Looking for a hunter with a small male setter

[Cass]

I worked with at risk children and teens for a fair amount of years (though not as many as Sharon) but I do not share the same opinion. Genetics are certainly a factor but parenting or the lack thereof can definitely create the same effects or worse. Anyways back to pointing dogs

[Big Gunner]

Did Big Gunner post a link to a GSP kennel that the moderators removed or am I missing something here ?.

Yes I did. Sawbill removed it and sent me a PM. Something about promoting a breeder. I was unaware sorry.

[vom Dufenshmirtz]

off topic, Sharon..? seriously ? check the title of this thread, LOL it went OT 8 pages ago
and thank you for your insights.

As for the matter at hand - any condition/disease can get overdiagnozed, when you hold a hammer everything looks like a nail;
also the idea that dogs can be diagnosed with AD(H)D is laughable to me, no disrespect YD, but of course I agree there are some crazy ones out there and I literally mean clinically insane. Take for example one 19-th century writer describing his hunting dog, which always acted hyper and ended up killing itself by jumping through a window.

[Sharon]

I would have said the same thing 2 days ago Leon. However, YD peaked my interest so I've been doing some reading. HYperkinesis in dogs appears real.

https://scholar.google.ca/scholar?q=...xGCEUQgQMIGjAA

[krakadawn]

There is certainly much reading to be done on this topic. You might consider:

[COLOR=#001ba0]Overly critical [COLOR=#001ba0]parenting[COLOR=#001ba0] linked with persistent [COLOR=#001ba0]ADHD[COLOR=#001ba0] in ...

[COLOR=#006d21]https://[COLOR=#006d21]www.washingtonpost.com[COLOR=#006d21]/news/to-your-health/wp/2016/02/09/...
In order to characterize a parent's relationship with a ... is a really bad ... there were some children with critical parents who saw their ADHD symptoms ...


Vom...I tend to agree with you that considering ADHD is not how we should be viewing our dogs. I believe certain breeding programs have created some traits that we consider unacceptable with our dogs. My ice breaker from this morning is in his usual spot listening to a good movie tonight. He is not ransacking the house or moving from room to room like he's wired!

High prey drive and the ability to be a strong partner are not mutually exclusive. Those are two of the most important traits with our retrievers.
Simply put it can be very difficult to have tremendous drive all the while being prepared to work closely with the dog's handler. The dog has to be prepared to work with me and trust 'that father knows best' where the bird is...not where he thinks it is.

Strong basics for both children and dogs pay off in future success.

[Jakezilla]

YD, what does the breeder think of the ADHD diagnosis?

[krakadawn]

It may be laughable to you but until you live with a dog and work with a dog that does have this it changes the game plan. I just figured it was the breed in general and worked with her as well as 2 pro trainers who were completely baffled by her behavior. I have always had an open mind mainly because I am curious by nature and try to get to the bottom of things. By sluffing it off doesn't solve her issue especially since all training tactics were applied. I felt I had an obligation to try and give her the best quality of life possible. What surprised me most how many people in the dog world especially the seasoned trainers were not aware of the of the possibility or laughed it off. I happen to come across one individual trainer breeder that had a wealth of first hand knowledge on the subject. It was a complete game changer !
I knew early on that something seemed off and actually kept a diary on my computer outlining the issues along the way since since she was a pup until now. So all in all I took the most correct course of action from the beginning with her training which led to two pro trainers over the last few years until finally having it solved. I am extremely happy with the outcome and do not loose sleep if others who have not experienced EXACTLY the same behavior do not believe me that it is possible. In my opinion her current behavior is proof enough for me. My eyes have been opened to issues that have been ignored(out of ignorance) that are starting to appear when people ignore certain behavior traits and allowing them to be part of a breeding program. And sometimes a breeding on paper do not always work out. I am not blaming anyone.

YD, I certainly would never consider this a laughable situation. I have seen other high need dogs and regardless of the cause I see the exhibited behaviours. Like children they may exhibit certain symptoms that are common to a diagnosis but whether I would use a certain label remains to be seen.

I know many professional trainers and has been said already there can be a huge variety in approaches and skills and education amongst them. The issue for you is that you found someone to help...exactly what you would want.

Is your dog on meds of any type? what's the dosage and application.

As far as the comment about 'breedings on paper'....guess we'd need a crystal ball to go along with the plans to be truly successful but they do afford a strong correlation for what we are looking for.

[Jakezilla]

Let's not hide behind PM's. I am just curious, as I am sure others are, about what the breeder said when you told him that he bred a dog that can't be trained without medication.

I have seen dogs that aren't smart enough to be trained or don't have the drive to carry them through the training process but I have never seen one that had too much energy or drive.

[vom Dufenshmirtz]

[COLOR=#333333]many people in the dog world especially the seasoned trainers were not aware of the of the possibility or laughed it off

I am not a seasoned trainer, so pls don't make me part of the statistics
OTOH, IMHO, dogs that don't fit into the mold are often declared 'untrainable' and discarded (in the old days it meant a bullet, now it's off to a "loving home" or a pound). I am glad for you and your pooch, that you figured it out.

[sidelock]

"Father knows best where the bird is, not where he thinks he is" With all due respect I totally disagree with that statement. If that was the case, what's the use of having a dog. I'm from a different school and believe that the dog should take you to the birds not the other way around.