Are our moose dwindling? David says so

[300Sniper]

No chip, just disbelief. As a native I can shoot all the moose I want whenever I want, but I don't. Like most people here I don't need the meat, I hunt for the pleasure of hunting. The meat is just a nice bonus, especially considering that hunting for meat is almost always more expensive than buying it.

Most people recognize that the government can't do much right, if anything at all, and although we are not happy about it we live with it. I don't believe I have ever seen a comment here applauding the MNR for their management of our natural resources, so when I see a comment saying our group harvested 5 adult moose last year I have to wonder if they are the only people out there who does not recognize the MNR does a ty job or if they simply don't care about the future of the resource. Conservation of our resources is everybodys responsibility, especially when you already know it is badly managed.

No single rain drop ever blamed itself for the flood.

When we hunt ducks we limit out more then 50% of the time, we also shoot a lot of grouse when moose hunting. I fish lake Ontario for salmon and trout all summer and haul hundreds and hundreds of pounds of fish out of the lake. Based on what you are saying, we should not believe anything the mnr has to say with regards to limits and the best practice for all of us here is to stop hunting and fishing all together. Is that about right????

Give your head a shake....

The only resource I have to go on is what the mnr tells me. Weather they do a good job or not is irrelevant because they have more resources and know more then I do to make the decisions outlining limits in which we can harvest animals.

As long as I don't take more then what I'm legally allowed then I'm doing nothing wrong and for you to say otherwise is your own opinion. Unless you stop hunting and fishing all together, your opinion means nothing to me.

[SeanL]

When we hunt ducks we limit out more then 50% of the time, we also shoot a lot of grouse when moose hunting. I fish lake Ontario for salmon and trout all summer and haul hundreds and hundreds of pounds of fish out of the lake. Based on what you are saying, we should not believe anything the mnr has to say with regards to limits and the best practice for all of us here is to stop hunting and fishing all together. Is that about right????

Give your head a shake....

The only resource I have to go on is what the mnr tells me. Weather they do a good job or not is irrelevant because they have more resources and know more then I do to make the decisions outlining limits in which we can harvest animals.

As long as I don't take more then what I'm legally allowed then I'm doing nothing wrong and for you to say otherwise is your own opinion. Unless you stop hunting and fishing all together, your opinion means nothing to me.

Hey have it your way, when the MNR closes the recreational moose hunt and I am still out there you can tell me how it worked out for you.

[GW11]

Jeff's group jumped through the same hoops that the rest of us do every year when it comes to applying for moose tags. If they managed to get 5 tags and then managed to fill them all, I'd say that a good plan came together. For all you know SeanL, Jeff could have 20 guys in his group.

[Fishy Wishy]

Again not a biologist here but we aren't talking a few less tags we are talking 2,901 fewer adult tags across Ontario. 18% fewer across the province with some WMUs 94% fewer. I still cannot understand why such a large cut in bull tags (2700) and such a small cut in cow tags (201)...it makes no sense to me.

Seems that the tag allocation/quotas of the past must have been erroneously high...or there is a fault in the frequency/adequacy of the aerial surveys. I don't believe for one second that Natives "from Quebec" or otherwise have killed that many moose in one season or that bears or wolves have had that much effect in a single year. Perhaps surveying 7/27 of the Northeast WMUs isn't adequate, just sayin'.

Maybe with such a low survey in those selected WMUs they should have expanded and surveyed more. These are the types of issues that show clearly, how underfunded the MNR is. In 2013 there were 102,770 hunters buy licenses and apply for adult tags (added up all Pool 1 and Pool 2, 1st choice applicant numbers for gun and bow tags).. @ $56/ each that is over $5.75M that in my opinion should go back into managing the moose herd. I know that is not a huge number when talking MNR budget but I'm tired of hearing excuses for lack of CO action due to budget restraints. And I know licensing fees go to general coffers not individual ministries but I believe in a pay for use system.

The last couple years I have seen lots of moose in 28, that were unshootable for a myriad of reasons (season, no tag/wrong tag, unverified ID etc).

That being said. If none of my group gets a tag, I don't think I'll be searching out calves this year. Echoing the sentiment, just because I can doesn't mean I should. Perhaps I'll hunt blackbear, perhaps I'll try waterfowl, or the fall turkey hunt...maybe I'll get more small game time in searching for grouse and bunnies. But I will do my part for conservation of my favourite game animal.

FW

[Fishy Wishy]

Guys I think all SeanL is saying is the old "limit your catch, don't catch your limit" the Bob Izumi used to preach.

[300Sniper]

Again not a biologist here but we aren't talking a few less tags we are talking 2,901 fewer adult tags across Ontario. 18% fewer across the province with some WMUs 94% fewer. I still cannot understand why such a large cut in bull tags (2700) and such a small cut in cow tags (201)...it makes no sense to me.

Seems that the tag allocation/quotas of the past must have been erroneously high...or there is a fault in the frequency/adequacy of the aerial surveys. I don't believe for one second that Natives "from Quebec" or otherwise have killed that many moose in one season or that bears or wolves have had that much effect in a single year. Perhaps surveying 7/27 of the Northeast WMUs isn't adequate, just sayin'.

Maybe with such a low survey in those selected WMUs they should have expanded and surveyed more. These are the types of issues that show clearly, how underfunded the MNR is. In 2013 there were 102,770 hunters buy licenses and apply for adult tags (added up all Pool 1 and Pool 2, 1st choice applicant numbers for gun and bow tags).. @ $56/ each that is over $5.75M that in my opinion should go back into managing the moose herd. I know that is not a huge number when talking MNR budget but I'm tired of hearing excuses for lack of CO action due to budget restraints. And I know licensing fees go to general coffers not individual ministries but I believe in a pay for use system.

The last couple years I have seen lots of moose in 28, that were unshootable for a myriad of reasons (season, no tag/wrong tag, unverified ID etc).

That being said. If none of my group gets a tag, I don't think I'll be searching out calves this year. Echoing the sentiment, just because I can doesn't mean I should. Perhaps I'll hunt blackbear, perhaps I'll try waterfowl, or the fall turkey hunt...maybe I'll get more small game time in searching for grouse and bunnies. But I will do my part for conservation of my favourite game animal.

FW

I can't speak for anyone other then "Us". I'll suggest that the reason for a high % of bull tags cut has to do with the possibility that when we report what we have harvested, maybe a large percentage is bulls? Maybe 8 or 9 out of 10 adult moose shot are bulls? I don't know, just putting it out there. By reducing the bull tags and not so much the cow, the mnr is still allowing for a hunt to happen perhaps assuming that most groups are not very successful shooting cows?

What are other people ratios?

In the last 4 years we took 10 moose, only 1 was a cow and she was paired up with a bull.

[SeanL]

Guys I think all SeanL is saying is the old "limit your catch, don't catch your limit" the Bob Izumi used to preach.

That is what I am saying, just not as well as you. Thanks. Like you we plan to hit the bears this year, might help the moose a bit.

[300Sniper]

Guys I think all SeanL is saying is the old "limit your catch, don't catch your limit" the Bob Izumi used to preach.

So.... does that mean if we had 10 tags it would have been ok to shoot 5 in your opinion as we would not have "caught our limit"?

[Fishy Wishy]

So.... does that mean if we had 10 tags it would have been ok to shoot 5 in your opinion as we would not have "caught our limit"?

Jeff,

Don't go all chest-beating and trying to cause a fight. It isn't going to happen so calm yourself.

I have, nor noes anyone on this thread other than yourself, no idea of the size of your group, and how many game-eating mouths you feed.

YOU and your group have to decide on your needs/uses and if, based on that, you need to fill all of your tags.

Same as if you go fishing daily do you need/can you use the daily limit each time?

I remember growing up we were allowed 6 pickerel each, any size you can catch....and we did. For my family alone that was 24 on the ice, then 30 for my uncle's clan....sometimes we had 100 or more walleye on the ice. What has that done??? Well for starters now the limit is 4 per person and only 1 allowed over 18", and you have pissession limits along with daily catch limits.

[300Sniper]

Jeff,

Don't go all chest-beating and trying to cause a fight. It isn't going to happen so calm yourself.

I have, nor noes anyone on this thread other than yourself, no idea of the size of your group, and how many game-eating mouths you feed.

YOU and your group have to decide on your needs/uses and if, based on that, you need to fill all of your tags.

Same as if you go fishing daily do you need/can you use the daily limit each time?

I remember growing up we were allowed 6 pickerel each, any size you can catch....and we did. For my family alone that was 24 on the ice, then 30 for my uncle's clan....sometimes we had 100 or more walleye on the ice. What has that done??? Well for starters now the limit is 4 per person and only 1 allowed over 18", and you have pissession limits along with daily catch limits.

I'm not beating my chest, I'm tired of people on this forum preaching their ways, suggesting what they do is better then what other people do and also telling people how they should be doing things. This alone is the reason for most fights on here...

If people follow the rules then let them / us do whatever we want. We are legal, we are doing what we love and enjoy and we are having fun. That's all it comes down to, plain and simple.