New $2.00 Special Fee for MNR

[sawbill]

[QUOTE=terrym;848005]Who get annual increases, pensions, are virtually immune to layoffs and proven to be overpaid by @13%. I don't see how they suffer quite the same as the private sector. I have friends and family in both Federal and Provincial government. I have a pretty good picture of the differences.[/QUOTE)
I don't know where you're getting your info. Just take MNR for example: Massive layoffs over the years. Programs gone to the private sector, Fire protection recycle gone private, Provincial parks closed, JR programs gone, timber management gone to private sector, tree planting gone, trapping management gone, fur sealing gone, F & W licence issuing gone private, fleet maintenance gone private, budget cuts--this just off the top of my head in just one government agency.
Where is this job security you're talking about in all this? I know of many government positions whose salaries are substantially lower than those in comparable positions in the private sector.
You can be sure other government agencies, municipal, provincial and federal are all going through the same cutbacks and job insecurities.
You can always hand pick a few upper management positions that have a good income and job perks but by far the vast majority of employees do not fit into your characterization.

[denny22]

Well, I did vote in the last election, and my opinion is we're getting what we voted for, and have been for a long time now. It isn't a secret that the McGuinty government's fiascos precede the gas plant controversy by many years and in many different ways, but we repeatedly voted him back in. Then, we voted his successor in on a blatant platform of "spend, spend, spend - vote for me"! I believe that democracy isn't perfect but better than the alternatives, so I have to accept the will of the majority of voters. But I don't have to like it. We're getting exactly what we asked for - more of the same. And they told us we would. Remember that the next time you vote.

[JBen]

See the off topic forum and the dozens, if not hundreds of threads


Cherry picking the tree's (pardon the pun) serves no purpose. Can say Sawbill that those sentiments come from umbrella studies that look at the entire tree as opposed to this branch or that branch, and unearth findings such as

"PS" growing by 40% while "private" grew 11% 2003-2012---- or where from 2011-2012 private shrunk by 4% (jobs lost) compared to 0.8% of "PS". As they say, it's always the low hanging fruit (MNR and others) that gets chopped off first.

Just take MNR for example: Massive layoffs over the years. Programs gone to the private sector, Fire protection recycle gone private, Provincial parks closed, JR programs gone, timber management gone to private sector, tree planting gone, trapping management gone, fur sealing gone, F & W licence issuing gone private, fleet maintenance gone private, budget cuts--this just off the top of my head in just one government agency. Where is this job security you're talking about in all this?

See also who gets love (the GTA and city centers) and who doesn't (Rural/Northern Ont)

[sawbill]

What I've pointed out is a cross section of the entire MNR mandate, not just a few select branches so to speak. The white elephant in the room is health care that has bloomed in recent decades to meet an aging population. Their costs are staggering and salaries of their respective trades can skew any hand picked statistics that suggest rampant government employee raises.
I won't even talk about teachers..........

[JBen]

/quite agree with you Sawbill, there are many branches that no one should be envious of.

But that's what I meant by "Cherry Picking". When we start to cherry pick, anyone reading who is on or was on a branch that has been heavily pruned, or one where lots of fertilizer has been applied, backs will get up.

[FrucksOutdoor]

Right it is only $2.. , but if they add$2 next year its $4... than$6... is the $2 fee per license fishing $2 small game $2 moose $2 deer $2 turkey $2 bear $2 elk draw $2 elk tag (if successful) $2 surplus deer tag $2...
Personally I'm looking atleast $12 extra dollars next year... depending on surplus tags... amazing how quickly "only $2" ads up....

You're right, and I have 4 hunters in this house so it x4

[Bonkers]

I have no idea where your getting your information about all Public Employees. My father has worked for the MNR for 26 years, he hasn't seen a pay raise in years. His head is also on the chopping block. They are laying off anyone with under 30 years seniority, tell my how they are living it easy. If he gets laid off and loses his pension and benefits. I guess that is all right with you because he works in the public sector and doesn't deserve any sort of retirement

[terrym]

The MNR is being singled out for a reason. They have traditionally been way over staffed for the mandate they have. many of the things they do can be transferred to the ministry of Environment. Important functions like enforcement have always been understaffed. My best friend and hunting partner is a CO with 25 years seniority so I have seen how they park trucks because of no gas money left yet I clearly remember buying licenses at regional offices like Aurora and seeing an abundance of slow moving and mostly redundant people behind the desk. I remember going in to buy a moose tag and there was a line up of hunters. Well the woman would take her pad of blank licenses and walk across the room and put it away in her cabinet after each transaction. It was surreal to watch. Every hunter there was wondering if there was a candid camera rolling to watch the dumbfounded looks on those waiting in line. She was purposely stretching out the process while there were 2 other women sitting there pretending to work. every now and then you would see them get out and walk around and not actually do anything except take a stroll to look busy. They could have processed the waiting hunters in a fraction of what they were deliberately doing. Now many of those offices are closing. Wonder why?

[terrym]

If he gets laid off and loses his pension and benefits. I guess that is all right with you because he works in the public sector and doesn't deserve any sort of retirement

I have a hard time believing he will lose his pension. Some kind of settlement will be involved. If I get laid off there won't be a settlement other than legislated severance and as for the pension, well I don't have one from my employer and the last recession pretty well wiped out any fantasy of living anywhere close to my present standard of living. Will you feel sorry for me or feel the need to top up my retirement portfolio? Yet I should do that for you right? I think you won't find many who disagree with me except OPSEU members. I'm not saying most PS employees don't do an honest effort. What has been allowed to happen is a PS of too many people for the capacity of our economy. At some point the money runs out. In our case it already has and we are running deficits. If the economy heats up and interest rates rise the PS will in fact likely lose 100,000 positions through attrition and cutbacks because we won't be able to afford the increased cost of interest. Gee, I wonder who it was who predicted that but got kicked to the curb?

[Bluebulldog]

What I've pointed out is a cross section of the entire MNR mandate, not just a few select branches so to speak. The white elephant in the room is health care that has bloomed in recent decades to meet an aging population. Their costs are staggering and salaries of their respective trades can skew any hand picked statistics that suggest rampant government employee raises.
I won't even talk about teachers..........

Funny. I regard the elephant in the room as being the staggering debt that the Liberals have saddled the people of Ontario with. 300 Billion and growing, with only the promise to get it balanced by 2017. So it will keep increasing each year.

$300 Billion amounts to $50K owed on behalf of every person in this province.

If you think health care costs are skyrocketing, to service the $300 billion in debt, the province is spending $11 billion every year, this is the same amount of money being allocated for health care.