Unknown champions

[vom Dufenshmirtz]

Reading the recent post,he didn't say "no right" he said no business.They are completely different.
I think if you cant afford $1000 for a pup you probably should not invest in a dog ,regardless of breed.Doesn't mean you need to spend a $1000 ,but you better have extra funds, trust me unless your brothers a Vet. they will be more than a $1000 in vet bills.
Regarding shooting a dog ,in the past when you were not able or want to pay for a high vet bill they shot the dog.
I think no business really means being responsible .

Thank_you_for_translating_my_post_to_English

[welsh]

Hunt desire, health, brains, tractability, & structural soundness. All have been trained and tested to the limits before a title is won, in most cases.

Minor quibble: a field trial champion title is no guarantee of tractability in the era of the e-collar....

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[terrym]

I don't think there are ever any guarantees when dogs are concerned. Still I would try and improve my odds.

[Cass]

Minor quibble: a field trial champion title is no guarantee of tractability in the era of the e-collar....

Not sure I agree that the ecollar is creating harder to control dogs.

[krakadawn]

Minor quibble: a field trial champion title is no guarantee of tractability in the era of the e-collar....

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There is no doubt that the era of the e collar has had a significant impact on training. Just as important are the sound, sequential programs developed originally by Rex Carr and expanded upon by others.

However, dogs must perform in field trials without collars to earn those distinctions....and that is a significant factor.

Tractability is still a highly sought out characteristic in retrievers. I need a willing partner not a rebel on his own to be successful at this game and dogs for sure know when collars are off.

[welsh]

Not sure I agree that the ecollar is creating harder to control dogs.

I didn't say it had.

I said that in the e-collar era, a title does not guarantee tractability.

That's a fact. It was true before e-collars, and it's true today. You don't need to be consistent to earn a title. Patience and persistence will do it even if the dog blows it in trial after trial. Luck, too, plays a role.

I can name dogs that have the titles but are difficult to control. Titles often mean less than we like to think.

With e-collars, people are able to get better results out of dogs that might otherwise be much more difficult.

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[krakadawn]

I think our comments need to be in context with the type of dog and trials run.

In retriever trials you do need to be consistent. I guess out of the blue some dog could win but not likely. And as always luck can play a part but if you're not a consistent performer then not likely are you going to get through a 350yard water blind or complete a huge set of water marks that may take 20 minutes or so to get all the birds.

No doubt better results and consistency have come about with the advent of the e collar. Actually training methods have become more humane with the collar as well.

[welsh]

In retriever trials you do need to be consistent.

In retriever trials, a dog that wins one trial never blows the next?

A dog that earns a title in 2016 will be stripped of that title if it runs poorly in 2017?

Not sure either statement is true.

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[krakadawn]

In retriever trials, a dog that wins one trial never blows the next?

A dog that earns a title in 2016 will be stripped of that title if it runs poorly in 2017?

Not sure either statement is true.

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Of course a dog can go from a hero to a zero over the course of several trials but by and large those who are consistent have better chances to title in retriever trials. But competition is competition so things happen.

I think it is accurate to say that the use of a collar guarantees a higher degree of consistency which may be viewed as tractability by some.

I don't understand the comment about a dog being stripped of a title?

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[terrym]

This is why I like the hunt test system. If the dog has a bad day he gets nothing. In a field trial I may be wrong but regardless of performance they always award a win to the best dog performance? That could be a field of 6 dogs or 60. Not really apples/apples at that point. I have heard the show people play that game very well. The breeder who sold me my Brittany told me could virtually guarantee me a Show title. I have no interest in that but it does show that you can game the system.