Canadians are the most indebted in the G7

[Species8472]

Sooner or later someone will have to pay the piper.

http://business.financialpost.com/ne...vels-pbo-warns

[seabast]

But probably one of the least indebted country of them all.... I guess money has to come from someone pocket.

[Hunter John]

Stay lean my friends, stay lean.

[JBen]

No real surprise. Anyone seen the price of a house in Vancouver, Calgary, GTA? Even rentals are getting insane.

And yet, despite knowing this. Some (like Ms Wynne) think government spending, and taxing is a good idea.

Won't take much for freight train to come off the tracks and start a spiral that's devastating, as many lose homes, or sell and start a real estate crash.

[trimmer21]

No real surprise. Anyone seen the price of a house in Vancouver, Calgary, GTA? Even rentals are getting insane.

And yet, despite knowing this. Some (like Ms Wynne) think government spending, and taxing is a good idea.

Won't take much for freight train to come off the tracks and start a spiral that's devastating, as many lose homes, or sell and start a real estate crash.

Something as simple as a 2% rise in the Prime Lending Rate will start the ball rolling and it's coming.

[JBen]

I (you), Werner back when he participated in the politics threads, Terry others many years ago when people defended first McGuintys spending, the Wynne. Spoke about rates, storm clouds, stormy waters globally.

Wee factoid. When the US hit the wall their consumer debt was 170% to income. Back then we were around 165%.

We find out today if the BoC is going to cut again. Many economist are divided. Many think we need to it to spur economic growth, many think it will do more harm than good.

Federally.
I actually don't mind them going further into hock. Federally "we" can take it. We desperately need to spur growth. The problem I have, is not knowing where they will spend it. Special Interest, feel good warm and fuzzies, more green crap ( how well has that worked in Ontario?)....Subsequent to that, how many and where tax hikes....

Provincially
We are in deep. Backed into a corner. Wing nut Wynne atleast is showing some small signs she understands she can't keep borrowing. Finally showing some signs of worrying about Johnny Q and not PS. However she's hammering people with all her "revenue tools" and Hydro...and ORPP as well?

She and JT can blather all they want about Ontario backstopping Canada again and leading the charge.
2% growth is not boom years, it just sounds good because since around 2008 growth has been sub 2%.

When will the BoC raise the prime rate? Who knows
But I'll say this much. Between soaring food cost, Hydro, taxes and a sluggish economy, the peons (private) have lost serious ground and theres not much in the way of "hope". And its no wonder people can't save, reduce debt.

Good job Ontario.
And I hope to the gods I believe in no-one ever tries to defend Unions as caring about the commoners.

[Bushmoose]

Stay lean my friends, stay lean.

It's a great ideal, but as I'm sure you know, it will never happen voluntarily? We live in a consumer driven society. Everyone is intent on acquiring the latest, greatest and the biggest! If a person doesn't have those things, they are looked upon by many of their neighbours and society in general as "not doing well", or "poor" or any other terms you care to associate with "not keeping up with the Jones"?
A popular trend we see popping up on our facebook page now is a charming picture of a log cabin in the woods with the inscription asking viewers if they could forgo modern conveniences for a year, would they choose to live there? Invariably everyone posts "yes"! But it's a romanticists dream as we all know. They then shut off the computer and hop in the car to head over to Wally World or Can. Tire to buy something from the sale flyer that they just have to have?
When or if things crash, our society is in for world of hurt.

[seabast]

No real surprise. Anyone seen the price of a house in Vancouver, Calgary, GTA? Even rentals are getting insane.

And yet, despite knowing this. Some (like Ms Wynne) think government spending, and taxing is a good idea.

Won't take much for freight train to come off the tracks and start a spiral that's devastating, as many lose homes, or sell and start a real estate crash.

Just wondering about something. If the government spend more on their people (construction, better retirement, child support, health care, EI and so on) don't citizen debt would go down and the country debt up? I have a pretty simple mind but isn't what really matter for people (send their kids to sport after school (1500$/years/per, spend a week of vacation every two years, don't have to work at Timmies at 70 years old and so on)?
This is just a question, I'm not saying that's the way to go but I just didn't understand your statement about spending doesn't help personal debt.... I mean that's what the article is about.

[werner.reiche]

Just wondering about something. If the government spend more on their people (construction, better retirement, child support, health care, EI and so on) don't citizen debt would go down and the country debt up? I have a pretty simple mind but isn't what really matter for people (send their kids to sport after school (1500$/years/per, spend a week of vacation every two years, don't have to work at Timmies at 70 years old and so on)?
This is just a question, I'm not saying that's the way to go but I just didn't understand your statement about spending doesn't help personal debt.... I mean that's what the article is about.

You can't spend your way to prosperity. Start with that premise and there's your answer.

Any thought that gov't spending will decrease personal debt is founded in the belief that a) the gov't debt is interest free; and b) it never has to be paid off. While we can debate the latter, the former is definitely false. One of the problems Ontario is running into now is the interest payment on its debts (11.5B). This means taxpayers have to pay for that. Paying more taxes leaves less cash in the taxpayer's pocket. Less cash in the taxpayer's pocket means more personal debt.

...and to put that 11.5B into perspective
Health is 50B
Education is 25B
Social services is 15B

[bushman]

You can't spend your way to prosperity. Start with that premise and there's your answer.

Any thought that gov't spending will decrease personal debt is founded in the belief that a) the gov't debt is interest free; and b) it never has to be paid off. While we can debate the latter, the former is definitely false. One of the problems Ontario is running into now is the interest payment on its debts (11.5B). This means taxpayers have to pay for that. Paying more taxes leaves less cash in the taxpayer's pocket. Less cash in the taxpayer's pocket means more personal debt.

Well said Werner Seems pretty simple to me but alas most can't or don't want to acknowledge reality.