Vaccine seems to be working in Ontario

Based on this data, and comparing to a year ago, the vaccine seems to be doing
a very good job at controlling both the number of infections and certainly the hospitalizations.

Ontario Dashboard - Ontario COVID-19 Science Advisory Table (covid19-sciencetable.ca)

It seems ICU occupancy is almost as high as it was a year ago (although still a bit lower) ... but the majority of that is with unvaccinated individuals,
if we compare the chart "Daily COVID-19 Hospital and ICU Occupancy in Ontario" to "COVID-19 Patients in ICU".

We've had a good 4 to 5 solid weeks of being in the peak zone for virus transmission (5'C to 14'C, with peak at 11'C). That should have been enough
time to test the theory that the virus would break out significantly with colder weather, despite the vaccine. Looks like to me the vaccine is working ...
and let's not forget, this time last year we were basically in full lockdown, whereas right now, we can do pretty much whatever we want ... even sit next
to people in movie theaters and hockey rinks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkB

It seems ICU occupancy is almost as high as it was a year ago (although still a bit lower) ... but the majority of that is with unvaccinated individuals,

---

Not at some hospitals:

Quote:

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Most RIH outbreak patients vaccinated, with majority of cases mild
Of the 36 patients who have tested positive in the four concurrent COVID-19 outbreaks at Royal Inland Hospital, 31 were fully immunized, two were partially immunized and three were not vaccinated. There have been three deaths

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Not at some hospitals:

---

You post quotes but never post links to the source. This might explain why. The complete story paints a different picture.

https://www.kamloopsthisweek.com/loc...s-mild-4762983

Quote:

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Most RIH outbreak patients vaccinated, with majority of cases mild

Of the 36 patients who have tested positive in the four concurrent COVID-19 outbreaks at Royal Inland Hospital, 31 were fully immunized, two were partially immunized and three were not vaccinated. There have been three deaths

about 4 hours ago By: Kamloops This Week Staff

Of the 36 patients who have tested positive in the four concurrent COVID-19 outbreaks at Royal Inland Hospital, 31 were fully immunized, two were partially immunized and three were not vaccinated.

The patients are in the hospital for non-COVID-19-related issues and are not patients in the hospital’s COVID-19 units, where vaccination rates are “extraordinary lower,” according to Interior Health in communication with KTW.

Interior Health said that of the 36 people who were in RIH when they contracted COVID-19, three are in critical care as of Monday, with the vast majority of cases being mild and discovered through asymptomatic testing.

“Fortunately, these statistics demonstrate how the COVID-19 vaccine can prevent severe illness and death,” Interior Health told KTW. “We are also fortunate to have very few deaths related to this outbreak due to the high vaccination uptake.”

As of Monday, there have been a total of 45 cases connected to the quartet of outbreaks — 36 patients and nine RIH staff members.

There have been three deaths, though whether the deceased were vaccinated or had co-morbidities has not been revealed, due to privacy concerns.

The outbreaks are on unit 5 South (medical ward, declared on Nov. 2), unit 7 North (renal/cardiac ward, declared on Nov. 8), unit 6 South (surgical ward, declared on Nov. 10) and unit 5 North (stroke/rehab ward, declared on Nov. 13).

The health authority had maintained throughout outbreaks at RIH that it is safe for people to visit for emergency care.

However that changed on Nov. 10 when Interior Health said only essential visitors are permitted at Royal Inland Hospital. Essential visitors include:

• Visits for compassionate care: including critical illness, palliative care, hospice care, end-of-life and medical assistance in dying;

• Visits to patients in the emergency department or intensive care unit;

• Visits for pediatric care, labour and delivery;

• Visits necessary to support a patient’s physical care (such as help with feeding or mobility), mental well-being or decision-making.

Interior Health said all services continue to be available at RIH, adding that the hospital remains safe to visit for anyone needing emergency care.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

You post quotes but never post links to the source. This might explain why. The complete story paints a different picture.

https://www.kamloopsthisweek.com/loc...s-mild-4762983

---

Oh but the unvaccinated that are in the hospital for other various reasons never get a mention like the vaccinated lol.

It's just the unvaccinated.


Almost booster time apparently even Anthony Fauci said the other day that the protection from hospitalization and death is waning already.



Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fishfood

Oh but the unvaccinated that are in the hospital for other various reasons never get a mention like the vaccinated lol.

It's just the unvaccinated.

---

There was an outbreak in the hospital. The unvaccinated who were in the hospital for others reasons caught the virus there.

https://www.radionl.com/2021/11/02/a...land-hospital/

Vaccines work you say?

https://i.imgur.com/3QiBnLj.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/1qHzu23.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

There was an outbreak in the hospital. The unvaccinated who were in the hospital for others reasons caught the virus there.

https://www.radionl.com/2021/11/02/a...land-hospital/

---

I was just tossing jokes about how they piped up so fast about the vaccinated. Many have been to the hospital for different reasons unvaccinated but they never tell you. They just toss everything at the unvaccinated it's part of their tools to manipulate you lol. The unvaccinated are the problem they say.

This is an outbreak at the hospital I see. I said that would happen when you suppress the symptoms and still allow transmission. This is why I didn't get the push for 100 % compliance how do you tell who has the virus?

Even playing hockey fully vaccinated testing 3 times a day? Why for ? So they spread it ?

I'm staying a pure blood.



Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Badenoch

You post quotes but never post links to the source. This might explain why. The complete story paints a different picture.

---

It doesn't clarify anything. it states, clearly, 33 fully/partial patients of 36 patients in the hospital have tested positive for the virus.

Positive case counts don't include where they were they were tested and it never said that they were hospitalized because of Covid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by impact

Vaccines work you say?

https://i.imgur.com/3QiBnLj.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/1qHzu23.jpg

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You're quoting Randy Hillier? Really? If you intend to maintain even a modicum of crebility,you need to do a lot better work than this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trimmer21

You're quoting Randy Hillier? Really? If you intend to maintain even a modicum of crebility,you need to do a lot better work than this.

---

Who do you think supports Randy? Your former co-workers.....

https://www.mounties4freedom.com/partnerships

Quote:

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Originally Posted by impact

Who do you think supports Randy? Your former co-workers.....

https://www.mounties4freedom.com/partnerships

---

Yeah,right. Funny they're all about Canadian rights and freedoms except when it comes to firearm owners.

Then theres manywho refuse to acknowledge natural immunity becomes greater over time as more people contract and recover from covid-19. Anyone who has natural antibodies have much greater protection.
MSM and our corrupt government continues to spread fear that vaccines are the only way to protect. Such a load crap. Follow the money
Attachment 42693
Attachment 42694

Truth they can't hide
Attachment 42697

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Not at some hospitals:

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Yeah Mike ... so what is that per 1,000,000 of people vs. non-vaxxed per 1,000,000 million?

Also, what would the number be if no one was vaxxed there? I'd think probably 500 to 1000.

That number means nothing if it is not relative to what it would be with non-vaxxed population.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by impact

Vaccines work you say?

https://i.imgur.com/3QiBnLj.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/1qHzu23.jpg

---

Yeah, they work ... ask Italy what happens when COVID gets out of control in an unvaccinated population.
The death rates make those illness look like the tip of an iceberg.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fishfood

I was just tossing jokes about how they piped up so fast about the vaccinated. Many have been to the hospital for different reasons unvaccinated but they never tell you. They just toss everything at the unvaccinated it's part of their tools to manipulate you lol. The unvaccinated are the problem they say.

This is an outbreak at the hospital I see. I said that would happen when you suppress the symptoms and still allow transmission. This is why I didn't get the push for 100 % compliance how do you tell who has the virus?

Even playing hockey fully vaccinated testing 3 times a day? Why for ? So they spread it ?

I'm staying a pure blood.



Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

---

My kid plays hockey two times a week, doesn't need to do any tests ... he's fully vaccinated ... he and his team mates
are healthy and having a great time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by canadaman30

Then theres manywho refuse to acknowledge natural immunity becomes greater over time as more people contract and recover from covid-19. Anyone who has natural antibodies have much greater protection.
MSM and our corrupt government continues to spread fear that vaccines are the only way to protect. Such a load crap. Follow the money
Attachment 42693
Attachment 42694

Truth they can't hide
Attachment 42697

---

Really?

Last I checked we still need Polio shots, Tetnus ... etc, etc., etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkB

Yeah, they work ... ask Italy what happens when COVID gets out of control in an unvaccinated population.
The death rates make those illness look like the tip of an iceberg.

---

Apparently not here in BC

https://brightlightnews.com/49-of-b-...ly-vaccinated/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

Really?

Last I checked we still need Polio shots, Tetnus ... etc, etc., etc.

---

None of those long time vaccines had anything to do with genetic manipulation of the body by mRNA technology. That 's the big difference that should be as plain as the nose on your face. There is nothing similar about it, apples and oranges. It hasn't even finished trials yet and in the past has never even made it through animal testing. The least you could do to sound somewhat rational is to see and admit that. All this BS about the new variants to scare everyone and they didn't even change the formula to address that. It's all lies.

Mrna does not change your DNA. Not sure where or why you keep making that up.

If you want to play with DNA, buy the crispr tool.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smitty55

None of those long time vaccines had anything to do with genetic manipulation of the body by mRNA technology. That 's the big difference that should be as plain as the nose on your face. There is nothing similar about it, apples and oranges. It hasn't even finished trials yet and in the past has never even made it through animal testing. The least you could do to sound somewhat rational is to see and admit that. All this BS about the new variants to scare everyone and they didn't even change the formula to address that. It's all lies.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

Based on this data, and comparing to a year ago, the vaccine seems to be doing
a very good job at controlling both the number of infections and certainly the hospitalizations.

Ontario Dashboard - Ontario COVID-19 Science Advisory Table (covid19-sciencetable.ca)

It seems ICU occupancy is almost as high as it was a year ago (although still a bit lower) ... but the majority of that is with unvaccinated individuals,
if we compare the chart "Daily COVID-19 Hospital and ICU Occupancy in Ontario" to "COVID-19 Patients in ICU".

We've had a good 4 to 5 solid weeks of being in the peak zone for virus transmission (5'C to 14'C, with peak at 11'C). That should have been enough
time to test the theory that the virus would break out significantly with colder weather, despite the vaccine. Looks like to me the vaccine is working ...
and let's not forget, this time last year we were basically in full lockdown, whereas right now, we can do pretty much whatever we want ... even sit next
to people in movie theaters and hockey rinks!

---

Is it the vaccine or is it the fact that so many people have recovered from covid naturally?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

Yeah, they work ... ask Italy what happens when COVID gets out of control in an unvaccinated population.
The death rates make those illness look like the tip of an iceberg.

---

Italy has one of the oldest populations in the world. The same demo that is most at risk and who makes up the majority of covid deaths worldwide.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by greatwhite

Mrna does not change your DNA. Not sure where or why you keep making that up.

If you want to play with DNA, buy the crispr tool.

---

Who ever made such claims besides yourself? You continue to grasp at straws with false claims. Reminds me of the other false accusations you make about member ok with punching kids in the face. Very weak counters on your part..lol
Attachment 42701

Quote:

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Originally Posted by canadaman30

Apparently not here in BC

https://brightlightnews.com/49-of-b-...ly-vaccinated/

---

Yeah, apparently if you're +80 years old, the vaccine doesn't work in BC ... lol ... 70 of those 89 vaccinated deaths were people OVER THE AGE OF 80!
Skew the data why don't you.

STOP SPREADING THE FEAR!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkB

70 of those 89 vaccinated deaths were people OVER THE AGE OF 80!

---

The over 80 group account for 63% of all Covid deaths...vaccinated or not. ...if you drop that to 50+ age group they account for 92% of ALL covid deaths... since the beginning. Being vaccinated hasn't really changed that ratio...

see table 7a..page 12...at:

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-...tion.pdf?la=en

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bushwhacker

Italy has one of the oldest populations in the world. The same demo that is most at risk and who makes up the majority of covid deaths worldwide.

---

True, but the doctor on scene that I was in direct comms with said lots of 30 and 40 year olds, they had to pick and choose who was going to live or die.
He told me in that case, they did not treat the elderly ... they prioritized younger people who had a better chance of survival.

The data is actually hard to filter out and see a simple "what is the answer" because the circumstances have an impact on the answers. For example, what
would have happened if NO Italians were treated ... what proportion of the deaths would have been younger people? Because younger people got the treatment bias,
it's impossible to know.

But for sure I can tell you ... those people in Italy, whether young or old ... were badly effected. The doctors were in panic, depressed, crying ... imagine having to choose
for someone to die ... imagine that decision is on you ... and you have to tell the family why you made that decision. They will scream at you, plead, cry, fight ... ALL the hate
is directed at you, because you made the decision to take their loved one away. This is not fear mongering at all (in case someone here calls me out on that) ... the doctor I
spoke to literally hated his life while that was happening!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MikePal

The over 80 group account for 63% of all Covid deaths...vaccinated or not. ...if you drop that to 50+ age group they account for 92% of ALL covid deaths... since the beginning. Being vaccinated hasn't really changed that ratio...

---

Mike, stop moving the goal posts. HE posted data from an area in BC ... let's stick to that ...
70 out of the 89 people in that report were people over 80 years old. PERIOD.

He's fear mongering by not presenting ALL THE TRUTH.

You change data just to suit your argument ... stick to the specific subject/data (as you've told others to do).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkB

Mike, stop moving the goal posts. HE posted data from an area in BC ... let's stick to that ...
70 out of the 89 people in that report were people over 80 years old. PERIOD.

He's fear mongering by not presenting ALL THE TRUTH.

You change data just to suit your argument ... stick to the specific subject/data (as you've told others to do).

---

I think Mike might be to on something before the vaccine who made up the majority of the deaths?
Almost 50 percent came from long care

People over 80 made up a small amount of the cases reported and make up the largest deaths.

When new Brunswick See's double the amount of case double the amount of deaths after the highly successful vaccine campaign. That means its working right ?

He didn't change any goal post it's what's been happening.

Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

I just posted this link in previous post ..show that the ratios haven't changed

see table 7a Hospitalzations page 12 ..table 7b deaths....page 13.

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-...tion.pdf?la=en

Quote:

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Originally Posted by greatwhite

Mrna does not change your DNA. Not sure where or why you keep making that up.

If you want to play with DNA, buy the crispr tool.

---

So what you're saying is that mRNA and RNA have nothing to do with genetics? Is that right?
So I guess you think the covid vaccine is the same as all previous ones too? That's the point I was making, but it went right over your head as usual.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fishfood

I think Mike might be to on something before the vaccine who made up the majority of the deaths?
Almost 50 percent came from long care

People over 80 made up a small amount of the cases reported and make up the largest deaths.

When new Brunswick See's double the amount of case double the amount of deaths after the highly successful vaccine campaign. That means its working right ?

He didn't change any goal post it's what's been happening.

Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

---

I'm refering to the fact that the ARTICLE posted by CanadaMan says that most of the vaccinated deaths are people over 80 years old.
CanadaMan left that important detail out ... and so did the chart he posted ... it made out like the vaccine was generally failing, then you
go into the ariticle and it says the vaccinated that died were almost all over 80 years old!

I just don't like how people skew data, take things out of context ... just to suit a view.
The fact is, there is a much higher % of unvaccinated in hospital than vaccinated ... and that includes +40 year olds.
For sure, there is an older age bias ... you guys don't have to convince me of that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MarkB

The fact is, there is a much higher % of unvaccinated in hospital than vaccinated ...

---

Uhhh NO !!

looks pretty close to 50/50 to me... (when you add the partially vaccinated).. HaHa...

https://i.imgur.com/391Fy2ul.jpg

from : table 7a..page 12...at:

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-...tion.pdf?la=en

First hand account on how well the vaccines work.

https://t.me/RedOctoberQ/1241

Yup...pretty darn close to 50/50 %

pretty hard to twist the data from Health Ontario Mark...

as of Nov 19 Ontario:

In hospital

Unvaccinated 95
Partially vaccinated 13
Fully vaccinated 64

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/e...ol?tab=summary

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MikePal

Yup...pretty darn close to 50/50 %

pretty hard to twist the data from Health Ontario Mark...

as of Nov 19 Ontario:

In hospital

Unvaccinated 95
Partially vaccinated 13
Fully vaccinated 64

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/e...ol?tab=summary

---

It's hard to twist the data but easy to leave out some relevant details. Your cases are in hospital but not in ICU. Meanwhile in ICUs

Unvaccinated 55 (75.3%)
Partially vaccinated 6 (8.2%)
Fully vaccinated 12 (16.4%)

https://covid-19.ontario.ca/data

As well there are, in Ontario, 6 times as many vaccinated as unvaccinated. 15% of the population, 75% of the ICU admissions.

So, about 70 people in all of Ontario are in ICU for multiple reasons and have also tested positive for the flu.
And people are worried about that insignificant number?
Get a life!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

Uhhh NO !!

looks pretty close to 50/50 to me... (when you add the partially vaccinated).. HaHa...

https://i.imgur.com/391Fy2ul.jpg

from : table 7a..page 12...at:

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/-...tion.pdf?la=en

---

Mike, you seem to laugh a lot "haha" like this is some kind of game, "Haha"

Anyhow, let me clarify where you once again misinterpreted what I said ... but I'll give you this one, because I was not explicit.
% of the population of unvaccinated vs. % of the population that is unvaccinated.
The % for unvaccinated is 35x higher than the vaccinated.
That's HUGE.
HAHA.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

Yup...pretty darn close to 50/50 %

pretty hard to twist the data from Health Ontario Mark...

as of Nov 19 Ontario:

In hospital

Unvaccinated 95
Partially vaccinated 13
Fully vaccinated 64

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/e...ol?tab=summary

---

Mike, here's the math ...

95 unvaccinated / 1.3 million = 73 per million
(64+13) vaccinated/partilally vaxxed / 10.8 million = 7.1 million

In ICU:

55 unvaxxed / 1.3 million = 42.3 per million
18 vaxxed / 10.8 million = 1.7 per million

42.3 vs. 1.7 ... yeah, the numbers don't lie, the vaccine works!
"HAHA"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by impact

So, about 70 people in all of Ontario are in ICU for multiple reasons and have also tested positive for the flu.
And people are worried about that insignificant number?
Get a life!

---

Because the vaccine is working !!!!
If we didn't have a vaccine, the ICU count would probably be over 1000!!!
Damn ... now you guys taking credit for the low numbers due to the vaccinated???? And saying there's no problem???
That in itself is indirect admission the vaccine is working!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

Because the vaccine is working !!!!
If we didn't have a vaccine, the ICU count would probably be over 1000!!!
Damn ... now you guys taking credit for the low numbers due to the vaccinated???? And saying there's no problem???
That in itself is indirect admission the vaccine is working!

---

The only thing the vaccine is working at doing is injuring people.
Prove me wrong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by impact

And people are worried about that insignificant number?

---

You'd think instead of bragging that double vaxxers represent only 15% in the ICU, you'd be wondering why they got lied to and sold a vaccine billed as 100% effective at keeping you from getting so sick you wouldn't end up in an ICU...

Wait a few more months, as they found in Isreal, that 15% will continue to grow as the Magic Exlixcer continues to degrade. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

If we didn't have a vaccine, the ICU count would probably be over 1000!!!

---

Love to see the scientific data to support your claim of "would probably be" ....:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

the numbers don't lie, the vaccine works!

---

Well...since we were discussing the failure of the vaccine to prevent double vaxxers from getting infected with the virus, of course, we use the number of Hospitalizations. It's the most accurate gauge of what is going on.

Positive cases are considered flawed (multiple false positives) and ICU has more to do with comorbidity issues....ie people are admitted to the ICU for other issue and then test positive for the virus.

So using the Public Health Numbers, as I did, for 'Hospitalizations' is the best tool to reflect what is happening in the general population that are being adversely affected by the virus.

So using grade 5 math : )

The total hospitalized is 172; (95 unvaxxed...77 full and partial vaxxed)

95 represents 55%
77 represents 45%

That's is close to 50% ..now was that so hard to understand.

What happens in the ICU is irrelevant to this discussion.

Now that wasn't so hard,

.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

Love to see the scientific data to support your claim of "would probably be" ....:)

---

See Italy 2020.

But I love how you guys think all the numbers are low in hospital ... but can't admit it's because of the vaccine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by impact

The only thing the vaccine is working at doing is injuring people.
Prove me wrong.

---

LET'S SEE IF YOU WILL READ THIS, BECAUSE I ONLY POSTED IT LIKE 20 TIMES.

IN ICU:

55 unvaxxed / 1.3 million = 42.3 per million
18 vaxxed / 10.8 million = 1.7 per million

42.3 vs. 1.7 ... yeah, the numbers don't lie, the vaccine works!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

You'd think instead of bragging that double vaxxers represent only 15% in the ICU, you'd be wondering why they got lied to and sold a vaccine billed as 100% effective at keeping you from getting so sick you wouldn't end up in an ICU...

Wait a few more months, as they found in Isreal, that 15% will continue to grow as the Magic Exlixcer continues to degrade. :)

---

Yeah Mike .... you guys said by now, due to the colder weather the vaccine would stop working,
but here we are ... guess you were wrong about that.

No one got lied to ... there's still a 30x reduction in ICU admissions for vaccinated people ... the vaccine works!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

Well...since we were discussing the failure of the vaccine to prevent double vaxxers from getting infected with the virus, of course, we use the number of Hospitalizations. It's the most accurate gauge of what is going on.

Positive cases are considered flawed (multiple false positives) and ICU has more to do with comorbidity issues....ie people are admitted to the ICU for other issue and then test positive for the virus.

So using the Public Health Numbers, as I did, for 'Hospitalizations' is the best tool to reflect what is happening in the general population that are being adversely affected by the virus.

So using grade 5 math : )

The total hospitalized is 172; (95 unvaxxed...77 full and partial vaxxed)

95 represents 55%
77 represents 45%

That's is close to 50% ..now was that so hard to understand.

What happens in the ICU is irrelevant to this discussion.

Now that wasn't so hard,

.

---

Mike ... let's do grade 3 math, because your version of grade 5 math still is missing the major point. :)

Let's say there are 10 unvaccinated people, and 1000 vaccinated people.
Let's say 5 unvaccinated people are in hospital, and 5 vaccinated people are in hospital.
You're saying oh look, vaccine doesn't work because there are JUST AS MANY vaccinated in hospital as unvaccinated.
This is where you're statistics are flawed ... you see in this example 50% of the unvaccinated people get sick and are in hospital,
while only 0.5% of the vaccinated people are in hospital.

YOU HAVE TO COMPARE THE hospitalization per million. It's the only way to have a fair, statistical comparison ...

If you can't understand that ... then you know what, let's stop arguing ... because you won't ever get it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

What happens in the ICU is irrelevant to this discussion.

---

Yes they could be in the ICU for a number of reasons and catch the virus . Would be no different then what they have already been doing. Using every tool available to push the shot.

Imagine that the ICU numbers would be the only proper numbers? How can you believe these numbers when we know for a fact they have mislead every other number.


Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

If you can't understand that ... then you know what, let's stop arguing ... because you won't ever get it.

---

Your crunching of ICU numbers doesn't mean diddle squat, the real issue is the vaccine no longer prevents 45 % of fully/partial vaccinated people from showing up at a hospital in Ontario. They get infected, become contagious no different than 50% of the unvaccinated.

How sick you get is another issue not yet arrived here, but the same thing is happening in other countries where ICU beds are filling up with fully vaccinated people

Now we're heading into mandatory 'Boosters' by the new year... not hard to foresee, it's going on in other countries already..you can't get your 'Verified' Green Passes anymore unless you have a 3rd shot Booster....thats' because the vaccine in an abject failure in preventing you from getting infected. And since the whole point of all these lockdowns, restrictions and social engineering was it was to stop the spreading of the virus in the first place.

Simply put...and statistically proven, the vaccine has failed to prevent the spreading of the virus after 4-6 months....not too hard to prove.

The vaccine is a failure in preventing people from getting and spreading the virus..

Yesterday's numbers in Toronto: ..

Of the 711 new cases on Thursday, 322 are in people who are unvaccinated and 314 are in people fully immunized.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

See Italy 2020.

But I love how you guys think all the numbers are low in hospital ... but can't admit it's because of the vaccine.

---

Maybe you should look back to pre covid numbers in hospitals which generally are at fairly high levels as a norm. You know all those other diseases and trauma and scheduled surgeries that keep hospitals busy. I've seen some real scary numbers about the amount of serious results and many deaths due to postponed treatments and surgeries due to what turned out to be baseless speculation and fear of filling up hospitals. Maybe you you could find those stats. Then of course there is the major increase in suicides, heavy drug use and overdoses, and violent crime that is associated with the drug trade. These are all known stats that are happening everywhere from small towns to big cities. Worst part of it all is, none of this is because of the virus itself, it's all a response to what governments have turned society into for the last two years
I do have a question for you Mark. Perhaps I missed it somewhere but I never see you acknowledge all the adverse reactions from these jabs around the world to the point where it's being claimed that these vaccines are now causing more deaths than they prevent from covid itself. How do you respond to those legit numbers from governments sites even, like the VAERS site which now has over 3/4 million reports in what is normally considered to be well under reported as a rule. Before this, a vaccine with these numbers never would have lasted long.
I also wonder how you can explain how the two most unrestricted states in the US with no vaccine mandates and mask mandates also have the lowest numbers in the whole country. The same thing applies to countries like Sweden who never shut down their country at all, never had any or very minor sorts of restrictions on freedoms and are doing just fine. Meanwhile countries like Israel and Ireland with some of the highest vaccination rates in the world also now have the highest rates of active cases and hospitalizations.
You also seem to totally ignore how money is actually the root of all this around the world, where big pharma is bringing in billions per month while conveniently providing false claims about the efficacy of a barely tested experimental procedure that turns out isn't very good at all is now on it's third jab and being forced on children now who don't need it. Now this booster hasn't even been changed to address this oh so scary delta variant for some odd reason and they've even cut the dosage in half, no doubt to try and mitigate the side effects and calm the waters.
One last question for you. Now that big pharma has turned the narrative again all around the world it seems, to now proclaim that booster shots are necessary to be considered fully vaxxed, so for employment, travel and all the normal things we used to do without having to provide ID and QR codes and private medical info under the guise of spreading the virus. It's an admitted fact that these vaccine's efficacy have so far proved to be poor after 6 months, yet now they want you to get another shot of the same thing but in a smaller dose that may not even last as long as the bigger dose. So I'm just curious as to how many shots of an experimental invasion of your body you are going to keep lining up for before you finally wake up and start to at least question what's really going on. Will it be #4 in midsummer when the first booster fails again or #5 six months later as Pfizer laughs all the way to the bank?
Lastly, again maybe I missed a post where you mentioned it before, but does your obvious support for these measures also apply to the millions of people who have developed a far superior natural immunity to covid that also naturally works on variants, this from often just getting over mild symptoms. Or does that not matter to you, everyone must get jabbed, and again too if they say so. Just wondering
Cheers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

LET'S SEE IF YOU WILL READ THIS, BECAUSE I ONLY POSTED IT LIKE 20 TIMES.

IN ICU:

55 unvaxxed / 1.3 million = 42.3 per million
18 vaxxed / 10.8 million = 1.7 per million

42.3 vs. 1.7 ... yeah, the numbers don't lie, the vaccine works!

---

Your not very good at this, are you.
Recycling the same meaningless stats.


https://i.imgur.com/NyGPPPR.png

The scary thing is in 2018 the nature posted about mRNA vaccines.
Said in humans it can negatively affect the innate immune response. Can cause autoimmune response , thrombosis along with a few other things.
Also said it should be used with caution moving forward .

Wonder how much safer it became before being being unleashed into the world. Seems we are seeing what they already knew.

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Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fishfood

Also said it should be used with caution moving forward .

---

As part of the trials they are running on the general population now, there are seeing more and more autoimmune issues cropping in otherwise perfectly healthy people, both young and old.

But no one seems to be overly alarmed, at least not enough to restrict the vaccine to only those who are at risk..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

As part of the trials they are running on the general population now, there are seeing more and more autoimmune issues cropping in otherwise perfectly healthy people, both young and old.

But no one seems to be overly alarmed, at least not enough to restrict the vaccine to only those who are at risk..

---

Yes we are still seeing what they seen. Are we now in the larger preclinical study?



"Several different mRNA vaccines have now been tested from phase I to IIb clinical studies and have been shown to be safe and reasonably well tolerated (Tables 2, 3). However, recent human trials have demonstrated moderate and in rare cases severe injection site or systemic reactions for different mRNA platforms22,91. Potential safety concerns that are likely to be evaluated in future preclinical and clinical studies include local and systemic inflammation, the biodistribution and persistence of expressed immunogen, stimulation of auto-reactive antibodies and potential toxic effects of any non-native nucleotides and delivery system components. A possible concern could be that some mRNA-based vaccine platforms54,166 induce potent type I interferon responses, which have been associated not only with inflammation but also potentially with autoimmunity167,168. Thus, identification of individuals at an increased risk of autoimmune reactions before mRNA vaccination may allow reasonable precautions to be taken. Another potential safety issue could derive from the presence of extracellular RNA during mRNA vaccination. Extracellular naked RNA has been shown to increase the permeability of tightly packed endothelial cells and may thus contribute to oedema169. Another study showed that extracellular RNA promoted blood coagulation and pathological thrombus formation170. Safety will therefore need continued evaluation as different mRNA modalities and delivery systems are utilized for the first time in humans and are tested in larger patient populations."

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And yet ...the zealots are scrambling to inject THAT into their kids.....really makes one shake their heads...

So it looks like this is now happening:

Attachment 42729


In other news, Dr. Fauci is now expressing concern over the uptick in hospitalizations among those 'fully vaccinated' for covid.
Next logical step? You guessed it, forever boosters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

And yet ...the zealots are scrambling to inject THAT into their kids.....really makes one shake their heads...

---

That's from a 2018 report Mike just to make that clear but it wasn't long before the pandemic.

Did they clear these problems up before mass production they did come out years ahead of schedule. And yes we are seeing what was reported then.




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Quote:

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Originally Posted by fishfood

That's from a 2018 report Mike just to make that clear but it wasn't long before the pandemic.

---

yea I was aware...they didn't have time to fix and re-trial it..so they just went ahead under an 'Emergency use' and here we are today, lab rats, for big Pharma..:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

Your crunching of ICU numbers doesn't mean diddle squat, the real issue is the vaccine no longer prevents 45 % of fully/partial vaccinated people from showing up at a hospital in Ontario. They get infected, become contagious no different than 50% of the unvaccinated.

How sick you get is another issue not yet arrived here, but the same thing is happening in other countries where ICU beds are filling up with fully vaccinated people

Now we're heading into mandatory 'Boosters' by the new year... not hard to foresee, it's going on in other countries already..you can't get your 'Verified' Green Passes anymore unless you have a 3rd shot Booster....thats' because the vaccine in an abject failure in preventing you from getting infected. And since the whole point of all these lockdowns, restrictions and social engineering was it was to stop the spreading of the virus in the first place.

Simply put...and statistically proven, the vaccine has failed to prevent the spreading of the virus after 4-6 months....not too hard to prove.

The vaccine is a failure in preventing people from getting and spreading the virus..

Yesterday's numbers in Toronto: ..

Of the 711 new cases on Thursday, 322 are in people who are unvaccinated and 314 are in people fully immunized.

---

Mike. So far, the ICU cases are MUCH lower for vaccinated people. The numbers show that.
The objective of the vaccine has ALWAYS been to keep people out of hospital, and especially the ICU, to avoid a repeat of places like Italy. ALWAYS ... it's you who
are moving the goal posts by focusing only on whether someone is infected or not ... it's irrelevant. If you come in contact with the virus, vaccinated or not, you will likely be infected!
WHO CARES, when the vaccinated are infected, but it's nothing more than a few sniffles? It means the vaccine is working!

You are speculating that it won't be the case for very long, and that ICU cases will go through the roof for vaccinated ... so far the Ontario stats say you are wrong about that.
We've had at least 5 weeks now of cold weather, and people are mingling as if there's no virus out there, in restaurants, shops, etc. Yet, the numbers are not even close to what
they were Oct/Nov 2020 ...

So that's where you and I are different ... until I see proof/evidence that the vaccine is not helping keep people out of ICU (if the # per million is exact same as unvaxxed) ... then I will
believe the numbers in front of us.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smitty55

Maybe you should look back to pre covid numbers in hospitals which generally are at fairly high levels as a norm. You know all those other diseases and trauma and scheduled surgeries that keep hospitals busy. I've seen some real scary numbers about the amount of serious results and many deaths due to postponed treatments and surgeries due to what turned out to be baseless speculation and fear of filling up hospitals. Maybe you you could find those stats. Then of course there is the major increase in suicides, heavy drug use and overdoses, and violent crime that is associated with the drug trade. These are all known stats that are happening everywhere from small towns to big cities. Worst part of it all is, none of this is because of the virus itself, it's all a response to what governments have turned society into for the last two years
I do have a question for you Mark. Perhaps I missed it somewhere but I never see you acknowledge all the adverse reactions from these jabs around the world to the point where it's being claimed that these vaccines are now causing more deaths than they prevent from covid itself. How do you respond to those legit numbers from governments sites even, like the VAERS site which now has over 3/4 million reports in what is normally considered to be well under reported as a rule. Before this, a vaccine with these numbers never would have lasted long.
I also wonder how you can explain how the two most unrestricted states in the US with no vaccine mandates and mask mandates also have the lowest numbers in the whole country. The same thing applies to countries like Sweden who never shut down their country at all, never had any or very minor sorts of restrictions on freedoms and are doing just fine. Meanwhile countries like Israel and Ireland with some of the highest vaccination rates in the world also now have the highest rates of active cases and hospitalizations.
You also seem to totally ignore how money is actually the root of all this around the world, where big pharma is bringing in billions per month while conveniently providing false claims about the efficacy of a barely tested experimental procedure that turns out isn't very good at all is now on it's third jab and being forced on children now who don't need it. Now this booster hasn't even been changed to address this oh so scary delta variant for some odd reason and they've even cut the dosage in half, no doubt to try and mitigate the side effects and calm the waters.
One last question for you. Now that big pharma has turned the narrative again all around the world it seems, to now proclaim that booster shots are necessary to be considered fully vaxxed, so for employment, travel and all the normal things we used to do without having to provide ID and QR codes and private medical info under the guise of spreading the virus. It's an admitted fact that these vaccine's efficacy have so far proved to be poor after 6 months, yet now they want you to get another shot of the same thing but in a smaller dose that may not even last as long as the bigger dose. So I'm just curious as to how many shots of an experimental invasion of your body you are going to keep lining up for before you finally wake up and start to at least question what's really going on. Will it be #4 in midsummer when the first booster fails again or #5 six months later as Pfizer laughs all the way to the bank?
Lastly, again maybe I missed a post where you mentioned it before, but does your obvious support for these measures also apply to the millions of people who have developed a far superior natural immunity to covid that also naturally works on variants, this from often just getting over mild symptoms. Or does that not matter to you, everyone must get jabbed, and again too if they say so. Just wondering
Cheers

---

Smitty, to answer your questions ... and I'll keep it short:

(1) I do believe the vaccine was inadequately tested ... I've said that many times ... and that is why I believe getting the vaccine should be a choice (which I've said here probably 20 times). So I am not denying anything. In fact, I'd say I have a balanced view. You see, I'm reacting to those who completely dismiss the danger of COVID, insinuating or outright saying it's no more than just the sniffles. That is pure BS. I'm looking for truth ... COVID is nasty, the vaccine does work to reduce ICU cases, the vaccine does have side effects. That's my stance! We say the vaccine has more injuries from side effects than COVID deaths ... well, here's a question for you. What IF the vaccine is working? What would the deaths be like if 90% of Ontario didn't have the vaxx? Are you comparing to the number of COVID deaths taking benefit of the stats AFTER vaccination ... or are you trying to pro-rata what it would be right now (with businesses all open) without the vaxx?

(2) I do not ignore that money is behind much of this ... I stated at least two times ... if you guys want to look at a conspiracy theory that isn't the same level of BS as the government is trying to kill half the world population ... it's money. Of course there's money behind this! That's why I think the vaxx testing was inadequate ... because it was a race to get out first ... and Pfizer and Moderna won that race! But that doesn't mean the vaccine doesn't work! It means those two were the first to put out something that does work ... but not without risk of side effects! I'm fully aware of that!

(3) Look at my point (1) ... getting the vaccine should be a personal choice in my opinion ... I believe it works, and I am not as nervous about the side effects as 10% of the eligible population in Ontario is. In the end, all I care about is that our already frail medical system does not get crushed by COVID ... which I believe it is susceptible too. If people are naturally immune, EXCELLENT! Because that means those people aren't going to ICU if they get COVID. That has always been my concern ... it's simple actually ... allow us to manage with our frail medical system, by controlling the number of ICU cases. Vaccine appears to help, but it's not the only way ... and that's fine ... if we want to talk about doing anti-body tests ... I think that is WAY smarter and better than a COVID Vaccine Passport!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by impact

Your not very good at this, are you.
Recycling the same meaningless stats.


https://i.imgur.com/NyGPPPR.png

---

You're not very good trusting the numbers on our government websites are you.
Instead you believe the propaganda BS you read from anywhere. That's where I think
you guys are also sheeps ... you listen to your version of BS. Someone just has to put a table
together, on colored paper ... and as long as it suits your opinion ... it must be right, right???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MikePal

And yet ...the zealots are scrambling to inject THAT into their kids.....really makes one shake their heads...

---

Have you ever had any kind of medicine, shot, vaccine ... anything?

I'll just leave this here ... and by the way this echos exactly what my close contact doctor friend says, who interfaces with COVID care.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-wearing-thin

I believe this is a good balanced perspective.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

I'll just leave this here ... and by the way this echos exactly what my close contact doctor friend says, who interfaces with COVID care.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-wearing-thin

I believe this is a good balanced perspective.

---

That's interesting prospective,
Should the citizens who pay anonymous so-called doctor salary also stop paying taxes from this good balanced prospective?

Cuz if we go all way, let's go all the way.
It's not very balanced if it didn't consider any other angles of the issue

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Any of these doctors patience ever run thin with all the drug addicts and fat slobs they had to treat over the years?

What about gang bangers that have bullet holes in them from fighting over drug territory?

Or is that different?

Any time I've been to the hospital in my 34 years on this earth it's completely packed, everytime. Waited 8hrs in ER waiting room with a collapsed lung with pneumonia last time I was there 15 years ago. Havnt been back since, Hell my health card expired 2 years ago, Don't plan on going back.

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In the USA and Germany, high-level officials have used the term pandemic of the unvaccinated, suggesting that people who have been vaccinated are not relevant in the epidemiology of COVID-19. Officials’ use of this phrase might have encouraged one scientist to claim that “the unvaccinated threaten the vaccinated for COVID-19”. But this view is far too simple.

There is increasing evidence that vaccinated individuals continue to have a relevant role in transmission. In Massachusetts, USA, a total of 469 new COVID-19 cases were detected during various events in July, 2021, and 346 (74%) of these cases were in people who were fully or partly vaccinated, 274 (79%) of whom were symptomatic. Cycle threshold values were similarly low between people who were fully vaccinated (median 22·8) and people who were unvaccinated, not fully vaccinated, or whose vaccination status was unknown (median 21·5), indicating a high viral load even among people who were fully vaccinated.

In the USA, a total of 10 262 COVID-19 cases were reported in vaccinated people by April 30, 2021, of whom 2725 (26·6%) were asymptomatic, 995 (9·7%) were hospitalised, and 160 (1·6%) died. In Germany, 55·4% of symptomatic COVID-19 cases in patients aged 60 years or older were in fully vaccinated individuals, and this proportion is increasing each week. In Münster, Germany, new cases of COVID-19 occurred in at least 85 (22%) of 380 people who were fully vaccinated or who had recovered from COVID-19 and who attended a nightclub.

People who are vaccinated have a lower risk of severe disease but are still a relevant part of the pandemic. It is therefore wrong and dangerous to speak of a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Historically, both the USA and Germany have engendered negative experiences by stigmatising parts of the population for their skin colour or religion. I call on high-level officials and scientists to stop the inappropriate stigmatisation of unvaccinated people, who include our patients, colleagues, and other fellow citizens, and to put extra effort into bringing society together.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...KHDyY0StRHrbPk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

I'll just leave this here ... and by the way this echos exactly what my close contact doctor friend says, who interfaces with COVID care.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-wearing-thin

I believe this is a good balanced perspective.

---

That's the People's choice to inject what ever into them.

Doctors have jobs that's their job seems like they wanted to ban guns to because they were tired of gun shot victims.

Maybe we should have Banned all guns because they keep the doctors busy with bullet wounds.

The problem lays with the overwhelmed hospitals they have also chosen not to fix that problem.



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Senior BBC reporter Rich Preston

https://i.imgur.com/m01gkoK.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SongDog

Any of these doctors patience ever run thin with all the drug addicts and fat slobs they had to treat over the years?

What about gang bangers that have bullet holes in them from fighting over drug territory?

Or is that different?

Any time I've been to the hospital in my 34 years on this earth it's completely packed, everytime. Waited 8hrs in ER waiting room with a collapsed lung with pneumonia last time I was there 15 years ago. Havnt been back since, Hell my health card expired 2 years ago, Don't plan on going back.

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---

So you're putting the non-vaccinated in the same group as drug addicts, fat slobs, and gangsters ... okay, got it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by newbiehunter

That's interesting prospective,
Should the citizens who pay anonymous so-called doctor salary also stop paying taxes from this good balanced prospective?

Cuz if we go all way, let's go all the way.
It's not very balanced if it didn't consider any other angles of the issue

Sent from my moto g(8) power using Tapatalk

---

You know what's probably wearing him thin??
All these COVID deniers ... that end up in hospital, and then realize the mistake they made when they are busy dying on an ICU bed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

So you're putting the non-vaccinated in the same group as drug addicts, fat slobs, and gangsters ... okay, got it.

---

Well that's their job to treat people it doesn't matter what it's from.
Are they not tired of the vaccine side effects that are leaving hundreds of people per week to seek medical attention?.

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Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

So you're putting the non-vaccinated in the same group as drug addicts, fat slobs, and gangsters ... okay, got it.

---

MArkB actually you are the one who started "segrating" non-vaxxed with your running out of patience comment..so SongDog made a simple comparison which I totally agree with when the holier than thou comment comes out about non-vaxxed shouldnt receive hospital care..

maybe soon enough you will see just how well vaccines are working in Ontario...check out how theyre doing in europe where lockdowns are coming..

just use google and type in gibraltar covid....
March 18 2021 - Gibraltar is first nation to vaccinate entire adult population
April 27 - What Life Is Like in a Fully Vaccinated Country
6 days ago - 118% vaccinated Gibraltar cancels Christmas over new COVID-19 spike

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MarkB

You know what's probably wearing him thin??
All these COVID deniers ... that end up in hospital, and then realize the mistake they made when they are busy dying on an ICU bed.

---

Pardon, but that does not answer my question..

I clearly understand what's "wearing him thin"
My question was in regards to his salary. He is not working for his private business is employed and paid from public budget.

Amd the irony of situation is those COVID deniers tend to share icu beds with those who were the first to line up for vaccine,
Which again brings us to square one of conversation




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Quote:

---

Originally Posted by fishfood

Well that's their job to treat people it doesn't matter what it's from.
Are they not tired of the vaccine side effects that are leaving hundreds of people per week to seek medical attention?.

Sent from my CLT-L04 using Tapatalk

---

Do the majority (>90%) of drug addicts deny that the drugs are killing him/her?
Do the majority (>90%) of alcoholics deny that the alcohol is killing him/her?
Do the majority (>90%) of the obese deny that their diet is killing him/her?

Sure they may ignore those risks, and continue to do what hurts them ... but they know it is impacting them.

The difference with COVID, is that the majority of those not taking the vaccine do not think COVID is serious
enough to warrant the risk of taking the vaccine. Then you end up with "COVID is just the sniffles" or "This is
a world plot to kill half the population." They are attempts to make up BS to just put non-vaccine people's minds
at ease. It justifies their opinion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by newbiehunter

Pardon, but that does not answer my question..

I clearly understand what's "wearing him thin"
My question was in regards to his salary. He is not working for his private business is employed and paid from public budget.

Amd the irony of situation is those COVID deniers tend to share icu beds with those who were the first to line up for vaccine,
Which again brings us to square one of conversation




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---

The ICU is full of non-vaxxers who have been in denial of COVID. FULL!
That comes from the mouth of a doctor I know in Ontario ... and they shake their head and
wonder where all the BS that is in their heads comes from. They are in the ICU, gasping for air ...
and then ... they can't even say ... "I told you so" ... because it's not ethical ...

Whether they get a salary from the taxpayer or not ... they are entitled to an opinion, and certainly
have the FULL RIGHT to voice their frustration at the nonsense that non-vaccers base SOME of their
decisions on ... like COVID is just the sniffles. IT'S NONSENSE! And that is what they are saying.

But then I come on here and share these things, and some on here just say the doctor was forced to say
that, or part of some big global conspiracy ... IT'S NONSENSE!

Some data from the UK hospital this past month.

Hard to even take it seriously when everything has a 28 day Timeline. Someone died or was hospitalized 28 days of a positive test lol. Imagine we tested the flu that way too or a cold within 28 days . You would think with such a nasty bug they would take it a bit more serious and stop counting shooting victims, suicide and other deaths that was not related to the actual disease.

33 percent of the people hospitalized are from the unvaccinated the past month from the UK.


https://youtu.be/xGJAH2QvMtE ????

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Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kokes

MArkB actually you are the one who started "segrating" non-vaxxed with your running out of patience comment..so SongDog made a simple comparison which I totally agree with when the holier than thou comment comes out about non-vaxxed shouldnt receive hospital care..

maybe soon enough you will see just how well vaccines are working in Ontario...check out how theyre doing in europe where lockdowns are coming..

just use google and type in gibraltar covid....
March 18 2021 - Gibraltar is first nation to vaccinate entire adult population
April 27 - What Life Is Like in a Fully Vaccinated Country
6 days ago - 118% vaccinated Gibraltar cancels Christmas over new COVID-19 spike

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https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8GfRKnU/