless you consider elimination of bears and wolves from calving grounds the issue.