Return of Long Gun Registry

[welsh]

The report of the commission has already been issued. It found no evidence that the RCMP worked from a copy of the registry, no evidence of a coordinated effort to confiscate all firearms, and no evidence that there was ever any intent to charge anyone with storage offences or to permanently confiscate any legally held firearm.

It found instead that orders were unclear, that some officers were overzealous, and that some officers believed they were supposed to be laying charges or permanently confiscating guns.

A lot of paranoia on this thread. Amazing how certain people are that the sky is falling.

[MikePal]

MikePal, Laws can be changed and copies can magically appear. Also something about they were not suppose to be deleted because of an access to information request. This could also shield someone who hid a copy.

As of Jun 16th...this is the word from the government;

“It was this Parliament and this government that passed legislation explicitly to destroy that registry,” Harper responded, referring to the April 2012 bill known as the Ending the Long-gun Registry Act.



“The RCMP is acting upon that legislation. We obviously encouraged them to do that, Mr. Speaker. I know that the Liberal party wants to bring back the long-gun registry but that is against the wishes not only of this Parliament, but against the wishes of Canadians.”



The Mounties also said this week that they were under government orders when they deleted all the non-Quebec records.

“The destruction of the registration records in 2012 and more recently for Quebec in 2015 was done according to a government-approved implementation plan,” Sgt. Harold Pfleiderer told the CBC Monday.


http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/06/16/long-gun-registry-date-destroyed-by-rcmp-on-tories-urging.html

The issue around the "access to info" requests is not about resurrecting the data, it's about procedural wranglings.

[greatwhite]

I realize that. But that doesn't mean there are not copies around.

As of Jun 16th...this is the word from the government;


The issue around the "access to info" requests is not about resurrecting the data, it's about procedural wranglings.

[MikePal]

I realize that. But that doesn't mean there are not copies around.

That may be...but of what use would it be...it's toxic data..can't be used legally.

[mosquito]

I realize that. But that doesn't mean there are not copies around.

Who says there even needs to be whole copies? I keep thinking about what was posted awhile ago on the National Post where you could look at a postal code and see what firearms were there. Say that is in one database (postal code, list of firearms), another database where the personal PAL data is kept will have the postal code. Join the tables on postal code, Poof, if you are the only person in a postal code that has a PAL they know what you had. If there happens to be an ID to show which firearms were owned by a separate individual (but not actually identifying that person) in a freedom of information request that would make it easy. If they had that list and you registered 4 of the 6 listed for that postal code and that identifier... ID'd again.

In various forms the data is out there most likely and I have had to rebuild databases lots of times, the integrity might be lacking and what is out there in Freedom of Information requests (and why those requests were so important) are unknown. However I am betting they could bring the PAL, freedom of information requests etc. and $10 million to almost any software company and you will have a database that can be used for mailing lists, confirmations on a webpage etc.. Logging in before January 1st (as required by Liberal/NDP coalition bill #001) and seeing a list to confirm you still have and to make the updates would make it hard to deny ownership. I can see it now.... we found a copy, it isn't the same it is a new registry... like new Coke, still Coke but new... using roughly the phrases you hear Brian repeating they have said "everything else is registered and we are giving them a month to log in and register....".... by summer the warnings, reclassifications and confiscations....


IF I was on their side on this the Freedom of information query I would request would have been:

Please provide a list of types, models and actions, (serial number? might be pushing it but an excuse to determine firearms age??? that would what I would try if it could get past the watch dogs) and postal code where the firearms owned by and individual can be examined to see what other firearms they have and total owned. I would also have asked to include handgun data (which is still around) in the report. Without the serial numbers I recall this is what was on the National Post page but the individuals/businesses were grouped by type not as an ID to separate them out. So all businesses were B and Individuals I not B1, B2...I1, I2, I3 etc. like they would show up in my request

There is no personal identification include in that and it was essentially in the National Post webpage. You have to assume an enemy is atleast as smart as you in any strategy game and that simple request would show how many owners are in a postal code and what firearm each owner had (maybe even uniquely identifying it by serial number *identifying and tracking was mentioned in the video by Brain Lilley) and the handgun would be invaluable to ID an individual. Even in a rural postal code where there might be dozens of owners a report like that can be used to reference back to the original registry data to see what is missing from the records and by matching firearms you can see I1 in N0H0P3 is Mike P... had he had 44 firearms registered last time and 12 this time.... search warrant time.... get out the tank.

[greatwhite]

Laws can be rewritten.

Al I am saying is I don't trust the NDP/Liberals any further then I can throw them.

That may be...but of what use would it be...it's toxic data..can't be used legally.

[trimmer21]

Bill C-47 was a stroke of genius that managed to address all the oppositon's concerns except outright bans on all firearms. There's still a cadre of Liberals/NDP'ers that will not rest until that's accomplished. If The Conservative's failed at anything,it's not closing and locking the back door. They may have left too many loopholes. Time will tell around Christmas or New Years if the Conservatives loose the election.

[MikePal]

Laws can be rewritten.

Al I am saying is I don't trust the NDP/Liberals any further then I can throw them.

GW..do you honestly think MulCaire will be able walk over to the RCMP and hand them a black market copy of defunct Long gun registry and tell them to "make it so" ....LOL...

[mosquito]

GW..do you honestly think MulCaire will be able walk over to the RCMP and hand them a black market copy of defunct Long gun registry and tell them to "make it so" ....LOL...

Who would be there bosses? By then what law would they be breaking? Old database backup, rebuilt database etc.....

YEP, they could, with NO repercussions at all.

You can't charge someone for a law that no longer exists and 4.5 years to go before the next election, they wouldn't hesitate.

and the law would have us logging in before April 1st (as required by Liberal/NDP coalition bill #001) making the updates I can see it now.... we found a copy, rebuilt from Freedom of Information requests etc or just an empty database we fill in, it isn't the same it is a new registry... like new Coke, still Coke but new... using roughly the phrases you hear Brian repeating they have said "everything else is registered and we are giving them a month to log in and register....".... by summer the warnings, reclassifications and confiscations....

[welsh]

I'm puzzled why people think anyone would jump through all kinds of hoops to rebuild the registry.

If you're afraid they'll rebuild a registry to confiscate your guns, your fear is misplaced. Any government can make your guns illegal at any time. If you own a gun that's made prohibited, you have a simple choice: give it up, or become a criminal. Indeed, if that was the original intent of C-68, they could simply have done it then.