Where's the moose you say??

[DanO]

Funny I just came across the skin of a calf moose sitting in the middle of a Forest access road in zone 48. I get that the FN can harvest until Jan 15 but why leave the hide so visible. Right beside the road on the way to the municipal landfill. Trying to rub it in perhaps???? Oh and EVERY access road had been driven in the last 2 days by large half tons. Grouse hunting I guess! LOL

[Horridfiber101]

• Numbering 35,800, about 3% of the Aboriginal identity population in Canada lived in Newfoundland and Labrador in 2011. They made up 7% of the total population of that province. Newfoundland and Labrador had the largest Aboriginal population of all the Atlantic provinces.

By geez boyz some on here would be tellin us the Moose are doomed,doomed, with em numbers or should even be extinct on the Island by now.LOL

Can you expand your point further ?

35,000 FN in NFLD and Labrador with moose pop est about 115,000
301,000 FN in ONT and moose est to be 92,000

Means Ontario has had 10 times a greater population of FN chasing 80% fewer Moose.
And has had for about the past 80 years or so based on the consensus numbers.

Seems the OP may still be on to something here.
But there must be a myriad of other reasons and variables

[JBen]

Numbers of moose and number of people are pointless really. It's comparing apples to oranges, and unless a person could somehow normalize everything.

population density
Ontario: 14 people per square km
NFLD: 1.4 per sq km
Manitoba: 3.7 per
Quebec: 3.7 per

Then as Sawbill said, even if somehow it could be normalized, is access the same?
in short comparing, either moose numbers, FN numbers, or population.

If I'm not mistaken Manitoba to, is seeing drastic drops. Population density is nowhere near Ontarios, yet still substantially higher than NFLDs.

[SK33T3R]

Everyone's analyzing numbers trying to explain why our game populations are taking the nosedive.

Here's how I analyze it.

We got a bunch of senior MNR policymakers all making big incomes (sunshine list probably) and in line for nice cushy pensions. How do you all like those numbers!
These people all were hired on to manage our resources. From what I've witnessed over the years with cancelled bear hunts, wolf licencing, wolf protection, cormorants, tag allocations, poaching, skyrocketing licence fees, etc etc I'd say the whole bunch should be fired and maybe we hire a bunch of Newfies to turn this ship around.

[werner.reiche]

Everyone's analyzing numbers trying to explain why our game populations are taking the nosedive.

Here's how I analyze it.

We got a bunch of senior MNR policymakers all making big incomes (sunshine list probably) and in line for nice cushy pensions. How do you all like those numbers!
These people all were hired on to manage our resources. From what I've witnessed over the years with cancelled bear hunts, wolf licencing, wolf protection, cormorants, tag allocations, poaching, skyrocketing licence fees, etc etc I'd say the whole bunch should be fired and maybe we hire a bunch of Newfies to turn this ship around.

Make the positions zero salary, all bonus.
Bonus to be based on number of moose taken by licensed hunters in the season 3 years in the future.

[JBen]

Somewhat, no doubt Skeeter.
Life has taught me though that the world is rarely black or white,normally a shade of grey. Sometimes absolute neutral grey, sometimes light grey (more this than that) and sometimes dark grey (more that, than this).

I think in another thread, maybe it's this one I criticize the MNR for the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. Aka those studying Moose/Whitetails and those studying Wolves, Coyotes. Or maybe its the brain (Senior civil servants and politicians) not knowing what either hand is doing/finding. We know the MNR doesn't receive anywhere near enough funding, to do all the things they are A) expected to do and B) asked to do.

Im "unemployed" and looking for something new to do with life. Bay Street/finance I've had it, so I'm periodically checking things, see what might interest me. There are lots of postings occasionally for roles within the MNR ( most on the biologist side), occasionally senior management, project director types.

For the task and responsibilities required
For the qualifications required
They don't pay much.
That said, thats true of many fields/industrys these days. Saw one posting where besides years of experience, and a lot of repsonsilbity the job required Masters degrees
It paid $50,000

So yes, some imo are stupidly over paid (relative to what everyone else in the world makes)
Some arent

Do agree that many area's within civil service need to be gutted, a lot of that at the management levels. Theres zero accountability (heads don't roll) in cases paid way too much and in cases their performance is brutal (see lately the ministry of transportation).

But ultimately it always starts at the top, if the troopers in the MNR aren't performing, well thats on the generals.

[SK33T3R]

JBen
I know you're correct and I'm just venting. But those $50 grand per year guys are not the ones that make the decisions or put the final stamp on things.

Somewhere at the top is a handful of stampers that consistently get it wrong.
Do we even know who they are. Seems everything is behind closed doors.
So much for democracy, openness, transparency, and all the other catch words these beaurocrats are trained to use to put us to sleep.


We have the richest province in the best country in the world. How the frig did we get to where we are today.

We managed ourselves right here. It's not an environmental disaster or disease. It was management plain and simple.

Like the 3 stooges painting themselves into a corner. That's how I describe the MNR decision makers!

[Gilroy]

Funny I just came across the skin of a calf moose sitting in the middle of a Forest access road in zone 48. I get that the FN can harvest until Jan 15 but why leave the hide so visible. Right beside the road on the way to the municipal landfill. Trying to rub it in perhaps???? Oh and EVERY access road had been driven in the last 2 days by large half tons. Grouse hunting I guess! LOL

Q. OK nobody else is asking so what is the proof of the proof as Chretien would say that the said calf was killed by a FN hunter.

[Gilroy]

Can you expand your point further ?

35,000 FN in NFLD and Labrador with moose pop est about 115,000
301,000 FN in ONT and moose est to be 92,000

Means Ontario has had 10 times a greater population of FN chasing 80% fewer Moose.
And has had for about the past 80 years or so based on the consensus numbers.

Seems the OP may still be on to something here.
But there must be a myriad of other reasons and variables

Yes I can expand my point further its simplistic to keep blaming FN for the complete demise even here in Ontario as you say there are so many other reasons and variables.

As a lay person and no expert on Moose the few things I think I know about Newfoundland are part of these variables.

The Island is large with the winter conditions the Moose has evolved to survive in,plenty of snow.
There are not the same number of access roads which reduced hunter opportunity.
I do not believe they have any wolves there or a very limited number.
They don,t have white tailed deer there,so the brain worn is taken out of the equation.
There are 700 Moose/Car accidents a year, I would imagine half the Moose get killed.

These are just some of the things to ponder in relation to comparisons between us and them.Maybe they are very strict on poaching,
maybe there is more enforcement.Hopefully a few from the Island can tell us what they now.

[Species8472]

I do not believe they have any wolves there or a very limited number

No timber (gray) wolves. Eastern coyote arrived over the ice some time in the 80s and have been island wide since the mid 90s.