Misdialed 911 call leads RCMP to home with 100 unsecured guns

[Fox]

Yes, sadly there are lots of stories like that out there. I always argued that every recruit needed to take the CFSC and get a licence. The brass refused, saying it was too expensive. That’s why we hear horror stories like yours.....

One guy was pissed he could not buy ammo at CT, he had a 22LR and used it to shoot squirrels. He did not have a PAL or have the rifle registered. He then proceeded to tell me it was illegal for civilians to own handguns.

Never open your door to a LEO unless there is a reason for it.

[Badenoch]

I know of a number of LEOs that had no idea what the gun laws were, storage and ownership laws included.

I keep copies of the RCMP brochure on safe storage in my car and home should a need arise. If a cop doesn't know the law we will straighten it out eventually. If a gun owner doesn't know the law then he is solely responsible for the outcome.

It is your right not to open the door to a police officer upon request but if they want in badly enough they will request a warrant and detain you until it arrives or claim exigent circumstances and go in anyway. The SCC has already ruled in favour of the police who entered a home without a warrant in response to a 911 call after being told by the homeowner there wasn't a problem. R. v. Godoy (1999).

[Fox]

I keep copies of the RCMP brochure on safe storage in my car and home should a need arise. If a cop doesn't know the law we will straighten it out eventually. If a gun owner doesn't know the law then he is solely responsible for the outcome.

It is your right not to open the door to a police officer upon request but if they want in badly enough they will request a warrant and detain you until it arrives or claim exigent circumstances and go in anyway. The SCC has already ruled in favour of the police who entered a home without a warrant in response to a 911 call after being told by the homeowner there wasn't a problem. R. v. Godoy (1999).

I agree with the statement about entering the home, you have to do this, maybe someone else dialed.

The thing that I wanted to bring up is that I am guarded about the actual unsafe storage issue. At this point there is no evidence revealed to the public about it. If the guy had a closet with a lock on the door and all the guns were in there and they needed a key or tools to get in then they would meet the requirement, although opening a closet to see 100 guns may cause the cops to lose their you know what and just start piling them into the car.

You hear in the media things like "thousands or rounds of ammunition", well, do they mean 22LR? 7.62x39? 50 BMG? It is really easy to have thousands of rounds of 22LR kicking around, this is normal for many shooters.

[onelessarrow]

"They did actually speak to the person on the phone at the time of the call and he said there was no emergency and that he was trying to dial 411," said Clarke.

Clarke said RCMP have to respond to all 911 calls, even hangups or misdials.

"When the police officers went to the individual's home, they felt that they needed to get inside the home to make sure there was no emergency," said Clarke. "With permission from the homeowner, they did enter the home."



It's safe to say the responding officer was told twice that the call was a misdial. Once from dispatch and once by the homeowner. Big difference from the supposed case law mentioned above.
Every case will be based on it's own facts.

So what was the bases for their feeling a need to enter? It'll be this, that will be tested against the homeowners charter rights.

Ask yourselves why Spl. Clarke needs to report that the officers felt they needed to get inside. If the homeowner was so cooperative and let them in right away, why make the statement in the first place?
The answer is, he didn't want them in the house and the police claimed they needed to go in.

[MikePal]

"They did actually speak to the person on the phone at the time of the call and he said there was no emergency and that he was trying to dial 411," said Clarke. ....

....Ask yourselves why Spl. Clarke needs to report that the officers felt they needed to get inside. If the homeowner was so cooperative and let them in right away, why make the statement in the first place?

Very well put and with the limited facts we have, does raise the question; were they with in their obligation to enter his residence ?

[Fox]

"They did actually speak to the person on the phone at the time of the call and he said there was no emergency and that he was trying to dial 411," said Clarke.

Clarke said RCMP have to respond to all 911 calls, even hangups or misdials.

"When the police officers went to the individual's home, they felt that they needed to get inside the home to make sure there was no emergency," said Clarke. "With permission from the homeowner, they did enter the home."



It's safe to say the responding officer was told twice that the call was a misdial. Once from dispatch and once by the homeowner. Big difference from the supposed case law mentioned above.
Every case will be based on it's own facts.

So what was the bases for their feeling a need to enter? It'll be this, that will be tested against the homeowners charter rights.

Ask yourselves why Spl. Clarke needs to report that the officers felt they needed to get inside. If the homeowner was so cooperative and let them in right away, why make the statement in the first place?
The answer is, he didn't want them in the house and the police claimed needed to go in.

If he was home and licensed then how would a gun outside of being loaded and unattended not be legal? You are allowed to have your guns out in your home with you there, that is not storage. If you were not allowed to then you would not be allowed to take them out of the cabinet and put them into a case without breaking the law.

There is something missing, potentially a lot missing here.

[onelessarrow]

There is something missing, potentially a lot missing here.[/QUOTE]
Yep, all the questions and answers once they got into the house.
Like, do you have trigger locks for all these guns? Answer....nope.
Is this where you normally leave all your guns? Answer....yep.
Done deal

[canadaman30]

Very well put and with the limited facts we have, does raise the question; were they with in their obligation to enter his residence ?

No not at all if they needed permission and had no warrant

[Fox]

There is something missing, potentially a lot missing here.

Yep, all the questions and answers once they got into the house.
Like, do you have trigger locks for all these guns? Answer....nope.
Is this where you normally leave all your guns? Answer....yep.
Done deal[/QUOTE]

So you are saying that he said that he said too much?

Still not enough information.

[onelessarrow]

I don't have a clue what he said. I'm assuming the questions i mentioned above would be pretty standard for an officer who observed guns laying around the house.
But if he has trigger locks in the house for all the guns or a large enough safe, then your point/argument could come into play.