Some chatter on new gun bill

[LoR]

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[Gun Nut]

What, are no gangs made up of those born and bred here? When they are born here, (many 3rd, 4th generations), immigration discussions are redundant. If they are Canadian , they are 'us' , therefore we cannot blame it on 'others'.... Fix the root problems, no one (race), is born 'bad'.

Well Fishermccan, Just what exactly do you see as the root problems? I always find when individual attempt to establish what the root problems are they merely end up chipping away at the edges. For example John Tory sees the root problem to be, that there are too many handguns in Toronto. His fix is to have something done to reduce the number of handguns. I might suggest to John Tory that Toronto’s root problem is it has too many people within its confinements. As a consequence, it has reached a point where they are getting unto one another nerves. So what do you suppose is an easier fix, get rid of handguns or tackling an overpopulation crisis.


Ethnic differences equally play a role. I found it interesting to learn that when Europeans came to the Americas. A Papal Bull was issued to proclaim that the indigenous people of Americas, were little more than heathen savages unworthy of having any claim to so rich a land. They would not adopt the European ideas of progress and industry. In fact being hunter gathers they thought the European were crazy working their backsides off to clear the land for agriculture in order to amass wealth. They hunted and fish to put food on the fire and used the hides of animals to build lodges. In them they could rest until there was a need to once again hunt. They would not be assimilated and overtime they were pushed into the back water and placed on reservation. Their pristine wilderness gave way Toronto and other concrete jungles. The root of their problems was a relentless European migration and population expansion. When are we going to come to the realization that the cup is full to overflowing ?


You don’t stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut

[welsh]

... what I don,t see you doing is suggesting concrete solutions.

You probably will not have any because I do not think you know what or who they are or how to deal with them.IMHO

Let's be honest: we can't arrest our way out of this. That's nothing but an endless game of whack-a-mole.

There is no single solution. Neither is this a local problem that can be clearly understood by walking a beat in Regent Park. This is a complex, international problem. The root cause here is drug prohibition. But gangs will continue to exist regardless of drug policy, as long as there are black markets to trade in.

I'm not going to claim I have the answers. We've been struggling with this for 50 years. It takes a real ego to walk in and declare one knows the solution.

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[Gun Nut]

"THE CANADIAN PRESS - Gun violence a 'significant concern': Blair
In the wake of a deadly shooting in Toronto last month, Toronto city council passed a motion urging the federal government allow the city to forbid the sale of handguns in the city and for the province to outlaw the sale of handgun ammunition within city limits."

It is called one dimensional thinking. It will prove to be an inconvenience for law abiding individuals who will have to go elsewhere to buy their firearms and ammunition. However, the underground marketeers will not be affected, in fact it might even encourage the marketeers to further expand their operation, as legal distribution is eliminated. It was this type of thinking which was set in motion by the Firearm Act, that in the late 90's, lead to the closures of a number of legal firearm distributors, and opened the door for the underground marketeers to move into Toronto and create the current problem. I hate to say it, but back then, the gun lobby pointed out that this could be a likely outcome.

You don’t stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut

[Gun Nut]

[Premier Doug Ford opposes ban on handgun sales in Toronto - torontostar.com
Premier Doug Ford says he is against a council-requested ban on the sale of handguns and their ammunition within Toronto’s boundaries.
“I wouldn’t support a ban on handguns,” Ford said Thursday. “There’s a lot of legal, responsible handgun owners.”
“We have to refocus all our resources going after the bad guys, not the good guys.”]

There is nothing dumb-a** about this guy he see the situation for what it is. To bad those other brainless wonders can’t see things with the same clarity. Going after the good guys won’t solve their dilemma.

You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut

[trimmer21]

[Premier Doug Ford opposes ban on handgun sales in Toronto - torontostar.com
Premier Doug Ford says he is against a council-requested ban on the sale of handguns and their ammunition within Toronto’s boundaries.
“I wouldn’t support a ban on handguns,” Ford said Thursday. “There’s a lot of legal, responsible handgun owners.”
“We have to refocus all our resources going after the bad guys, not the good guys.”]

There is nothing dumb-a** about this guy he see the situation for what it is. To bad those other brainless wonders can’t see things with the same clarity. Going after the good guys won’t solve their dilemma.

You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut

Yep,he got my attention with that. Points simply put completely confounds Liberal gun grabbers when they're undisputable. That comment was right up there with my favorite---"Blaming guns for crime is like blaming forks because you're fat."

[Gilroy]

Let's be honest: we can't arrest our way out of this. That's nothing but an endless game of whack-a-mole.

There is no single solution. Neither is this a local problem that can be clearly understood by walking a beat in Regent Park. This is a complex, international problem. The root cause here is drug prohibition. But gangs will continue to exist regardless of drug policy, as long as there are black markets to trade in.

I'm not going to claim I have the answers. We've been struggling with this for 50 years. It takes a real ego to walk in and declare one knows the solution.

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Welsh,

I can assure you that you can arrest your way out of this situation but the weak link is Judges granting immediate bail to repeat and none repeat offenders.

The big problem in Toronto is that the police do not know who to arrest, everybody is driving around housing projects and not walking in them.I know times have changed,the bad guys use technology to their advantage and operate different from 15 years ago BUT career criminals are just like anyone else,they have to sleep some where,drive some sort of car,visit certain people and so forth,this is not rocket science.You need boots on the ground,invested over a LONG time and with the right type of officers.An officer cannot be in a 1 square mile housing complex 10 hours a day, 5 days a week and not get to know SOMETHING.The police management have to ORDER this type of detail and should get results.Even if its prevention of a shooting,that is a result,its measurable.If your locked up for 4 years for using a handgun in the commission of an indictable offence,your not able to shoot anyone for at least 4 years.You also probably will be inclined not to carry if/when you get out.

[welsh]

While I agree that boots on the ground are much better than cops driving through in cruisers, arresting our way out of it hasn't worked in other cities.

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[Gun Nut]

TODAY'S QUESTION (Today’s August 10th, CTV News Question)
Which is a better strategy to fight gun crime?
Handgun ban

2159 (34 %)
Boost law enforcement

4237 (66 %)
Total number of votes: 6396

The scary thing about the responds is that 1/3 of those answering see the availability of guns as a bigger problem, than a failure of law enforcement to have the resources necessary to adequately deal with bad guys, committing gun crimes. I suppose if I was a bad guy, it would make good sense to vote for a Handgun ban, that way there might be fewer handguns out there to worry about as I carry on business as usual. Go figure!

You don’t stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut.

[terrym]

Handgun bans target law abiding citizens. Might as well ban alcohol as it wrecks lives and kills more people every year. I mean, this is about saving lives not anti gun ideology right...........right.