Is Wynne dragging down Trudough?

[JBen]

Amazes me that anyone would even contemplate voting for the Liberals whether Wynne was sticking her nose in where it doesn't belong or not. Also not sure why the Fed Libs aren't distancing themselves, given her numbers here are bottoming out.

Not really sure what her "end game" is. Is she just trying to deflect from all the crap here in Ont. Is she power hungry and envisioning a a scenario where its JT led Liberals in Ottawa and Her in Queens Park?

Or is she just completely off the deep end. How why anyone could have voted for her is beyond me.
Cant say they weren't "warned".

makes me laugh when I think about the Harper haters and cries about him being evil, destroying democracy and more....when right here ......
/laugh

one last "bullit".
I can only imagine how "frosty" things will be after the election if Harper and the cons win. If she's whinning now about transfer payments, ORPP help, lack of federal infrastructure help etc.......taking stupid shots at Harper and more...

Way to go Kathleen, almost hope Harper completely slams the door on Ont.
You get what you deserve.

[werner.reiche]

Oh. I don't think Wynne is dragging Trudeau down. I think he is capable of doing that himself whenever he opens his mouth. However, she isn't doing him any favours either. I mean introducing the "new Ontario Pension Plan" during this election was cannon fodder to Harper. He called what it is: a tax. However, I think people are realizing Trudeau is running on his name alone and the two front runners are much stronger than he is.

Going back to the Maclean's debate, how many times did Trudeau call out to the moderator like a kid who just got his favourite toy taken away? 10? 25? What is going to happen if he gets elected and our country faces a serious crisis? Is he going to start whining to the world?

Dyth

Good summary of the situation.

[trimmer21]

I can picture Mulcair talikng to a guy like Putin. It's almost like the Little Chicken Hawk and Foghorn Leghorn. "WHAP! Go 'way,son.you bother me."

[bushman]

Our country already is facing several serious crisis. Putin has claimed the Arctic, ISIS grows more barbaric every day and they are among us waiting to strike terror. Can you imagine JT at a G7 meeting?

According to the left though terrym , these are non issues. Over exaggerated fear mongering , by the right, trying to scare people.

Someday, maybe, likely after its too late they will get their heads out of their collective ar-es and finally smell the roses. I fear it will be too late then, to stop the bleeding. And guess who will whine and cry the most? The same imbeciles that facilitated it in the first place.

The NDP wants to leave all the oil in the ground. So if they form our next parliament,Justin can work with them, dropping winter coats to all the freezing Canadians. After each day's coat drop is done , Tom and Justin will get together, hold hands and sing kumbaya and all will be well.

[terrym]

and all will be well.

Doesn't matter what happens in the country or the world for that matter. If you are on the Federal payroll none of it affects your standard of living.

[sawbill]

TM, while I usually agree with your posts this is not entirely true. Most employees of most governments are basically blue collar workers. They do enjoy almost guaranteed pensions (which they contribute to) but they still face lay-offs, salary caps, etc. the same as private industry workers.

[werner.reiche]

TM, while I usually agree with your posts this is not entirely true. Most employees of most governments are basically blue collar workers. They do enjoy almost guaranteed pensions (which they contribute to) but they still face lay-offs, salary caps, etc. the same as private industry workers.

Government works (including those working for crown corporations) situations re: layoffs, salary caps, etc are nothing at all like those faced by private industry workers, especially non-union workers. Most government layoffs are through attrition (gold-plated early retirement) and transfers to other departments. Most private industry layoffs result in unemployed people.

[JBen]

Sawbill, I myself tend to fall somewhere in the middle on most all topics. By that I mean, I keep an open mind, appreciate all points/sides. I cant speak to federal numbers, as I haven't seen many produced but a couple. When taken with salt, I say ok. But in the end I tend to look at it as the overall size and cost of gov't. On this the jury is in.

That said.
There is no way, those in PS have felt the pinch and contraction 2008 and on, like "private" has. It's largely true that PS is "immune" to downturns (not exactly accurate many do lose jobs etc) one only need look at various reports, studies and statistics to see the truth of it. That's been "true" since forever.

Now take the recent job posting for COs, who I think we can all agree have gotten the short end for years.
$1,300 to $1,400/week gross or up to $72,800 annualized. And that's before benefits and their Pension. That is as much as the mean [b]duo[/u] income, and for many of those families they don't have Pensions.

And while it's true people contribute to their Pensions, what get vs what they kick in and whats picked up by tax payers..........
Many of whom can only dream......

Its whacked, badly so somewhere, many wheres.
Take "teachers"...despite raises (prior to 2010) and then freezes for some.
Do they not still get their ladder raises for X years...
So while the peons in "private" who if they haven't lost their jobs, aren't seeing much in the way of raises (1.5%)...

That's stats don't lie and they show quite clearly how over the past few decades PS has gotten their cake and eat it to...

Answers?
Other than booting Unions hard...Don't know.. What I do know is that when economies contract (recessions) PS (broad brush stroke) doesn't feel it anywhere near as much...Likely that needs to be, cant be laying off all kinds...However their contracts keep seeing them getting raises that aren't realistic ( They got 4% when times were good last year....and keep getting that, while everyone else...) Or many get raises based on years service (where in the world other than that do people get raises simply for X years)....Their pensions and more..Then as soon as the economy picks up again, they pick up again...

Personally I wonder if there doesn't in fact need to be more years of freezes and once things are a little better aka "balanced", legislate "raises" to inflation less a small spread. If inflation/cost of living is 2%, then PS gets 1.5%. At least that way, when things go south it wont result in growth that outstrips what the peons paying for everything are seeing.

Consider this.
ORPP...only the peons are going to lose yet another 2%
If its raided for infrastructure...its the peons losing or rather paying for that.
If people die before retirement...its the peons paying, and its the peons children getting robbed.


I wonder how popular Ms Wynnne would have been if instead her new pension supplement was a 4% tax on PS to help fund trhe peons plans.

Was a time about 40 years ago, when you traded comp for benefits and better security (not immunity)...Today its been shown over and over and over, that across the board, from the janitors to the gold plated politicians...They have better benefits, better pay...and security, largely "immune" to economic downturns

[terrym]

"Infrastructure" is code for expanded PS jobs. The Peons are going to be squeezed an extra 1.9% to hire more PS at 14% higher wages than comparable private sector positions. Add in the tax funded legacy costs of gold plated pensions and the peon gets screwed again. A government worker contributes what 25% max into their pension plan? I pay the 75% extra. If the used that extra 14% they get and invest into their own pension portfolios they would still outpace private sector peons. It's time to cut taxpayer funded pensions. We can't afford them. The lifetime 14% premium in wages is enough to cover retirement portfolios. "Infrastructure" is code for more unionized liberal voters with cash for life positions.

[JBen]

While all the plans (I believe) are DBPs (very expensive), not all the plans are the same Terry and employee contributions differ with some being as much as 50%.

Regardless of how much or how little (hydro 1 I believe is for every employee $, tax payers contribute 4) it's still whacked.

The peons are literally working hard so others don't have to. And the way this admin has driven the province into the ground resulting in higher taxes, fees, having to sell assets to pay for infrastructure or simply not having $$ now for healthcare, education, MoE and MNR. Hydro and more over and above....

Should have people infuriated. For all the "griping" about Harper, or greedy CEOs or A to Z......

Anywho. To the "point" about the broad PS largely being immune, it's "true". There are always exceptions, and people shouldn't forget that. However that "immunity" is one reason why things have gotten "out of control".

No way Unions will ever agree to changes due to reality (downturns when they occur). So.......