gsp help

[toddc]

I have a 3 year old gsp with great bloodlines,,. He has never hunted before, Ive never seen him point naturally like things around the yard.. where do I start training him for partridge

[Ugo]

In the woods. Ha ha ha.....never lose your sense of humour.
I'd start by getting him a solid foundation in obedience that is well proofed. He is not too old to be productive but his pedigree will give you the best indication of what he can blossom into.....or not. Regardless of the effort you put into him, your odds are not good if he has a ped rich in CH's that precede his registered name or FDJs that follow his name. Now, if he is not at all registered, you are gambling but that doesn't mean he can't develop into the finest bird dog you've ever had.
Here is my generalized approach. Spend LOTS of time with yard work. Spend lots of time in the grouse/woodcock woods BUT ask nothing of him in the woods. Put some tape over your lips and let him learn from his mistakes. That will accelerate his learning curve and will not confound the core lessons he must get under his belt without the verbal run-off. If there is anything you should not do it is to go afield with a weak obedience file and then run around the woods yelling and screaming "HERE!! Here you S.O.B.! HERE....WHOA....WHOA....HEEEEERE!!!".
You'd be amazed at how many folk do that on a regular basis to the point where they think it IS what hunting with a bird dog represents.
This may seem over-simplified but if you do the yardwork up front and can get him on a healthy number of wild birds, you might be surprised.
Do NOT buy pen-raised birds and put them in a launcher(s) for your dog!!! Pigeons could be used but you need to REALLY know how to use them effectively as opposed to how I read most folk use them.
All the best,
Ugo

[toddc]

if I let him run wild birds,and he busts them and flushs etc and I dont either correct or commend what exactly is he learning? Im not being smart I honestly dont know and would love to pick all your brains. He has good obedience training, and doesnt usaully chase out of range.

[Jakezilla]

if I let him run wild birds,and he busts them and flushs etc and I dont either correct or commend what exactly is he learning? Im not being smart I honestly dont know and would love to pick all your brains. He has good obedience training, and doesnt usaully chase out of range.

He is learning how to find wild birds (hunt) and having a good time doing it which is the first thing you need in order to make a bird dog.

[toddc]

he has found birds i mean we have flushed lots while walking

[terrym]

This may seem over-simplified but if you do the yardwork up front and can get him on a healthy number of wild birds, you might be surprised.
Do NOT buy pen-raised birds and put them in a launcher(s) for your dog!!! Pigeons could be used but you need to REALLY know how to use them effectively as opposed to how I read most folk use them.
All the best,
Ugo

Given the relative difficulty of training on scarce wild birds are you saying less bird contact is preferred to supplementing exposure with pen birds? I find Chukars actually are far jumpier than woodcock and will hold for the dog but won't tolerate crowding by the shooter. Also we can train in the off season with actual shooting of birds and all the training that entails. If you feel we are hurting our training progress I sure would appreciate the advice on how to do it properly? By the way it's nice to see you Pros back, we newbies take the advice seriously.

[BDH]

In his three years has he caught birds? If he has he has taught himself he does not need to point and there may be some difficulty in get him to stop chasing. The other factor is how strong a pointing instinct did he have? If he as a low pointing instinct which is inherited you will require contact with many birds in a controlled environment.

Dick

[toddc]

In his three years has he caught birds? If he has he has taught himself he does not need to point and there may be some difficulty in get him to stop chasing. The other factor is how strong a pointing instinct did he have? If he as a low pointing instinct which is inherited you will require contact with many birds in a controlled environment.

Dick

no catches , but everything Ive read (and its been alot) agree's with what you have said.. In fact I have not read anywhere that exposure to wild birds without control was a good thing. Not to say what other posters have said is wrong Im just trying to put it all together

[Sharon]

no catches , but everything Ive read (and its been alot) agree's with what you have said.. In fact I have not read anywhere that exposure to wild birds without control was a good thing. Not to say what other posters have said is wrong Im just trying to put it all together

You haven't read enough. just kidding you

I think it's a very good thing. It teaches all the things you can't teach . It teaches the dog what it is looking for ; it teaches the dog that it can't catch a bird by chasing (hopefully). From there normally, you get a dog that will start to creep/hold point , at which time you start with human controls - no more chasing.
In the old days, trainers who had land would let their pup run loose for a year learning all those things BEFORE formal training started.

** The more the dog can learn on its OWN, the better. That's how you get a dog to hold point for ............minutes until you get there.

All you need at this point is to teach your dog to come when called in the field . jmo

[Jakezilla]

If he has been chasing birds for 3 years you may be in a situation where you are breaking the habit and not the dog. In which case you may need some hands on help.

What have you read? Mostly books or internet chatter? Just so we have an idea of where you are coming from.