Monitoring Bore Pressure 10ML-II

[ET1]

I thought I would introduce this concept for some familiarity before Spring when I will be generating my own traces for specific duplex loads I want to explore. This particular trace is made by another individual who I have been in touch with in the past and getting to know him he is very meticulous with his work of generating traces.

For most the main interest is what peak pressure is generated from a specific powder load.
The next part is what my resulting velocity is that has to be measured separately with a chronograph. In this case it was measured with a Magnetospeed unit.
By manually incorporating the velocity into the program it can show us the time when the bullet leaves the bore as well as the relationship of the OBT Node or as some know it as the Sweet Spot.
This PT graph below will be used also for my initial calibration of the unit I own.

So my first trace for duplex in the future will be the 10/60grns of 4759/4198. So anyone that has remaining 4759 wanting to extend its usage you may want to consider going this route. What I don’t know is if the old or new 4759 was used for this trace but resulting velocity should reveal this.
Also be prepared for additional recoil with extra weight of powder and higher velocity than 2300fps. To reduce velocity I would just start with reducing the main 4198 a few grains at a time.

4759-4198 10-60 250gr Bullet.jpg


If you want to read further about the PT Unit or Magnetospeed chronograph you can go to the links I provide.

http://www.shootingsoftware.com/pressure.htm

http://www.magnetospeed.com/




Ed

[MikePal]

Well there you go, I got out of the business so long ago I’m totally unaware of some of the kit that has been developed to do these kind of measurement. When I used to go to DREEV (Quebec city) and Nicolette (Three Rivers) …the labs there were still using lots of analog/tube equipment


What’s actually more amazing, is how much has been miniaturized and put in the hands of the end users on the range. Amazing stuff.


I hadn’t heard about these this MagnetoSpeed equipment using electromagnetic sensors to detect the presence of the bullet. How do they work with the lead bullets most common in ML’s ?

Thanks Ed…you brushing away a few cob webs !!!

[impact]

I hadn’t heard about these this MagnetoSpeed equipment using electromagnetic sensors to detect the presence of the bullet. How do they work with the lead bullets most common in ML’s ?

Will a MagnetoSpeed Chronograph work with solids?

Last Updated: Dec 31, 2012 12:41PM CST

Yes, solids should perform about the same as standard copper-jacked rounds. If the round is made out of something that has very low electrical conductivity (like lead) you may have to make the device more sensitive by changing the bullet type setting, but most solids should work with the default settings.

[MikePal]

Thanks Impact....don't like a company brochure that use the work 'should' though..LOL..

[terrym]

Without a brass cartridge to show increasing pressure signs you are left with the gun itself to show evidence of mounting pressures? Seems risky and potentially destructive to your gun. The ML10 is quite powerful as is why risk injury or damage by tinkering with duplex loads? My group ( 5 of us ) all shoot the Savage and we all shoot the exact same factory recommended loads and have no trouble taking down moose. The last one was 200 yds and went 300 ft before piling up. Clean pass through.

[trailblzr]

What is your moose load terrym? Thanks in advance.

Without a brass cartridge to show increasing pressure signs you are left with the gun itself to show evidence of mounting pressures? Seems risky and potentially destructive to your gun. The ML10 is quite powerful as is why risk injury or damage by tinkering with duplex loads? My group ( 5 of us ) all shoot the Savage and we all shoot the exact same factory recommended loads and have no trouble taking down moose. The last one was 200 yds and went 300 ft before piling up. Clean pass through.

[jaycee]

Without a brass cartridge to show increasing pressure signs you are left with the gun itself to show evidence of mounting pressures? Seems risky and potentially destructive to your gun. The ML10 is quite powerful as is why risk injury or damage by tinkering with duplex loads? My group ( 5 of us ) all shoot the Savage and we all shoot the exact same factory recommended loads and have no trouble taking down moose. The last one was 200 yds and went 300 ft before piling up. Clean pass through.

My thoughts exactly, there have been to many experimenters that have damaged their Savage ML's and then they tell us that it was the "fault of a poorly designed firearm" , there have been lots of these to read about on other forums.
But to each their own , however I wish they wouldn't post this stuff on open forums where the inexperienced would try to experiment also and cause damage to themselves.
This stuff should be on a forum strictly dedicated to those that want to experiment.

[terrym]

My thoughts exactly, there have been to many experimenters that have damaged their Savage ML's and then they tell us that it was the "fault of a poorly designed firearm" , there have been lots of these to read about on other forums.
But to each their own , however I wish they wouldn't post this stuff on open forums where the inexperienced would try to experiment also and cause damage to themselves.
This stuff should be on a forum strictly dedicated to those that want to experiment.

I agree. Too many people who are not familiar with smokeless powder reloading are at risk. A 5% error in a black powder load will just kick harder. A 5% error in smokeless could land you in an emergency ward. Apples & Oranges. The ML10 is a formidable hunting tool and now discontinued due to law suits and incompetent users. Why risk damaging a firearm that has already doubled in value?

[terrym]

What is your moose load terrym? Thanks in advance.

PM sent

[smokeeter]

.

The ML10 is a formidable hunting tool and now discontinued due to law suits and incompetent users. Why risk damaging a firearm that has already doubled in value?

Savage discontinued production because it didn't meet the sales expectations. So now there are no production smokeless muzzleloaders offered there is still plenty of demand for smokeless muzzleloading and plenty of custom builders offering them.
All muzzleloaders have the potential risk of someone using incorrect load/applications.
What Ed is demonstrating ( with the use of pressure tracing) is how the risk of damaging your gun is reduced by using an effective load that brings the barrel pressure down below the Book Load recommendations. How is this a bad thing?
This is proof positive on what the barrel pressures are for a specific load and not just some willy nilly load recommendation by someone that knew someones second cousin twice removed.