https://data.ontario.ca/dataset/deb6...moose_2023.csv
Trends over time by WMU.
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https://data.ontario.ca/dataset/deb6...moose_2023.csv
Trends over time by WMU.
I'm looking over the stats for WMU 50 where we used to have a camp. There's a 90% reduction across the board from 2012 to the present. That can't be good no matter which way we look at it.
Wow, that’s a lot. What do you think is going on?Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
I'm not really too sure. Neighboring WMU's seem to be in the same boat,but,not nearly as extreme. From traveling through WMU 50 on the upland,deer and bear hunts,it sure isn't because the Moose population is down. They're all over the place,in fact,we've seen more Moose and Moose sign since the inception of the new regs than we've ever seen. Now,to my little pea brain,either,the reg changes and tag eliminations over the last 3 seasons has lead to a dramatic increase in population density or the bureaucrats are gaslighting the crap out of us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Menard
So you said "used to have a camp." Can i ask why you don't anymore? I feel like 50 is in one of those transitional areas where the culture has drastically changed in the last generation. My take is established camps are dying out as members age and the land ownership is being taken over by an influx of citiot cottagers from the GTA that are slowly progressing north as real estate prices rise and slowly but surely killing the culture with jet skis, ski boats, wake boats and 3000 square foot year round cottages on 1/2 acre lots with 60 feet of frontage. They are displacing not only the year round folks but also the seasonal outdoors hunting type. Purely anecdotal but that's my take. I have a 117 acres in Nipissing Township about 5 miles from South Bay Marina on Nip. My place is a comfortable 1200 square foot bungalow that is 3 season (i use it 4 seasons - but family has an issue snowshoeing to the outhouse - LOL) and is on a small (600 acres) lake where i own 3000 feet of frontage with total privacy and while the influx hasn't happened where i am, i can see it coming. I am old enough that it won't affect me but it will surely affect my kids.Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
For the record my anecdotal take on WMU 50 is based on my observations of my in-laws who have a place on Bella lake ENE of Huntsville. Been observing the changes on their lake for 40 years (i am 59 and started dating my wife when i was 19). 40 years ago i would have loved to have a place on that lake. Now i am glad that i don't and that i bought a 100km north of there on a quiet lake about the same size as Bella for peanuts.
I also have in laws that live on Bella Lake, over the years we see moose, lots when bugs are out but not a lot when compared to thunder bay area where I hunt. I would say there is a healthy population in that area of 50 but it is mostly private land and not a lot of moose hunting in the area, wolfs are absolutely terrible last few years.
Think the decline in moose harvest for 50 is when went to have to draw a calf tag and wasn't issuing everyone a tag, plus decline in adult tags, The harvest percentage seems real good on bulls
WOW once I see the old name calling "citiot cottagers" I immediately get my back up. Why do believe that a family that invests hundreds of thousands to buy lake frontage and build a 3000 squared foot homeQuote:
Originally Posted by Species8472
cannot have the privilege of running their toys on the Lake. They may be killing your culture but is it any different from you now being on Aboriginal land, building your 1200 square foot bungalow and using your toys.
The only way year round folks get displaced is that somebody decides to sell their place to another person from the City, pretty sure not with a gun to their heads.
I wonder if you have taken into consideration the amount of $$$$ the so called citiots pump into the local economy and provide jobs for the locals. Tax money into the schools and other municipal services.
I am happy for you that you still have a nice peaceful place to hunt and fish but surprised you would want to deny a fellow Canadian the same rights to enjoy their place.
You will probably complain a lot more when the Ontario Government figures out a system to charge folks for the use of Crown Land and brings in a pay as you go permit system. LOL
Ours was a Crown land camp that we took over from previous lease holders about 30 years ago. It had a permanent cabin on it that was rustic with zero frills,but,had ample room for 10 hunters at a time on the shore of a smallish no-name Splake breeder lake. We left it open for OMNRF staffers to use when they needed access. The primary reason for letting it go was unavailability of moose tags when they shut them off. Our members are getting older (ages 55-80) with zero chances of ever getting tags, again, in their lifetime with the current system. The camp was very difficult to get into ( 15 km's by truck to a sand pit parking point,5km cart track,1/2 hour by ATV only) eliminating any chance that cottagers would ever consider working heir a**es off to make the effort,besides,there's no chance a permanent structure would now be allowed. They must be portable and removed or concisely packed up when not in use. The old cabin was always in a constant state of repair and because of the remoteness, it was becoming too difficult to facilitate. Finally,just this past season,after we added up all the required work and expenses, we made the difficult to decision let it go. After the last deer season,at the end before we left,we had a work party to knock it all down and clean it up. It's too bad,but,time marches on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Species8472
Brother, you are one of the old timers that had no problems in your youth putting in a big effort accessing these remote camps which were generational and everything done for the adventure and love of the hunt. So to Species point culture is dying out, in part because the Ontario Government are no longer giving out these permits and even if they did, how many younger hunter would put in the effort to take the time off work, put in the work weekends and so forth.Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
Back in the day when folks worked at "the motors" vacations were taken around hunt seasons it was a yearly vacation. At least one old guy at the camp kept a few deer hounds for the guys to use which made the hunt exciting and fun.
Sadly as you say time marches on and all we are left is memories of a much more simple and fun time without the disturbances of work, social media and assortments of devices robbing us of what is important.
Yessir,absolutely right. Our hunt captain has been in constant contact with his pals who had camps in the area that closed as soon as the system switched. One lad asked "What took you so long?" LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
Note that citiots are not all from a City.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
Not all Karen's are Karen's
You don't move to place to bring your way of life you move there to enjoy their way of life. Aka Canada or America. You don't move here to bring your own culture instead that's what they are running from and coming for better or am I mistaken?
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You are not mistaken at all. That's the part that irritates me. I've lived my entire life in a rural area 2 hours north of GTA. People realized years ago they could buy their own slice of heaven to spend weekends on and still only be a 2 hour drive from home. They would buy their 10 or 20 acres, immediately posting no trespassing signs every 20 feet but have no problem walking their dogs across everyone else's property. Then send the police over when you are legally target shooting on your own property or when the smell of manure that you spread on your family farm of over 100 years is bothering them.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishfood
Well its a little off topic but you know me you will always get my opinion good or bad. yeh I think you are mistaken. You seem to be suggesting that folks who want a lakefront cottage for instance should maybe knock on your door to ask if they can maybe firstly BUY a watercraft and secondly can they have your permission to use it. LOL that's not happenings.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishfood
Folks are not running away from their cultures when they come here, they are bringing their talents.
I am pretty sure the Scottish/ Irish /French settlers here might love for things to be as they were, bringing their religion and alcohol and diseases (smallpox). The culture they displaced Aboriginal were gracious enough to share their knowledge and the land and look how far that got them.
What are the immigrants bringing now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilroy
How to treat women like garbage? Their 3rd world behaviors? Theft? Bad driving? not seeing many talents in the new Canadians.
Well as a City guy from Toronto let me give you the other side of the coin. A guy buys not 10 or 20 acres he buys 200 acres, just to make sure he is not crowding onto his neighbor who has been there since the dawn of time. The local neighbor knowing fully well he has no business letting his hounds out on the border of his neighbor from the city who is hunting from a tree stand decides because he has been there so long that this is his birthright.Quote:
Originally Posted by cantgetright
The same local neighbor might then also suggest the land the City guy owns is not actually his and he better get a survey to prove it. The same local neighbor might also suggest he is even hunting on the City guys land because his great uncle's second cousin used to own the City guys land fifty years ago and feels he has the same inherited rights.
So what is the city guy to do, is he going to pay taxes on his 200 acres and allow his country neighbor to run roughshod over him and dominate him.
No Sir especially if he is of the same Irish/Scottish background and does not mind a bit of boxing, up go the TRESPASS SIGNS, the hunt camp he owns gets populated by City Cops and the odd MNR officer during big game season. The City guy being a decent sort takes pity on the poor lost hounds that find their way onto his camp porch and feels the immediate need to drive the said hounds 65 klms to the nearest found hound pound. I think you get the picture.
Twenty years down the line the neighbor who has the dogs he has moved out and far away. There is no more trespassing hounds and hunter, no more land survey issues and the City guy lives happily ever after on the land he bought and paid for with his hard work.
I thought we were talking about Moose here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt86
Well Matt86 I don't know where you are but the immigrants near me are RUNNING FOR MAYOR IN MISSISSAUGA, working as Doctors and Specialists at the Trillium Hospital, Humber Hospital, working as nurses and dentists. Maybe your in a bad area.
The women who are treated as garbage as you put it seem to be victims of domestic violence and I am pretty sure I can bet you they are not new immigrants and their husbands are not of color.
Third World Behaviors, I would bet most road rage is committed by 2 and 3rd generation white males.
Theft and bad driving it committed by everybody as has been for a long time, I have had the pleasure of locking up hundreds of offenders more than half Canadian born.
You know the same folks turning places like downtown Belleville, Bancroft, Toronto ,Vancouver into white encampments of drug induced violence and multiple over dozes. All the way out to good old Alberta.
Its not Muslims, Indians, Pakistanis or any new immigrants who are the problems, the Muslims for instance do not drink alcohol or use drugs period its Canadians here who have that problems by and large.
Lets keep the discussion on moose and leave the other stuff for the off topic section.
They took our mooose
LOL sorry, had to.
My oldest saw a young moose east of Beaverton on her way way back from Lindsay mid winter. More and more sightings this way over the Years but there is not hunting for them here.
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